to go and put my child in the car til they stop screaming?

[hotlinesling]

DS is 8. He has always been needy and clingy when at home - he'll follow me round the house, wait outside the door while I go to the toilet, won't go upstairs alone etc. For the past few weeks he's been making a real fuss at bedtime. He'll be absolutely fine and happy all day, receive plenty of positive attention and then bam - as I take him up to bed his lip starts quivering and he starts literally wailing. He will say he can't sleep because of x, y, z reasons (yesterday he was 'scared of his radiator'. Seriously.) This is usually before he's even tried to sleep. His bedtime is 9.15 and he's up at 7.15 so I'm not trying to send him off too early. During the day and out and about he's actually extremely confident and independent.

I'll reassure him but he usually just wails and screams and won't talk back. I then put consequences in but his wailing gets louder and louder. I have two younger dc so he's disrupting the entire house. Tonight he started wailing saying he won't sleep because there's too many police cars making noise; we heard one ten minutes earlier when brushing teeth. I reasoned with him briefly then said goodnight and left. He started screaming and wailing. I returned and explained the consequences of him continuing (losing ipad time and football practice tomorrow) and then left again. He is whimpering and wailing now and building himself up to start being extremely loud and I feel like saying I'll go and sit him in the car til he's quiet if he continues. DH is in the house if the others wake. Aibu?

So its not about bedtime, its about control.

I'm with Doreen, keep making bed time earlier in steady increments.

He's getting ten hours which is enough sleep. I've tried earlier but he's worse as he then says he isn't tired. I've offered rewards but he still doesn't behave at bedtime, then uses the lack of reward as the excuse for being upset

Don't dismiss the idea of him being overtired. 9:15 seems very late to me ... my 13yo goes at 9pm!

I know you say he's always been fine with that much sleep, but he doesn't sound "fine". He clingy and screaming at bedtime. Perhaps his brain is completely wired through lack of sleep?

Door is open with the landing light on as he doesn't like the dark. My room is right next to his and ideally I'd be in bed within an hour of him if he wasn't waking the whole house.

He isn't fine though is he? He's going to bed too late. He's probably overtired.

My 7 year old goes at 8.

He might well be scared too.

Try getting him to go up at 7.45, have a chat, reassure him that there's nothing to be scared off, get him to do a quiet activity then lights out at 8.30pm.

But he's not getting ten hours if he's still screaming an hour after bedtime. He's getting nine hours max. And plenty of 8 year olds need more than the average amount.

When he laughs it off, what reason does he give for his behaviour? What does he say when you point out how he's making everyone else's life hell?

My ds has done this when he's tired. He feels embarrassed the next day so laughs it off.

Try getting him to wind down in bed reading or colouring then lights out no later than 8.30.

I have two other children to sort out too though pyjama so I can't sit doing a quiet activity just with him and he won't be alone without wailing.

Gruntled he just shrugs and nods when I lecture him. Then repeats it.

Other than bedtime, what happens normally when he doesn't get his own way?

You say he is clingy and needy all the time at home though? Has he always been like this, even as a toddler or is it becoming worse? How is he when at school, going into school in the morning, when he is on a trip or at a party?

You don't have to sit with him the whole time.

A 5 minute chat then let him get on with some reading or drawing.

You might see some improvement in a few days when he catches up with some sleep.

Pre warn him that he's got 10 minutes, 5 minutes, so he knows what to expect.

something is causing it. Who wd he talk to ? Or wd he write about it ?

there are a variety of reasons...

Overtired which you seem unable to accept
Control...I he claims he can't do basic things he is trying to rule the roost in your house..By disturbing everyone else he won't care as it makes him in control

He is laughing it off as he is uncomfortable, can't explain it.

There is something he is very unhappy about..

The reward does he really care about it? My Ds at the minute would do anything for a pack of Match attax...He also earns console time for completing certain task..

It must be exhausting for you, I'm sorry OP.

But this is nothing like normal at 8 years old. I think you need to take him to the GP and explain the anxiety and age-inappropriate behaviour. He might need an assessment by CAMHS even if you don't suspect SEN (I assume you don't from the OP).

Another thing that comes through your posts though is the other 2 children, need to go to bed, the other 2 need help with their Pj's...How old are they and are they up at 915 too?.. Does he feel resentful of them? Are they much younger? 1-1 time shouldn't really be a reward..If other 2 were in bed earlier could you play a game listen to him read before bed.

I often go up 10 minutes before lights out to chat to DS in bed..

If he does read then teeth you are getting him out of bed once he has settled.

I would also like to add there are hormonal changes in my DS he is growing muscles /pecks...He isn't in full blown puberty but definitely hormonal changes

School, parties, activities etc are fine with no clinging. He doesn't try and get his way with anything else, he's well behaved and usually responds well to boundaries. His rewards are 1:1 time with me doing an activity he really enjoys, friends over for tea and pocket money - all of which he really wants but loses.

Pyjama if I left him to do anything he'd just start crying and wailing. I have considered the possibility of him being overtired and tried adjusting bedtime but it made things worse.

His sister is under assessment for ASC so doesn't sleep much but plays quietly while I read with DS. His other sibling is a breastfed baby and he loves her to bits. He just doesn't seem to get that his behaviour is upsetting everyone

I really feel for you. Is it worth getting him to spend more waking time in his room - nice stuff like reading, playing, drawing etc? Is bedtime the only time he spends alone? Does he think it's not fair his siblings don't have the same bedtime rules maybe?

Whatever it is have some from me. Bedtime problems are like nothing else. Soooo exhausting.

They do all have the same rules. He doesn't like being alone in the house at all but will play outside happily alone. He doesn't really 'play', doesn't like reading to himself, won't draw or write in his room or alone. He is exhausting. He is constantly having to be told to quieten down as he will talk extremely loudly, interrupting and over everyone else. He'll roar or scream randomly really loudly. Yet at school he's as good as gold

My DD is 8years old and goes to bed at 7pm.

I'd suggest not engaging with him. Just ignore. Even negative attention is still attention

Would he go to bed ok if he could sleep in your bed? Is that what he wants? If it is then I think you need to explore why he feels so insecure at the moment.

And I second going to the GP to explore possible SEN issues. Sometimes they can hold it together at school but it all comes out at home

No that isn't what he wants. He can't articulate what the problem is. I have considered SEN but I don't really know what exactly I think it could be. He's extremely loud, bossy and routine lead at home. Very clumsy and inattentive. He forever spoils what he's doing by not thinking - I.e . He'll put a whole pot on glue on a piece of paper then be surprised that it rips.