WWYD - friendship thing

[Morecheesegrommet]

Alison and Barbara meet at a business event a long way from Barbara’s home town. Turns out Alison is moving to Barbara’s home town, so Barbara meets Alison for coffee, introduces Alison to her friends, invites on her on girls’ weekends away, etc. Barbara also helps Alison make business connections as they both work in the same field. Claire – a close friend of Barbara’s – makes friends with Alison through Barbara and the 3 couples meet regularly as the DHs also get on well.
A few years down the line, Alison starts to be cold towards Barbara who picks up on it. Eventually Barbara sends Alison an email saying she had noticed there was something wrong and asking if they could sort it out. Alison responds with a long email accusing Barbara of various (untrue) stuff and ends the friendship.
Claire decides not to get involved because she feels it is nothing to do with her. She continues her close friendship with Alison. Barbara is hurt by this – she thinks friends should stick up for each other when it gets tough – so she decides to minimise contact with Claire so she can move on and forget the whole thing. Claire wants to be friends with both Alison and Barbara because she didn’t cause or contribute to the argument - so she thinks Barbara is being unreasonable to back away from their friendship.
So who is BU – Barbara or Claire? What would you want your friends to do in this situation?

Barbara is being unreasonable to throw away a friendship over a difference of views. You can't demand that someone chooses like that - it's really unfair. (I don't even think you can really demand that of a partner, tbh). At the same time, you can't expect the friendship to go on as before - it moves into a new phase. Not necessarily worse, but different.

Barbara is hurt that Claire does not defend her to Allison who is telling lies about her.

Barbara has always been a good friend to Allison and Allison repays her friendship with lies that hit at her very character, which hurts deeply. Barbara is then surprised and hurt that Claire is not moved to defend her in any way, as it seems she is ok with Allison's lies about Barbara as long as she herself doesn't suffer in any way. Claire is a coward and not a friend at all.

Claire is concerned about herself and not about how Barbara feels. Claire thinks it's perfectly reasonable for Barbara to get over the fact that she, Claire, didn't stand up for her and just carry on as before. "Too bad, so sad" is Claire's motto.

That's it in a nutshell.

If Allison is telling lies about Barbara, then of course the mutual friend should stand up and say so.

That being said, none of us here know what is exactly going on. It could be as OP describes, or it could be the opposite, that Allison's accusation of what Barbara did is true, and it is Barbara who is not admitting she's done wrong and is claiming that Allison is the liar. And Claire may not know who is telling the truth.

So, we need more context. OP could tell us what Allison's email said and what the whole thing is about and we could weigh this problem much more accurately. The total lack of any specificity does not allow us to make a judgment for either Barbara or Allison, let alone Claire.

Sadly, Ladies, I do not have a copy of the email so I can't post it.
But I have read it and I do know that there were big fat lies in there and huge distortions of the truth.
I'm not really interested in an assessment of the overall situation because I know for a fact that Alison was out of order. My interest is in understanding whether Claire or Babs is BU - or both?
LittleBeautyBelle - that is exactly how Babs feels.

In response to what it was about - the email had a long list of things Babs had done wrong. Some personal, some work related, some lies, some twisting the truth. It was a full blown character assassination of the worst sort interlinked with a list of demands about what Alison required from her friends and how Babs had failed to deliver. It was epic - a work of art in its own twisted way.

If Friend A accused me of lots of untrue stuff, I would expect Friend B to stick up for me and to think that Friend A is not to be trusted.

Although Claire doesn't want to be involved, if I was aware that a mutual friend was capable of being so directly vindictive and mean, writing something like what Op has described, I would become very wary of that person and probably at least consider cooling the friendship. If I additionally knew it was all unfounded, I'd worry that mutual friend might have slightly lost touch with reality as well!

In the past, I've come to the realisation that certain friends were bad news and bringing me down. I just distanced myself whilst remaining civil. I think it's incredibly cruel to do what Alison did.

Claire is bu, imo. I wonder that she didn't reassess Alison's character?

If they had just fallen out over some general disagreement then Barabara would be unreasonable to expect Claire to take sides. But lying is a different matter.

I've been Claire, although in my situation I knew Alison first, then Barbara. But on discovering that Alison was lying, I most definitely backed up Barbara.

I hate liars, and cannot imagine how anyone can stand by and let someone fib about a friend. I could never view Alison in the same way again, and wondered what, if anything, she said about me (lies galore, I later found out). But even before finding out what was said about me, I had completely lost respect for her, quickly followed by my regard.

Claire is BU to condone Alison lying about Barbara.

I think that someone should challenge Alison and her version of events. But I'm not clear from your OP who would be best placed to do that. It is one thing to end a friendship, but quite another to damage somebody's reputation by lying about them.

Is Claire definitely fully aware of the horrid content of the email?
If she is, then I think she's disloyal and has very low standards to tolerate such behaviour, and I would cool the friendship too if I were Babs. If she isn't, I think she should be made aware.

The thing is, you are seeing all this from babs side. The truth might actually be more fuzzy and balanced. Alison actually probably isn't pure evil. How do you truely know how barb treated Alison and how Alison felt things? It's easy to paint barb as the hard done to victim but I don't believe for a second it's that clear cut.

It's fine for Clare not to be involved in the tittle tattle. Neither women needs someone to have thier back. Clare seems capable of supporting both women without taking sides.

Unless the issue centred on something expressly bad (physical abuse or bank theft maybe), I think Clare should be able to be friends with who ever she likes. The women involved are not 8. They are not in the playground.

Obviously I expect Clare will be taking this all in. Alison's upset and barbs immaturity. Clare will be making up her own mind about things. She is her own person.

Has Clare read the letter?

Also I would be asking what else is going on in Alison's life if barb feels the letter is over the top. Why is she feeling so much upset about Barb. Are there things going on that only Clare knows about which would explain her stance/more compassionate approach to both women.

A long time ago, a very nice/close dating couple split and one wanted me to choose which one I was to be friends with. I refused to choose as I liked them both and was able to support both. I never slagged anyone off and listened a lot. However, this wasn't good enough for the woman and she broke our friendship. Which was a loss but 100% her choice.

Funny how it's aaaalways the fly-in that causes these sorts of splits and problems.

Everyone was toddling along just fine, until...

Saxons - no Claire did not see the email. So she has to take Babs' word for what has happened. And to be fair, until this happened, Alison gave the appearance of being totally normal and reliable. On the other hand, Claire and Babs have been friends for years - if Claire does not trust what Babs says by now then its not much of a friendship. Of course there is much more background, but Babs feels she has earned Claire's trust many times over.
I have no idea if Alison and Claire have discussed any of this so do not know what was said.

Why should Claire just take Babs at her word? All interactions are seen differently from different perspectives and if Alison doesn't have history as a drama queen or a trouble maker then there's possibly something going on either with her or between her and Babs that others don't know about.

OP: Have you asked Alison for her perspective on events?

Not convinced Alison is the total bitch but if she is and Barbara has stepped away then she'll need another victim so Claire will need to watch her back in time to come.

I don't think Barbara can continue the friendship with C as previous as may think C is telling A stuff about B even if it's innocently done. They can have a friendship but it's bound to be different.

C cannot win in this really.

Is A a 'Wendy?' Though taken several years to show her true colours if she is.

I'm in a situation like this where I'm 'Barbara' and although still friends with 'Claire' it has affected our friendship and we don't see each other as often, mainly because she insists on inviting ' along as well quite often, seemingly oblivious of the tension / how vile she is around me (It doesn't help that Claire married my ex boyfriend either awkward!!) but in a way I do admire Claire for deciding she enjoyed both friendships and wasn't going to let us falling out ruin it for her.

Sorry, that should say insists on inviting Alison!

I have been Claire. The reason I didn't take sides was in my opinion. Both had done stuff wrong.

Op if you are not Barbara, you don't exactly what is true and what's not. Unless you are with her all the time.

Tbh Claire would best ditching both Barbara and Alison (which is what I did in the end) for acting like school children. Especially if she suspects there is wrong on both sides.

Of course Clarke may enjoy the drama too.

Claire has been dragged into the middle of an argument between 2 friends. Knowing someone longer doesn't always make you better friends.

Claire is saying that it is OK for Alison to treat Barbara like crap

No, Claire is sensibly acknowledging that she doesn't really know what went on between Alison and Barbara - she is probably being told different things by different people.

Claire is optimistically hoping that somehow both her friends are good people who just had a misunderstanding, or pessimistically waiting for whichever one is a bitch to show their true colours when she can see them.

And I have been Barbara too.

I didn't even speak to Claire about it. I recognised that while Alison had been horrible to me, that she was a good friend to Claire. I did worry that Claire would be the next victim but it hasn't happened yet.

I've been 'Barbara' before. And although I was initally hurt that the several 'Claires' I was friends with also maintained their friendship with 'Alison', Alison lost the plot several months later and screamed and abused them in public over other issues i believe (apparently Alison was posessive, and was unhappy they were friends with me still). Cue the 'Claires' ending their friendship with Alison.

One of the 'Claires' told me our 'Alison' kept talking and asking about me, and was a bit put out I never spoke of her during those few months they were friends with us both! I told myself early on to take the high road and never spoke of her at all, and that wound her up! (She liked being centre of attention).

I do know Alison through Babs, but not well enough to talk to her about this. Plus, as you can tell from my posts, I believe Babs account of events. She has never done anything remotely along the lines of the claims Alison has made - it would be completely out of character for her.
But I am good friends with Claire too and see that she has been put in a really difficult position. Personally, I think Babs should have shown Claire the email and let her draw her own conclusions.
I think I am coming to the conclusion that neither Babs nor Claire are BU. They are both just doing what they think is right for them individually in a crap situation.

Is A a 'Wendy?' Though taken several years to show her true colours if she is.

I immediately thought 'Wendy!' as well, Pancakeflipper