To think that schools should not be pressurising parents to take their children to the doctor just because the child has been off for two days

[ReallyTired]

dd has flu. She has been sick, has a runny nose and a temperature. There is no way that she is fit for school. The school are telling me that I need to take to the doctor. I have refused to take her to the doctor because I think it would be a monumental waste of everyone's time. Dd just wants to hide under her duvet. I am pretty certain that dd just has a virus that needs to take its course and there is nothing that a GP can do to help dd. Dd horrible lurgly could be dangerous to vunerable groups like the elderly or pregnant women. I would hate for my poor GP to catch dd's germs.

I feel that schools should not be encouraging parents to waste GPs time. Adults are allowed to self certify for up to seven days. I think that parents should be allowed to certify that their children are too sick for school for seven days.

Its no wonder that people cannot get appointments for the doctor when they need a doctor. I want a doctor appointment to be available to dd if she is not better next week.

I had a gut full of this with Ds1 last year. I ended up phoning the GP and his reaction was to tell them to ring him if they wish to discuss DS's absence further. They never did. One time DS had severe constipation and just needed some time in the loo to sort the problem out. I didn't want to bother the GP with that when we had medication in the house from the previous episode. The same with viruses, stomach bugs etc. it is ridiculous.

Completely agree with you, OP. The way schools try to push the administrative burden of establishing that absence is justified on to already overstretched NHS services is a gross misuse of resources imo.

As a policy, it also has wider ramifications that they don't appreciate. One of my DSs has virus-induced wheeze - basically asthma which only occurs in conjunction with colds/flu. A day of TLC at home at the beginning of a virus can prevent a week of absence, antibiotics, nebulisers and steroids and potentially months of immunosuppression (none of which they appreciate, ime). But most importantly, he needs to learn how to manage his condition himself before he leaves home - as do all asthmatic DCs, as it could save their life to know the difference between a mild exacerbation that can be treated with inhalers and an escalating situation that needs medical intervention.

He'll only learn how to do that by observing how I make that judgement each time he's ill - what signs I look for, what thresholds trigger a different response, etc. Seeing the doctor at the drop of a hat 'because school says so' completely undermines that learning/judgement process, and children (particularly boys) who are used to that approach typically become young adults who don't bother consulting the doctor even when they really really should. About 1200 people die of asthma exacerbations every year, and most of those deaths could be prevented by understanding when to see a doctor urgently.

Sorry to hijack. Here endeth the homily.

I sometimes think lines become blurred in primary schools. We have had similar comment but worse was the TA whose professional judgement meant she suggested publicly to one mother that her child would benefit from a psychologist. Just remember they are not medical professionals.

However, I did not attend the doctors following a recent virus until my DH told me he had never heard anything like it. I saw a locum who confirmed a virus and I felt I had wasted surgery time. But I became much worse, went back to my regular GP who confirmed whooping cough. That meant I had been very infectious and sadly it appears my youngest GS now has it, although he had been vaccinated.

I have never been a person who felt strongly about vaccinations, but to think of a baby or small child with this disease is absolutely awful. I would say whilst you shouldn't be pushed by the school, do trust your own instincts. I hope your dd improves soon.

I had whooping cough as a four year old. It is truely terrifying. I remember feeling dizzy from lack of breathe. With whooping cough the child coughs and then take in a great grasp of air which sometimes makes a whooping sound. (Hence the whoop) I have never had a flu strain worse than whooping cough.

My daughter is getting better. She will be back at school tomorrow.

Could not agree more. It's even more infuriating when adults do it though
Patient at reception: "I've been sent home from work as I don't feel well and they told me I should see a Dr"

Me: "Do you think you need to see a Dr?" As in trying to ascertain seriousness of symptoms etc. without prying

Patient: "No, but my boss said I needed to"

Me: inwardly thinking "Give me fucking strength", but obviously smiling on the outside and then organising something for them

YANBU!

I have been thinking of resigning my job as a GP recently...because of , well a multitude of things, but one of the worse is the constant stream of this sort of thing filling my emergency surgeries.
The 'school/nursery/work said i had to get little johnny checked 'just in case'.....is enough to drive one mad. Mostly parents in my surgery get very angry with the gps who either try to explain that as parents they can make decisions related to their childrens health, or suggest that schools are being unreasonable. I have been shouted, sworn and spat at by parents when i have suggested that a child with a mild virus does not need an emergency appt just because school says so , and no teachers do not know better...

HOWEVER....you lovely sensible reasonable mumsnetters have restored just a tiny bit of my faith and good humour.

Where i work schools and nurseries insist in all children who bump heads being seen before they can go back to school....all sticky eyes have to have antibiotics before going back to school....all rashes have to be seen and have a certificate from a doctor even if child is well....our local a&e is swamped, the GPs are despairing and we are all, including parents held to ransom by teachers with no medical training.

When we have no primary care service left as GPs are leaving in droves, when a&es are failing to recognize ill patients among the multitude of not ill, and we have no antibiotics left that work....the education system will have to shoulder some of the responsibility....

I've just tried to make an appt for my dd to see a gp. It's not life threatening, but likely to get worse if left untreated. Week after next is the first appt they have free.

How on earth can a school expect parents to take their children to the doc when they're ill today, and need don't need to go at all to go this week? It's mental.

Luckily my dd's (6) school has a modicum of common sense, she had two weeks off with severe chicken pox last year. No one asked for a GP note as it was going round the class anyway.

Utter nonsense, primary care services are creaking under the strain already without having to see young healthy children with self-limiting viruses.

YANBU. Glad to hear she is feeling better.

Why don't parents just say no? The school has no power over you to tell yo what to do.
I cannot imagine anyone i know IRL taking the slightest notice of an instruction like this.

brioche...i have asked parents this several times and more reasonable ones answer me....the theme is the implied threat of social services being called in , if a child was genuinely seriously ill and the parents had not taken them to doctor. parents are too scared and too infantasised to trust their own judgements.

Jellybean it must be so frustrating for you.

OP I agree with you and when I found out the school policy yesterday was most annoyed. I will not be taking DS to the GP if I don't feel it is necessary even if it results in unauthorised absence, but will write to explain why.

jellybean is correct that's what schools do. That is why I fought them this time as did my GP. Ss were put under strain for nothing too, schools bullying ill families. Wtf are we allowing teachers do this to us?

I see from your latest update that thankfully your DD doesn't actually have flu.

Did you tell the school she had flu and that is why they've asked you to go a GP. If you'd said she had a cold would they have asked the same question do you know?

I'd agree that a school asking parents to go to the GP for a 2 day cold would obviously be ridiculous but from an attendance POV if they are told that a child has flu they may have been advised that it's better to have it confirmed at the start as they will definitley be off for a much longer period

Luckily I don't think my DCs school asks for GP visits at all, at least it's never been mentioned to me so I'm trying to understand the thought process for a school that does.

It's the thought process of a box ticking fool.

Mumsnet posters do seem to be very jaded about schools and their policies I've noticed.

In RL I've never come across schools as bad as the ones I read about on here and I've never had a conversation with a friend that has suggested that they have encountered unreasonable behaviour either.

I've checked my schools attendance policy on their website and there is no mention of ever needing a GP appointment, it says something along the lines of assuming illness is genuine unless there is some reason not to. Have you seen your schools policy OP, is it being applied properly.

I think it's more the silliness of this particular type of pressure that some schools are putting on parents to "prove" that their children are definitely ill. While we all know we are not to go to the GP unless we really need to.

If the school want 'proof' of your DDs illness why don't you take photos of the toilet after she's been each time and pictures of her every hour while lying ill in bed and email them every hour to the school? It would soon stop the madness!

I review gp notes as part of my job. There are sometimes gems of letters in there from years ago often typed on typewriters from gps who were thoroughly sick of something and had no qualms about stating it. This type of letter to the school is just what is needed but sadly can't be done anymore.

I don't go around speaking about this in rl.

As a teacher I have recently been told that when students in my tutor group are off sick return to school, I should be quizzing them on their illness and telling them they should have come in!! I don't do it, what they were ill with is none of my business, and if they were ill they should be wrapped up in a duvet on the sofa in my opinion)

I think that theredjellybean would forgive me for thinking that might child had flu with four days of high temperatures, vomiting, runny nose, runny bum, achey mucles, headache, dizziness. Certainly the school nurse when I spoke to her thought it sounded like flu. She gave me good advice on how to get dd's temperature down when she couldn't keep down calpol.

Flu is not a reason for an otherwise healthy person to visit the doctor. Unless you are in a vunerable category full blown flu is just incredibly unpleasent. Full blown flu having the same symptoms as my daughter for two weeks.

My grandfather died of flu at 87 in 1993 inspite of excellent care from his GP. Little could be done other than providing oxygen and fluids to him. Sadly this was not enough.

I was so ill when swine flu went around.

I probably can't add to anything theredjellybean has said, but it seems to me so unfair on parents, who are stuck in the middle here and will always get the blame. If they take a sick child into school, the school will blame them for spreading germs. If they keep the sick child at home, the school will insist on a note from the GP. If they take sick child to the GP, the GP will ask: Why are you wasting my time?

We know, because we're constantly told, that GP services are under pressure from patients seeing them about trivial complaints. But what are you supposed to do if the school/employer insists on it?

As someone said upthread, Nicky Morgan and Jeremy Hunt should have their heads banged together until they sort it out.

It does seem to vary from area to area. I'm in NI and I have never been asked to take either of my DC to the GP.