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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to be quite upset after helping out at DD's school?

74 replies

seamstressmummy · 16/12/2015 17:45

I volunteered to help with the costumes today and I was sitting with the other parents in the infant corridor (it's huge, more like a reception space).

DD's teacher was so shouty :( You could hear her giving the most unclear instructions and then shouting at the children when they didn't complete the task properly (I think it was a sort of colour by number). She was really so unpleasant to hear, I wouldn't have talked to my dog like that.

The other reception class were painting. They split the classes by age and playground gossip says they are a very young class who need a firm hand but their teacher was so firm in the nicest possible way. Listening to her teach was lovely. She was so clear and actually very strict, but in a really positive and gentle way IYKWIM.

I'm so down about DD being with Mrs Shouty :(

OP posts:

Bubbletree4 · 16/12/2015 18:30

I don't know. Dd's teacher shouts quite a lot but actually I can see why. Dd actually said to me that she finds the teacher a bit scary but then I asked her to think about why the teacher was shouting and she was able to come up with several good reasons for the teacher to be cross. Following her actually thinking why the teacher got so cross and shouty, dd now seems to be ok with it. She's only 7 but some of the kids' behaviour is utterly disgraceful and dd can now see this from the teacher's PoV. Not sure if a reception child would be able to consider the teacher's PoV, I can't remember what 4/5 yos are capable of

Mercury1234 · 16/12/2015 18:30

I had exactly the same happen when I started helping out at lunchtime at my DCs primary. My DD's teacher in particular could be heard shouting and being sarcastic and quite catty to the children in her yr6 class where my DD was. I turned a blind eye to it but made sure my DD was happy (and she was) until an incident where DD came home in tears when this teacher decided to punish the 10 or so kids not going to the secondary school that the primary preferred (we have a choice of secondary).

There was a transition event in this secondary where the kids could go and sing. Us 10 or so parents whose kids weren't going to that school refused to sign the consent slip (huge back story as we felt we were being pressurised into sending our kids to this school). This meant the TA had to stay behind to supervise these kids, when the teacher returned she went into the class and bawled out those 10 kids who didn't go all while the other kids stood outside and watched through the glass. My DD absolutely broke down and when she got home from school was still shaking. Some teachers shouldne be allowed to teach IMO, the HT turned a blind eye to it all, it was disgusting. Intervene now before this teacher really oversteps the mark.

MistressMerryWeather · 16/12/2015 18:34

Goblin I don't think OP is talking about a 'raised voice'.

DS1s teacher is loud, she has a big booming voice but she doesn't shout. She was also my teacher in primary school and I don't remember her ever shouting.

I do however have vivid memories of 'The Shouty Teacher', you could hear his screeching across the yard.

He was just a crap teacher and ended up with a terrible reputation.

defineme · 16/12/2015 18:34

licketysplit that's assault and I can't believe you have not said anything. I have taught for many years and never touched a child in anger. Report straight to the head and mention the other time too.

Libitina · 16/12/2015 18:35

Best teacher my son had was his reception class teacher. She never raised her voice. She once reduced him to a sobbing heap by just telling him that she was disappointed in his behaviour (she didn't mean to make him cry btw, she wasn't at all nasty). I saw and heard it happen.

My point is, as you also say OP, you don't need to raise your voice to control a class. I'd raise your concerns with the school.

Original poster

seamstressmummy · 16/12/2015 18:38

It wasn't particularly the volume, because both teachers were loud, but the emotion in her voice which I found quite

OP posts:

ohtheholidays · 16/12/2015 18:39

OP I would say something to the Head.

I've never forgot when I was in Infants school,we had a teacher that seemed to enjoy bullying a few of us,I was one of those she'd taken an instant dislike to.I was only 5 and one day I asked to go to the toilet because I didn't feel well she refused to let me go and two minutes later the Head of our school had come into the class to talk to her about something.She hadn't seen him come into the classroom and was shouting at me and being awful and I was violently sick everywhere so she shouted at me even more.
He was usually useless but he bellowed at her,she turned around and blamed me and said if I'd said I didn't feel well I could have been taken to the toilets,luckily some of my friends were really brave and I think a bit shocked(I had been really really ill every where)and told the Head that I had asked to go to the toilet and she'd said no.

He pulled her up over her behavior and what had happened that day.He told my parents what had happened and what he'd heard had been happening(I never told my parents anything)and from that day on her teaching improved alot and so did our days at school.

She could be ill or struggling,or this could be a one off but if it's not and no one speaks up the problem will never get sorted out as no one will be aware that there is a problem.

Original poster

seamstressmummy · 16/12/2015 18:41

I'm required for a bedtime story- will check back later!

OP posts:

TheNoodlesIncident · 16/12/2015 18:42

after 3 hours of being spoken to by yr9 and yr10's like I am something they wouldn't tread in

This sounds grim but OP's DD is in reception, not Y9/Y10.

If a teacher shouted at my DS like that he would simply shut down. There would be no learning at all. It's counter-productive.

I'm not a shouty mum because it just doesn't work. There are far more effective strategies available.

SunsetDream · 16/12/2015 18:49

I think there are some very idealistic people on this thread.

Show me a parent who never shouts at their children and I'll show you a teacher who never shouts.

Obviously anything too extreme is wrong.

There are 100 reasons why a teacher may be shouty. Not saying it's right.

My year group partner was shouty on Tuesday. Why? Because her head is on the line - the next in a line of expensive older teachers in our school since the new head came. She has a difficult class (think several with extreme special needs involving outside agencies). There is no support for her - she asked for help, but the head started using it as a case against her. SLT won't help her with the behaviour issues (due to the needs of the children, not due to her classroom management skills), they won't help her because they can see she's struggling with them and in their eyes, if she's struggling then she will be sacked soon. She has been part of informal capability procedures. She needs help, but if she asks for it, she will lose her job. Never mind years of exemplary teaching. So, yes, she was shouty. I think she'll be signed off with stress after Christmas.

Obviously no one but the teacher knows why your teacher was shouty, but it's not always as easy as 'a teacher should be able to control, the class'.

Until you have tried it, you cannot pass judgement IMO.

HumphreyCobblers · 16/12/2015 18:54

*Well, go in and show your child's class teacher how to teach without raising your voice.

I am sure she will be delighted.

And you might just discover why she finds it necessary.*

I totally disagree with this. I am a teacher. There is no need to be rude and aggressive with small children (or any children). Shouty teachers should not be tolerated.

HumphreyCobblers · 16/12/2015 18:56

I am not idealistic to say that nasty behaviour from teachers should not be tolerated! I am sorry about the stress level, I DO understand that it is hard. I also understand that there are days when it all gets too much and one gets totally exasperated. But being rude and horrible to children? No excuse at all.

SunsetDream · 16/12/2015 18:56

One afternoon means a shouty teacher?

If everyday, then fair enough, but I don't think an afternoon's snapshot at the end of term is a fair judge of the teacher.

serin · 16/12/2015 18:57

I wish they had video cameras in classrooms.

For everyone's protection.

5inabed · 16/12/2015 18:57

So what if the teacher was having a bad day? That doesn't mean she can take it out on the children! I work in a nursery and have had a few bad days recently due to bereavement I don't take it out on the kids. If you cannot control your temper as a teacher then you are in the wrong profession.

SunsetDream · 16/12/2015 18:58

I agree Humphry. I think this is the wrong place for the teacher to be judged. In school and by other members of staff is fair enough, but on an Internet forum by strangers is not a good place.

MistressMerryWeather · 16/12/2015 18:58

The OP absolutely can pass judgment when it concerns her childs education.

Can you imagine a nurse shouting at her/his patients because of the stresses that come with the job?

There are many children who would simply not cope in a classroom where a teacher shouts all day.

SunsetDream · 16/12/2015 18:59

Humphrey

Branleuse · 16/12/2015 19:01

Teachers are leaving the profession in their droves with the stress theyre under, and its the last few days of term when everyone is even more exhausted.
I think id be inclined to go in again next term and see how it is before making a complaint

Jesabel · 16/12/2015 19:04

I would speak to the Head.

I was a TA with a shouty, aggressive Reception teacher - I complained several times but a parent raising concerns would have been taken more seriously I think.

Yes, we all shout sometimes. But there is a big difference between raising your voice to gain control and being aggressive or nasty to 4 year olds.

lougle · 16/12/2015 19:04

We're all human, of course we are, but you can't excuse aggressive shouting or aggressive behavior. A nurse would (quite rightly) be in huge trouble if they were caught behaving like this. We have patients so confused that they grab and grip their nurse. It's physically and emotionally exhausting to try and meet the needs of those patients, but it's our job. Just as it is frustrating and time consuming to deal with pupils who can't or won't engage, but it's the teacher's job.

caitlinohara · 16/12/2015 19:07

I would see if I could volunteer more often to see whether her manner was typical. Some teachers have different 'styles' and I have come across them all, but I think you are right to be concerned. The school will have a document about behaviour and discipline and it will almost certainly be about positive phrasing. If you can cite policy and then give examples of how it's not being followed you are more likely to be listened to. I hope it was just a 'bad day'.

Piratepete1 · 16/12/2015 19:07

I taught Reception for 10 years and I can honestly say, hand on heart, I never shouted. I was firm yes, particularly at the beginning of the year when boundaries are tested but when you shout you have lost control. There's no need for it. I've had to put my head in the cupboard a few times to calm down but then I'm ok and can approach the situation calmly. Children can push your buttons but a kind, firm, fair approach work best. I never even spoke loudly actually, just waited quietly until everyone was listening as they knew any wasted time would come off playtime. However, when my regular supply teacher came in she was a shouter and the class were like different children- naughty, loud, rude etc. Sometimes you can get into a negative cycle. I would definitely mention it. Maybe she needs some help.

MistressMerryWeather · 16/12/2015 19:09

I have a huge amount of sympathy for teachers and the pressure they are under.

But it seems on every single thread where a teacher is in the wrong there will be someone who comes along and excuse it because of stress.

Stress is not a cop out to behave unprofessionally.

Piratepete1 · 16/12/2015 19:11

And I agree with Serin.- there should be cameras in every classroom and nursery.

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