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AIBU?

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Original poster

to think its a disgrace that Cameron is going to stop lifetime council tenancies

685 replies

sparklesandglitterxx · 17/12/2015 09:09

and think that that is NOT the solution to the housing crisis?

the solution as far as i can see it is, lots and lots more council houses need to be built, regulation in private renting needs to be improved, and GENUINELY affordable houses to buy for those on low wages that wish to or are able to buy

fed up of seeing the great things about Britain being chipped away. Why punish renters? The whole Tory attitude towards council housing being a last resort for the destitute disgusts me. council housing needs to be brought back to what it was originally meant for...which is a decent secure home for anyone who wants one. i live on a council estate which is a mix of council, HA and bought. People stay here, they build lives here, generally it is a lovely community. i have never been happier or more settled anywhere i have lived, I have done well in my life and been able to have a big family. my children are happy and thriving at school and have lots of friends. My point is if these changes go through, they will end up DESTROYING communities like ours and so many others. The Tories just seem to want everyone either paying their landlord mates every penny they earn or pushing up house prices by buying. But not everyone wants to buy, and more importantly not everyone CAN buy, (I have friends on good money who are still priced out the market) and hardly anyone would actually CHOOSE to be in insecure, expensive private rented !! I also think that if more people are in secure housing, it will help peoples mental health (hence cutting costs in mental health services), it will improve childrens chances in life, as they wont have to keep moving schools and away from friends etc, it will encourage people to better themselves, it will cut the HB bill, and also with people spending less on their rent they will have more to spend in the economy, thus boosting it!

I also suspect it wont end here....while it will be for new tenants only to start with, i would imagine it will end up being everyone in council / HA

OP posts:
DeoGratias · 19/12/2015 19:24

The tenants get their gas checked. Those of us having to pay our own way often can't afford that. Lucky tenants.

Those people with mortgages or young graduates sleeping on friend's sofa etc don't have housing for life and often have to move for work.

Luckily the state is moving to a better system and I support the Government in this.

Janeymoo50 · 19/12/2015 19:27

Gas Safety Check??? Try living in private rented where your Landlord ignores it for years and being too scared to say something in case he evicts you so I kept quiet and bought a CM detector.

HelenaDove · 19/12/2015 19:30

Yep Lucky tenants.

Copied and pasted from fb.

I've been left with no hot water for a week and a half to be told part would be fitted today ... I then receive a phone call to be told that it won't be fitted as the wrong part has been sent ... I have three young children in my house with water coming through my downstairs ceiling oh and I have also been electrocuted from this... I then phone head office to be told you do have the part but now the office is closed and no one can do it till Monday well here's a big round of applause for the most incompetent company I have ever come across

EssentialHummus · 19/12/2015 19:33

seven - it's not included in the rent, the onus is entirely on the landlord.

www.gassaferegister.co.uk/advice/renting_a_property/for_tenants.aspx

Helena, as before, I think you're aware that you're making a really tenuous point here. And actually, looking at the legislation, all landlords have to do is "ensure" that the check is done. If another gas safe contractor does it, their ass is covered if the worst happens. Which is almost besides the point, since presumably most of the inspections don't require umpteen visits, and are still being done at someone else's expense, for your benefit.

I almost feel like someone will pop up shortly to say, well, when the council replaced my door and windows, there was so much dust.

EssentialHummus · 19/12/2015 19:33

The legislation: www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1998/2451/regulation/36/made

AyeAmarok · 19/12/2015 19:33

HelenaDove, I'd stop now. That is the most ridiculous argument I've heard yet on this thread and you are discrediting yourself with it.

AndNowItsSeven · 19/12/2015 19:38

Deo tenants pay their own way, or has this thread come full circle back to the free houses.
I will say it again the cost of the gas safety check is ADDED ON to the monthly rental charge. It is NOT free.

AndNowItsSeven · 19/12/2015 19:39

Essential yes if you live in a ha property the cost of the gas check is part of the rent.

HelenaDove · 19/12/2015 19:40

I think we are wasting our time here Seven Because clearly those with no experience of HAs have a better idea of how they operate than those who have actually experienced them.

specialsubject · 19/12/2015 19:43

boring facts: eviction of tenants for raising complaints about vital maintenance such as gas safety checks is now definitely outlawed, and with gas safe probably was outlawed for a while. It has been a criminal offence not to have a valid gas safe check for years; and rightly so.

So if you wish to continue living in an unsafe dump, you now can without fear of eviction. The idea of the law is to make the slumlords fix the dumps, but like most crooks they aren't that bothered.

(I know this will produce cries of 'can't afford to go anywhere else' so go ahead)

more boring facts: tenancy agreements cannot override the law. So no-one can be 'compelled to wait in'.

that said, I'm a private landlord, so I do stuff like attending with the gas safe chap and offering to let him in if the tenant cannot be there. The appointment is also arranged by consulting the tenant first. Many of the social housing agencies do seem to be above the law.

EssentialHummus · 19/12/2015 19:44

I'd query that seven - I.e. if it's itemised by name as part of the rent, ask the HA on what grounds they can do it. I've had a genuine rummage around the Internet for this and can't see the legal basis for it being "passed on" to tenants. The broader point can be made that this amount, even if billed, is a drop in the ocean compared to the rental savings gained, but never mind. I think we'd be going round in circles.

AndNowItsSeven · 19/12/2015 19:45

I agree Helena , I have already made sure am I am sat by a wall at all times whilst reading this thread. In order to be ready to bang my head against it when I read the word "subsidised".

AyeAmarok · 19/12/2015 19:46

I think the arguments against reallocating HA properties when people no longer need them (or have as much of a need for them as a young low-income family) seem to be coming from people who don't want to lose theirs and don't accept that they are being subsidised.

Their argument is "we need more social housing so everyone who needs one, gets one".

Which would be great. Except in the areas where there is a horrendous shortage of HA properties (and this allocation by genuine need is necessary), ie London and the South East, and lots of other places, building hundreds of thousands of HA properties is not an option.

It just isn't. There isn't the space. So the scarce resource needs to be allocated by need.

If you are now a higher earner and you don't want to move as you like the security, fine, but pay a fair, non-subsidised rate for it.

AndNowItsSeven · 19/12/2015 19:48

It is listed Essential right above " maintain my stairlift". I am a disabled tenant and have £4 a week added to my rent to cover the cost. I mention it not because I have an issue with paying rather to inform people that social housing does not equal free.

AndNowItsSeven · 19/12/2015 19:51

Aye not in my case, we hope to buy early next year. We currently live in a lovely four bed with two gardens and a drive. Also that all important life time tenancy.

Alfieisnoisy · 19/12/2015 20:28

Some of the posts on this thread seem t ce from home owners able to afford mortgages envying thse who cannot.

Ive been in the position of being a home owner and I aam now in a HA place....its scary how quickly life can change...remember thaat before you envy others.

Personally I have no problems with reassessment afteer five years of a tenancy provided the tenant is compensated for the costs of carpeting etc. Its unikely to fit anywhere else and represents a significant outlay generally.

I will move in the future when I no longer need a second bedroom.I wouldn't ever buy this house even if I could afford to. It was a lifeline to me and shpuld remain so in the futue for another small family.

PausingFlatly · 19/12/2015 20:43

I've never lived in a council or HA house.

I'm not a fan of reallocation purely as income rises.

Because I can see immediately the cans of worms that opens. Massive disincentive to increase income; increased stigmatisation of occupants and resentment, and the loss of more mixed neighbourhoods.

Cameron and Osborne have been very clear that none of this is about caring for the most vulnerable. Not only have they not stopped Right to Buy, but they're trying to extend it from council to HA properties. While exempting pensioners - who are the most common underoccupiers - from the very measures they pretend are to tackle underoccupation.

I don't need to be living in a council house to see that.

Janeymoo50 · 19/12/2015 20:52

Special subject....I wish you had been my landlord.

RapidlyOscillating · 19/12/2015 21:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HelenaDove · 19/12/2015 22:09

Massive disincentive to increase income; increased stigmatisation of occupants and resentment

YY Pausing Flatly. Exactly the same thing that has happened with tax credits.

DeoGratias · 19/12/2015 22:23

"So Deo if one of your employees like your cleaning lady or your gardner couldnt come in for sevreral days in a row due to being COMPELLED by her tenancy agreement to wait in for engineers who dont show you would be ok with that."

I don't have any employees. I do my own gardening. I have a self employed cleaner but she comes when she chooses fitting around other stuff. I don't like to be reliant on others. In fact that is at the heart of the difference between right and left - right cares for others and the less well off by giving them useful tools to enable them to make their own way whilst the left care less for the poor and trap them in poverty through their badly thought out policies. Thankfully we have 5 years of Tory rule, hopefully with 5 more to come after that which might start to put things right and help the less fortunate.

AndNowItsSeven · 19/12/2015 22:39

Deo really you think Tories help the less fortunate? You are either truly ignorant or deliberately goady.

ginorwine · 19/12/2015 22:51

I think they aim to help the less fortunate via a strong economy and to assist independence .however I don't think that they understand done issues around disadvantage - I think some people can use disadvantage as an excuse tho but I think also that Tory rhetoric can fail to understand the consequences of disadvantage .i do think tho that labour and some policies have gone too far and in some it has produced a sense of entitlement .i used to work in a benefit office and was frequently told that I was a mug for working and that they wouldn't get out of bed for my wage .i think the Tories rightly are addressing such views .i think that those views need to be chalkenged whilst supporting folk and encouraging self reliance whilst avoiding being punative .i certainly don't feel tennancy view is punative but is common sense in a world of limited resources .

ginorwine · 19/12/2015 22:52

Review not view

leaningtoweroflego · 19/12/2015 23:23

"I think they aim to help the less fortunate via a strong economy"

Well they're failing in that then, aren't they!

Our debt has risen massively under the Tories. The rich are getting richer and the poorer are getting poorer.

I know the Tories keep banging on about the economy because they think it's a good PR trick that'll win them the next election, but where is your actual evidence that anything the Tories have done has helped "the less fortunate"?

I could go on.

How have they helped anyone "less fortunate"?

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