To think that it IS a *bit* stupid to give £1000s to someone you haven't met?

[StrawberryTeaLeaf]

I'm just listening to Woman's Hour on catch up and there is yet more coverage of the dating scams and an interview with a police officer. Yet again, as often lately, she (and Jane Garvey) are at huge pains to say that falling for these scams is not a sign of stupidity.

It is a bit, though, isn't it?

Isn't it slightly daft to keep insisting otherwise just to spare some blushes?

HipHop I can't find a link to any of the news articles but Police Scotland recently had a huge search for a woman that has been a serial relationship scammer across Scotland. She's been active in my local area which is why I remembered the story.

I know someone (middle aged) who was conned by a Morrocan Man for a visa. As soon as they'd been married for a year, he was off. Still lives in England but it was clear to everyone but my friend what was happening. She was deeply in the lust haze though having recently come out of an EA relationship.

I also know a very intelligent man who gets conned frequently and this is because he simply can't say no to any and every opportunity which presents itself. He's sixty-odd and well-off and bored and is always investing in pyramid schemes, time-shares and land purchase opportunities and business opportunities too good to be true. He's lost two hundred and sixty thousand (that I know of) and it's simply the lure of the new and exciting that he can't resist. They don't step back and consider pros and cons before leaping in like most other people would. They get taken in by the 'YOU MUST ACT NOW!' bullshit.

All the relationships we are in now started from somewhere. I got into a car with a man from work after a party - 30 years later - he is still here. Every relationship starts with a bit of a leap. At some point we take a risk - it is how we learn. Films are full of romantic encounters that end well - why shouldn't it be like that for us?? That's what scammers rely on of course.

I hope I'd be savvy enough not to be scammed but I cannot be sure. I agree about following simple rules though like the green cross code.

I don't think I'd send money -but these people are clever.

Strawberry "Isn't it slightly daft to keep insisting otherwise just to spare some blushes?"

tbh I don't think police say it to spare blushes, but so that more people will report scammers.

Yes, that too, of course lorelei.

I suppose, in my mind, the moment that you press the button on internet banking would equate to the moment you step into a stranger's car. I'd expect that moment to be the reality check. It must take an extremely compelling force to sweep someone over that threshold of discomfort and 'wrongness' that that entails.

At 21 after three years of living in a northern university town with no problems but a massive increase in my street smarts I went home and got a summer job with a company who did a bus pick up.

21 years of being drilled not to get into strangers cars I did.

I have no idea why - didn't know the guy.

I was very tried - hadn't had a day off for weeks and day before was 12 hours shift - but it was afternoon shift - I was wet cold waiting for the bus and worried about being late - guy couldn't linger in the spot due to traffic layout so split second decision - was in safe rural location I grew up in rather than big bad city - and I think I was told to get in rather than asked after he said place I worked and was still despite three years away fighting my up-bring of being biddable and doing what I was told.

Still none of that really explains it. I was brought up to be careful and cynical and am pretty much always am.

The wrongness kicked in after I'd gotten in got belt on and just after the car pulled away - then WTF have I done hit.

Didn't get a bad vibe from the driver - I do have a face people seem to recognised easily and he recognised me from work he explained. I'd gotten worse vibes from some taxi drivers in city. He dropped me off and I got to work on time and never saw the guy again.

I think grooming people, picking up on some vulnerability and a bit of luck to hit time someone isn't on guard explains it. I suspect the WTF doubts hit bit later than you'd think as well.

I think whole incident added to my tendency to say no or stall for thinking time rather than get bounced into situations and decisions. So I got to work and got a life lesson - but does worry me how easy it can be to get into vulnerable situations and how easy my DC could find it even when adults.

lost I was going to post something similar.
When I was 17ish I had to walk a mile to work, this day it was chucking it down. A small van pulled up and the guy (30-40 I guess) asked me where somewhere was. Told him he had gone past it, not the kind of road you could do a U-turn on so I told him there was a carpark just up the road where he could turn round (it was my work carpark but I didn't tell him that). He said thanks, then hesitated and then started driving off and stopped and said I'll understand if you say no, I probably shouldn't even ask - I really won't be offended if you do say no - but would you like a lift? I weighed up the risk - he was either a very devious rapist/abductor or a genuine bloke who wanted to help someone walking in the rain who had helped him...I took a chance, gratefully accepted the lift - no problems.

Also handing over money to 'strangers'. I needed to buy something for the charity I work for - I could get it considerably cheaper from an online website - they were manufacturers and made it to order -so cut out the 'middle man mark up' and didn't have to carry stock...
But it was still a lot of money, wait time was up to 6 weeks and payment would have to be bank transfer (we can't pay by card) which they wanted it in advance (so they didn't get stuck with last minute cancellations etc).
I spoke to them (partly to make sure they weren't a completely fake website) - actually spoke to the owner and we had a mad conversation about trust - he said they were on the companies house, I said we were on the charity regulators website etc but we both acknowledged that we might not be who we said we were anyway. We came to a compromise - they would manufacture it and I would pay before dispatch...except I knew it could still be a scam - (wait a few weeks and call we are about to ship... when it actually didn't exist)...
But I went with my instinct (and was prepared to personally refund the charity the money if it was a scam) - and in fact because they hadn't followed their normal procedures we got delivery before we got an invoice and so I was chasing them so I could pay them

I think sometimes it's more about emotional vulnerability rather than stupidity. I've read about even quite smart and sensible people with responsible positions in the community falling for dating scams because they are desperate to be loved, denial is a powerful thing.

Also calling victims stupid would put them off seeking help and reporting scammers. I think that's why the show was careful not to use that language, because they want to encourage people to come forward and report these crimes.

I have a friend who would have been the victim of a dating scam had she had any money - she said this - the guy worked for Amnesty International and had gone to Africa for work and was being held by corrupt police and needed money to get released. She was worried sick but had no money to help. Well . . . you'd think Amnesty International would have been able to sort it out, wouldn't you? It's kind of . . . what they do. I asked her what country he was in and she said "Africa." I pointed out that Africa is a continent, not a country. She is a lovely, beautiful, clever woman. Not the sort of person you'd think would fall for this.

And

About 20 years ago I met a friend. American. So clever my poor old brain struggled to keep up. Why was she in the UK? Because she had come over here, with her 2 DCs, to marry a man she had never met. They had communicated by letter and phone (no internet then). He had turned out to be a nutter and here she was stuck. I can't tell you how clever this woman is. Still mystifies me to this day.

unlucky83 at least you did some risk assessment - I think I was in the car before I think my brain engaged.

Mind you with the few bad vibes in taxies prior to that - (not every journey odd two or three where I'd been by myself or one with merry drunk female friend)- I've gotten in despite some misgiving or got in then felt like I really wanted to get out and I didn't have that with that guy. In taxi made sure that driver was told people knew where we were company/cab used and that people were expecting us back within journey time and I knew all routes back and had no real problems - whether I ever was ever in danger or it was in my head not sure.

It was a very slow build up of the 'friendship' over months and months and he never actually outright asked for money, just somehow led the conversations they had around to the point where she offered it freely.

Saw one of those money management programs where the couple both had family in third world country. One of the big reasons they weren't managing despite two good wages was they hadn't realise how much was going to the extended family - not always same people and they often weren't asked outright but felt they should help and weren't telling each other what they were giving. They were surprised how constant and high the amounts were.

They didn't want not to help their family so solution was set amount each month they both agreed to went into account and only that money was used when family needed help and nothing else. It gave them bit more control and helped them keep track.

It was a bit shocking when the amounts were added up that they hadn't realised where their money was going and why the were having money problems. Their surprise and shocked seemed real - I was sat there thinking how could you not notice or work that out.

Turned out Dsis was having similar problems - her then DP was under pressure from his mother to help his brother and family out who managed money very badly - leaving him short meaning she was subing him more and more and paying more and more of the bills there they had no money and were fighting - meantime people DP were helping were out all the time or buying stuff because if they had cash they spent it. Massive resentment and major fall outs when DSis finally realised and managed to get DP on side to stop it.

Not quiet the same as a new friend as family in these cases and less scamming and more leaching or even just expectation of support but amounts seriously added up over even quiet short time frames.

Still laughing at Hiphop's joke on first page.