Housing Benefit suspended:pay rent or do Christmas - can't do both!

[NoMoneyMona]

I had to put in a claim for top up housing benefit as my job contract ended in October. DH works full time but rent is very high (£1200 for a 3 bed) and we have 3 DC.

I have been unable to find another job despite applying for at least 2/3 most days, as many want weekend workers/evenings, and DH works weekends/eves anyway so we would have no childcare.

HB started paying about 3 weeks later and shortly after that they sent a letter asking for more evidence and gave me a month to supply it. Part of the evidence requested was a new child tax credit award showing the new award since I stopped working as amount would increase. I still did not have a new award by the time the month was up (and I forgot to chase them) so I contacted HB the day after the month was up to explain.

They stated, quite correctly I agree, that I should have contacted them within the month they gave so they could give me more time and as I did not contact them, they had suspended my HB and it would 3/4 weeks to reinstate it. The next day, I got the award notice and took it in to them but they insisted that I would be at the back of the 'queue' and they may not get to my claim before Christmas so I may have to wait until January as they close from the 24th Dec to 4th Jan.

That was 3 weeks ago. We have not had any payments since 23rd November. DH got paid today and if we use that for rent next week (and direct debits, normal food), we will not have a penny left. I will have £50 in tax credits to come as well which will not cover many extras. I have not bought anything for DC as I kept putting if off hoping for the claim to be reinstated. When I rang today, they said I would be unlikely to get any money before the 11th January! We have no access to credit.

WWYD? Would I be unreasonable to keep back about half of the rent and pay the rest when the HB restarts which will cover the shortfall?

Goodnight, why do you think that's so implausible? How on earth has anything about what I've written implied any kind of guarantee?

There is nothing anywhere to suggest that the LL is not paying the mortgage. Stop scaremongering.

Hammaconda, you stated, with definite articles, that if the OP doesn't pay her part of the rent, the LL will be in a position to cover the rent. Unless you are, in fact the LL, you can't possibly know that.

Sorry, what definite articles? There's only one isn't there (the)?

Yes, the LL can use other sources of income to cover the mortgage. If mortgage is X and rental income is Y. If X>Y than the LL has to have something in place to pay the remainder of the mortgage.

I've not mentioned anything about the LL being able to cover the rent.

I'm not the LL BTW.

Of course: "other sources"!
Why didn't the OP think of that and just use 'other sources' to pay for the rent and Christmas.
Good idea.

No one can possibly know what the landlords situation really is but given (if the OP is correct) she's not informed the lender she is letting the property, her mortgage is higher than her rent and she's extended her borrowing on the property, it's not unreasonable to consider the fact that the property could get repossessed.

I'm guessing OP isn't coming back but she never did say whether or not the landlord knew she recived HB. I suspect the LL might not know as, given her potentially precarious situation, HB is not a risk many landlords would take.

I also suspect, as a pp said, the money has already been spent and this thread was to appease OP's conscience but it backfired.

This happened to my cousin recently she was waiting for hb to come through in the meantime the ll got behind with her mortgage payments, house repossessed cousin now in temporary housing. It took weeks only.

Hamma: "definite articles" was some weird autocorrect, but I was trying to say you were stating definitively that LL could cover OP's part of the rent if OP paid late. Now you're saying that I've misunderstood and that you meant the LL could cover the mortgage even though the OP 's rent doesn't cover it. Since no one has even said that the LL will have a problem covering the existing situation, where OP pays part of the mortgage and the LL pays the rest, I'm not sure why you posted what you posted. It looks like you've misunderstood what the rest of us are saying.

No some people stated earlier in the thread that they believed the LL couldn't cover the mortgage. I haven't misunderstood what the 'rest of you'. Don't patronise me.

I haven't misunderstood what the 'rest of you' *were saying. DD editing my post with random keyboard bashes.

I didn't see that anywhere. Rude.

I can be so slow! Of course it makes sense OP has already spent the money!

Also if ll misses mortgage payment because of rent not paid, if mortgage company then discovers as a result that the property was let against the terms of the mortgage agreement I imagine a repossession would be even quicker!

exactly why I wouldn't rent my place out to anyone on housing benifit!!

M1nnie as has been said several times upthread not all hb recipients are like this there are also non HB recipients like this. In fact if you have a HB tenant who is problematic paying their rent you can arrange with council for HB to be paid directly to ll.

I've been a HB recipient for 13 years never late once!

But you're relying on the system to work and clearly in a lot of cases it doesn't!

Neither does capitalism! Lots of people getting made redundant. Thus they have no money to pay rent.

Lots of horrible and unhelpful comments from people on here. The tax credits letter should have been passed to the housing dept without the Op having to get involved. The housing just have to ask tax credits to pass the info on to them and I'm sure it should have been done automatically anyway if there was a change in the Ops tax credit award. I don't see how any of that is her fault. However, things never seem to run smoothly where these departments are concerned and simple things can take forever to sort out with every person you speak to giving you a totally different answer.

I once called a housing dept to try and help a friend and was shouted at by a person on the phone demanding to know where I got the number from as it was apparently only given out in certain cases or something. I said it was in the yellow pages (it was) and he called me a liar and so on and really went mad at me! I hung up and called back and spoke to someone else and told them what he had said and she couldn't quite believe it!

I don't know what the answer is Op. I can understand you wanting to hold back a few hundred pounds, not to fritter away on loads of presents but to make sure you have money to buy food, pay utility bills in case the rent money takes a long time to be sorted out. I think people on here saying unkind things have not understood/read properly what you wrote and also have no idea what its like to be in your situation.

I wish you luck and hope you manage to get things sorted quickly, maybe ask the housing why they didn't automatically receive the tax credit award in the first place?

OP, as many others have said, you HAVE to pay your rent first. If you have the full amount, pay it and be glad that you have been able to.

Keeping a roof over your children's heads and making sure you have good references from your landlord is the best thing you can do for them in this situation. No Lego toy or roast dinner is worth that kind of jeopardy. You have to think of the long term situation.

Asking for money off your rent should be the absolute last resort if you have zero money and no reasonably safe way to borrow it. This applies even more if you don't have a good relationship with your landlord. Clearly your LL is not in a position to give you any leeway.

We have been in awful financial situations for a few years now due to serious illness but have never been behind on rent because we know that it would jeopardise our references and make it so much harder to rent in the future. We lived on baked beans and toast for a year and have borrowed (good credit due to good money management and no unecessary spending) to pay the rent before eventually getting the necessary benefits to get ourselves on a better footing.

Having bad references from LLs is so dangerous, more so than debt sometimes. You NEED to have somewhere to live and I know from experience how hard it is to be housed by the council (we aren't).

Contemplating allowing yourself to get behind on rent for the sake of Christmas presents is exactly the mentality that gives those on benefits a bad name and ruins it for the rest of us who struggling but are more financially responsible. I beg you to see sense and stop being resentful about skipping a few presents.

Your children will forget what toy they did or didn't get this Christmas but, they will grow up being proud that their mum is so responsible and brilliant at keeeping them safe with a roof over their heads in the hardest of circumstances. That lesson they will never forget and will thank you for forever.

I should say that the living on baked beans was almost exclusive for one year, as it was our worst! But have struggled with low income and renting for a good few years but still thankfully have never been behind on rent, and put paying it before everything else.

Rent always comes first. The OP even says that she is only living there because there is nothing else available in her area. Knowing that there is nothing else available surely means that you do everything you can to maintain your tenancy and avoid eviction when the initial tenancy period comes to an end. May might seem a long way off but it won't seem so far if the landlord served notice and you can't find anywhere else to live (which is extra hard if you are entitied to HB).
I'm actually shocked that somebody who can't pay their rent, even if it's only temporary, would think its okay to spend £600 on Christmas. As others have said, the maximum required for Xmas is £200 so you should try to negotiate that with your landlord and if he refuses then you should pay the entire rent (as it sounds like you could afford To do so if you don't buy any presents).

And please don't state that landlords should have a contingency fund when you don't have one yourself.

Lots of horrible and unhelpful comments from people on here.

The OP has been sweetness and light of course and has said some really lovely things about their landlord

I think people on here saying unkind things have not understood/read properly what you wrote and also have no idea what its like to be in your situation.

Many have as has been said on the thread.

Maybe those that have been 'unkind' have taken their lead from the OP posts......

Goodness me, you have to get advice for something as obvious as paying rent on time? Don't buy into the myth of having to have a traditional Christmas.

IT IS A NO BRAINER- of course you pay your rent. If you knowingly not pay your rent when you know your landlord is reliant on the money for the mortgage - then it it completely reprehensible on your part. It is akin to deceit or theft.

Its worse when you think it was partly your own fault for procrastinating on housing benefit in the first place.

What if your Landlord just wants an excuse to get you out? Non-payment is breach of contract - great excuse. Then what have you made for yourself - a bigger mess.

Christmas is just one day. If you don't make a big deal about having a small one with no/minimal gifts then it will be fine. I know I sound abrupt but I do feel for you, I have been there. I have had to 'sacrifice' a traditional Christmas because of lack of funds.

A few years ago, DH was unemployed and our money was down to the wire - we had to make a hard decision not to make any fuss for Christmas. We literally had only £20 left to last til early in the New Year. We didn't even have a turkey, we just had roast chicken and there were no gifts for adults. DS only had two presents - which thankfully we had bought six months previously. His stocking was filled with very cheap stuff from Aldi - about £5 worth. But he loved it.

Grown ups do not NEED gifts. That was the year DH wrote a wonderful poem for me and it is still one of the best gifts ever. DH and I were just reflecting that the time we were really poor/borderline broke were some of the best and fun times - as we got creative.

But you're relying on the system to work and clearly in a lot of cases it doesn't!

It works if you submit the paperwork on time. PPs saying "the system SHOULD work this way" - well, tough shit, it doesn't, so some responsibility is required on your part to make sure your claim is processed correctly. A lot of modern living is red tape and paperwork, so you can whinge about it, or get on with it.

whether the landlord is reliant on the rent or not, the OP did a deal to pay money in return for a house.

do we think the landlord should unilaterally decide not to provide the house while still taking the money? Of course not. So why is the other way acceptable.

no-one needs gifts.

Special subject is absolutely right - the tenancy is a two way agreement and whilst some people think it is okay to withhold part of the rent I don't think anybody would think it is okay for the landlord to end the tenancy early and outside of the tenancy terms. How would OP feel if she only paid the £600 and the landlord decided that she was therefore only entitled to live in half of the house and that he was moving another tenant into the other half?
I could have some sympathy if the OP genuinely didn't have the money and couldn't pay but she has the money and wants to spend it on Christmas instead which really isn't acceptable.