To Think I Shouldn't Pay Full Whack for 'Educational' School Trips?

[JoffreyBaratheon]

On the breadline, here. Minimum wage, tax credits, 5 kids only 2 still at home the rest are adults. Xmas coming; this very week have had to pay for husband's work do, colleague bday contribution - even £15 down is enough to turn into a tailspin for us and we have somehow had to find and put aside a small amount of cash for our teenagers' xmas present.

Now I just have had a call from my kids' high school 'finance officer' (wtf?) insisting we pay £30 for a school trip that is happening in March.

I said due to our circumstances, I can only pay some of it now and some later.

Pisses me off because I used to teach in the inner city and if a parent couldn't afford to pay for a trip, I'd turn a blind eye, tip the secretary the wink, and so long as the forms were signed, the child came along. I wanted to pay only £10 now but after some argy bargy, she pressurised me into £15. On the twatty Parentpay website, so she said she would go into the site at her end and adjust the amount (she hasn't - but I know it is a primitive and badly designed site so maybe they can't?) She said even if I pay £15 now I have to pay the rest in January.

She caught me on the back foot - I was busy and had no idea who she was or why she was phoning.

Now I am starting to feel royally pissed off. Are educational school trips still not free or reduced for the poor, then? How the fuck I am supposed to find £30 not only christmas month but with one boy needing new shoes, them both needing hair cuts etc etc.

If schools can afford to employ 'finance' people they can afford to cover shortfalls on trips, no?

Or is it me being the dick? It's a long time since I was a teacher but I did everything in my power for every child in my class to be a part of every trip and with zero humiliation for parents. I handled it myself (no 'finance officers') and I handled it kindly and discreetly.

Or do we now have to pay for educational trips in full regardless of circs? What happened to that voluntary contribution thing?

This reminds me of a trip I went on as a teacher. I was told by the pastoral team that Tia's (made up name, very rude and naughty child who was always in detention) ticket to the optional fun day trip to the clothes show, was being paid by the school. I think it was £40. Anyhow, we got there and her mum and cousin had bought their own tickets and decided to go too, I think they drove up separately! We then had to put up with Tia coming to show us the bags and bags of new clothes her mum had just bought her. It added up to well over £200. What an excellent use of school money.

Rose, and whois thanks for your caring, kind replies which at least go to show the woman I spoke to today is not alone in her heartlessness . Not your business but my youngest is 13. I had five kids because I had a good income and career but then shit happened.

A son was disabled and I had to give up my career to be a carer.

As I said upthread, my oldest three are adults and at uni/work. So I don't have 5 kids at home most of the time - only two. My two youngest have a dad who has not paid a penny in maintenance. Hence the struggle. The last money I had from him for the two boys was £20. In 2003.

I was livid having to pay out for husband's work do in what is financially the worst month of the year but it was already paid for when this happened. We thought we had til March to pay for the trip.

Sophie, I taught for a few years in some extremely tough, inner city schools. I never had the experience you describe. Not saying you imagined it, but it is certainly atypical. I once took a Year 4 class on a trip which happened just to be in the city centre and to the (free) science museum, so not too expensive. I think more than a dozen mothers turned up. They were blood brilliant and we all had a fantastic day. Typically, colleagues might get a couple of parents along but my class were extremely loyal - maybe because I made sure everyone could come along and do everything and never belittled or humiliated them if they couldn't afford something. It could be you are not really getting your kids' parents onboard with you in the first place. Sounds that way.

Yawn

Gosh, OP, your colleagues must have spent all their time bowing down in sheer astonishment at your total amazingness

I've never 'belittled or humiliated' a child in my life. Some years, you get a great class where lots of parents want to help/come on trips (generally infant classes), they get on with each other etc. Other years you're struggling to get enough helpers, the parents don't like/know each other. IME nothing to do with whether they get freebies/me being a super - fabulous teacher.

A birthday collection and night out should be far below something educational or new shoes.

People are very inconsistent on MN aren't they? Whenever someone says there's a work do and they don't want to go everyone says it's important to go to get to know your colleagues, that it will be frowned on if you don't etc. So why should the OP's OH be any different?

As for the colleague's birthday, it depends how the collection is done. Sometimes it's quite discreet and you don't have to give anything. But if someone is standing over you with a card and a collecting tin, it's not easy to say you're not putting anything in.

I'd have had more sympathy if you hadn't wasted money on work parties and colleagues birthdays. A school trip is far more important.

Surely people know that there will be school trips each year? Common sense would dictate that you put a little bit aside each payday in an envelope so you have some on hand when it is required?

It's always tricky ds's friend's parent are always short of cash but they spend a lot of time in the pub - who should pay?

Get the money back for the work do and the colleague's birthday present and put your kids' education as the priority. Why should the school subsidize so you hisband can go to the work's do and a work colleague gets a better birthday present?

Some, people are so sanctimonious! Making unpleasant assumptions and judgements about how responsible a parent the OP is based on one incident, despite the fact that it's been made clear she's always met the cost of these trips in the past. Sometimes money is tight and we struggle! It's no refection on our parenting abilities and I agree school trips are becoming ridiculously expensive!
The reality is when you're on a low income the amounts you're expected to pay for these trips represent such a big proportion of you're income it really makes things difficult when they crop off, often at relatively short notice. Yes you try your best to plan for these eventualities but sometimes life gets in the way and something more pressing crops up and eats into the money that you've set aside!
Sometimes a bit of compassion and empathy goes a long way rather than judgemental sniping!

And do you remember collecting the dinner money on Mondays Joffrey and then trying to get the register to balance with the right numbers of dinners eaten and the money to be carried forward on a Friday before you rushed down to assembly. Have missed point of thread completely but your description of teaching years ago brought it back!

Thanks, apricot. Life does get in the way, sometimes. We have done our best and sometimes make mistakes. Mistakes don't always matter but when you're sailing so close to the wind, with no margin for error - then a mistake really hits hard.

I take the judgypants people here with a grain of salt - keyboard warriors or people enjoying a pile on (repeatedly making the same point despite me answering upthread). One or two trolls but I'm not going troll-hunting, just comments like "yawn" after a post about a disabled child are fairly patently obviously trying to bait and tell us more about the mentality of the poster, than about the matter being discussed.

teatowel, I don't remember much about it. Most of my kids were probably on free school dinners! Am fairly sure in most places I worked, only a handful of kids ever paid for lunch and I'm guessing the office balanced the books - maybe that was different in different LEAs? I can remember handling money but not really opening the envelopes or keeping tally, if that makes sense?

joffrey You have not a clue how school finances work.
Just as you are having a hard time financially, so are schools. £30 for whatever this visit is, is not a cheap school visit. If 10 parents choose not to pay but spend their money on a works do, that costs the school £300. Probably, at least half a dozen thngs like this take place every week in a secondary school. Secondary schools, like ours for example has lost £500,000 of funding this year in cuts. Our Languages dept is run on £400 a year for books, trips etc.

Schools no longer have pots of money they just fill in the gaps with.

They are your kids, take respnsibility. You come across as someone who thinks others should be doing it for you.

The finance person sounds like a witch and we always try to help parents out but you need to read your post and look at how you sound- someone paying for nights out and birthdays and expecting someone else to pay for your kids.

I don't understand sniping at ordinary people for not having spare cash, there's enough money in the world for all children to have totally free educations (including trips) and it isn't ordinary families struggles or financial mismanagement that stops this from being a reality. People need to more carefully identify who is at fault here, who should be blamed for schools not having pots of spare money, because they should do, but us all being distracted with being angry with each other prevents real anger and action addressed to those at fault.

I would have cancelled the work do and colleagues present and put that towards your child's trip

You can amend amounts yourself on Parent Pay - just so you know for the future.

YABU, you need to budget for these things. Your children's school trips are more important than your husband's work xmas meal. He should miss it.

If it is important to the curriculum, contributions are voluntary and child cannot be excluded for not paying. I always budget for a few non payers. However, have just cancelled a trip for the whole class as not enough contributions received.

My yawn was in reference to your drip feeding.

Hi joff, I'm relieved to see that the nasty comments coming up here have not fazed you, this is sadly a good example of mumsnet at its worst .

Anyway, as someone who organises school trips and takes in payments, our school would never exclude any child from a trip. They attend whether they pay or not.

As regards residential trips, we include a paragraph stating that parents/carers contact the school if finance is an issue. We will and have paid for children whose parents cannot pay.

Joff there's been some good and helpful advice given here which, hopefully, will help. This is mumsnet at its best .

ladygracie just what I was coming on to say-the figured required is there-you click on it and enter the amount you are paying-have always done that with trips-paid in small chunks.

I haven't read the full thread as on the way out to do school run soon!

I am in a similar position. I was also firmly told that I HAVE to pay for a school trip or my DD cannot go. We do not get pupil premium, because DP works. We are £550 per month down on our previous income though, and I cannot get dole.

I begged the school to let her go without paying but they told me I have to pay but as they 'are sympathetic to your circumstances' I can pay weekly.

My DP has forgone his works Christmas do though, they are not compulsory and we do put sorting out the kids before us having a high old time of it! Maybe that would work for you.

Mamma is it in school time? We never run trips during school time that would exclude a child from taking part.

It is partly in school time and partly not. They will be back at 6.30,but I am not sure what time they left.

The information I read linked up thread does say that if more than half is during school time they cannot make us pay. I think maybe less than half is during school time though. Left lunch time ish.

That is crap mamma. Its the situation where everyone can go except the "poor but not very poor" kids. So unfair! I have no problem with voluntary contributions, and think its fine to require payment for fun trips (eg language trips abroad) where only a few get to go, but threatening to leave one or two children behind if their parents don't pay - that's well harsh.

I must say I thought that all "curriculum" based trips had to be voluntary contribution only. And it's really hard to get a trip approved by the head if it isn't for the curriculum and is in school time. Tbh, in our school it's not easy even then!