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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Jehovah's Witnesses trying to convert vulnerable people

102 replies

nobodyknowsimhere · 13/10/2015 21:07

First AIBU and I'm aware I've potentially chosen a hot topic, so I'm bracing myself.....

I work in a residential project for vulnerable women and their children. We get a lot of donations from local individuals and groups, some of them religious, some not. Occasionally they come with cards saying 'happy Easter/Christmas whatever from x congregation'. I'm not a fan of organised religion or religious charities but whatever, it has no impact on the women and children concerned so it doesn't bother me.

What did bother me, though, was when the Jehovah's Witnesses rocked up the other day wanting to leave copies of the Watch Tower in our foyer for people to pick up. My colleague was the one who saw them and didn't realise they were leaving religious tracts, which they described as 'magazines'. We're we being unreasonable to chuck the, straight in the bin once I showed up and explained what they were, and would I be unreasonable to call them up and ask them not to come again?

OP posts:
hackmum · 14/10/2015 07:46

I think leaving copies of The Watchtower in the foyer is fairly low-key. Nobody has to pick them up and read them. I suppose it's up to you whether you stick them in the bin or not, though it does smack a bit of you setting yourself up to decide what other people can and can't read. But I imagine 99% of Watchtowers end up straight in the bin anyway.

Sansoora · 14/10/2015 07:49

*sansoora she is basically saying that some people with tourettes can shout profanities and swear words they learn and that in prison you learn a lot of swear words so she could reel of a long list without pausing.

Get off your high horse and dont take offence to an analogy.*

You are both such nice people.

fastdaytears · 14/10/2015 07:54

AuntieStella I thought they admitted that it was the ill, disabled and bereaved that were top of their list? Reading obituaries etc. I can't google it now and I need to pretend to work for a bit.

SoupDragon · 14/10/2015 08:05

Taking offence doesn't make it offensive.70

The offence has not been explained.

It shouldn't need explaining!!

Would you use, say, a description of someone with cerebral palsy walking as an analogy for anything?

SoupDragon · 14/10/2015 08:06

(Ignore the 70, I'm having keyboard issues)

RJnomaaaaaargh · 14/10/2015 08:15

Unlike Mormons they do target everyone. It's just that people who are most vulnerable are likely to be drawn to something which offers them a solution to all their problems.

They got my mother after she lost her second baby.

Having been raised as one I think I'm fairly entitled to comment that they are a cult and that they do tremendous emotional damage. Any belief system which does not support rigorous examination and questioning of itself is wrong and it's s sin to question or to read anything which does so.

Almost 20 years on I still suffer associated guilt from my childhood and adolescence. Strangely I could deal with all the shit the thing that did it for me was being forced to leave school at 15.
There is some interesting news articles online about central finances as well if anyone is that interested.

redannie118 · 14/10/2015 08:23

This reply has been withdrawn

The OP has privacy concerns, and so we've agreed to take this down now.

Damselindestress · 14/10/2015 08:29

I'm generally open minded about what other people believe, as long as it doesn't harm anyone. To me, Jehovah's Witnesses cross that line because they are opposed to blood transfusions and some even refuse them on behalf of their children, who have no choice about their parents religion. I don't trust anyone who could stand by and watch their child die when a simple procedure could save their life. Also they feel compelled to proselytize about their religion, influencing others, who may be vulnerable, to join them and therefore refuse blood transfusions too. For this reason I feel uncomfortable when I see them trying to convert others. YANBU to protect your clients.

pineappleshortbread · 14/10/2015 08:34

She used it as a metaphor to conjure an inage that we could all understand. She was intentionally insulting or targeting anyone. It wasnt meant as an insult or to make fun of people with tourettes.

Some people take offence too easily.

Lurkedforever1 · 14/10/2015 08:39

Yanbu. Some people do find comfort in religion, but they shouldn't be recruited for it, whatever the religion when they are vulnerable.
For all the many faults of other religions, most don't require all or nothing like jws do. It's a cult imo.

Even things I don't personally agree with in other religions, such as halal or kosher meat, has logical origins. Prefering your child die than receive some treatment is just fucked up though.

RJnomaaaaaargh · 14/10/2015 08:54

Red I am sorry but that story is complete pish.

For all their faults I can't stand misinformation lie that being spouted. Firstly as a religion they do value human life highly (within the restrictions of their beliefs admittedly) and medical treatment is encouraged as long as it doesn't contravene their beliefs around the sanctity of blood so cancer treatments such as chemotherapy and surgery without blood are fine. They've actually helped with pioneering bloodless surgeries.

Secondly they don't believe in hell so it's odd they would write threatening someone with that on a weekly basis.

Not denying she's had a bad time in some way but it doesn't help when things are just as completely in accurate as your post is.

Bubblesinthesummer · 14/10/2015 08:58

Some people take offence too easily.

Or maybe people should choose better metaphors.

Notoedike · 14/10/2015 09:26

Any 'religion' which demands members sever contact with relatives who leave the 'religion' sets of alarm bells to me (JW, Scientology and others)

This most definitely not the case. Mil converted to JW when dh was a boy....he was a scholarly boy who devoured the bible reading it cover to cover a few times....which caused him to doubt a lot of what he was being told. He left the religion when he was around 18. Mil continues to practice, she is the only one in the family, she does not try to convert us, she does not undermine my parenting, she respects my atheist pov - although clearly doesn't agree with it. I had a massive blood transfusion after having the dcs, MIl was incredibly supportive and helpful, never did she mention my transfusion. We sometimes mix with her concregation too - none have even mentioned religion to us.
She does however have to satisfy her belief that we need saved, so she subtly hands dh several copies of the Watchtower everytime we visit - never in front of me. She recently asked me if he read them and I laughed and said - he's looks at them!
She is a lovely woman, with a good heart and a solid belief. I see all religions as slightly cultish organisations anyway....JWs have just tagged on a couple of extras. I'm sure there are extremists among every religion and they are the ones you remember most.
Btw according to Mil as a rule try not to not convert vunerable people, she's say the less sound of mind someone is the quicker they leave the organisation, but they will of course talk to people. They talked to her for 10years before she joined.

SurlyCue · 14/10/2015 09:40

Yes my friend (whose mum i mentioned upthread was converted after she escaped a DV marriage) was raised in the community however met a catholic man in her late teens and was told to end the relationship of be ex communicated. She chose him and married him and for a long time lost her family however they have since got back in touch (in secret). She is under no illusions about how damaging the religion is. She says it has made her mother a wreck having to chose between her daughter and her religion.

BrideOfWankenstein · 14/10/2015 09:42

Thank you, pineapple

I didn't mean to cause offence, so please don't take it as one. And I apologise if I did offended anyone, like I said, I didn't mean to.

evilcherub · 14/10/2015 09:57

What is the problem with them leaving copies of Watchtower or whatever it's called for others to read? They are not forcing people to read this pamphlet are they? And I don't think anyone has ever been threatened or murdered by JW because they don't want to convert. Just ignore them.

It seems to me that people on MN always have a problem with minor Christian or Scientologist cults that very few people take seriously and really aren't dangerous, I really don't understand the fuss. There are far more serious ideologies out there that are genuinely forcing vulnerable people to convert. At least with JW you can just put it in the bin and tell them you are not interested.

MNHQ
TheOnlyOliviaMumsnet · 14/10/2015 09:59

AHem

Aeroflotgirl · 14/10/2015 10:08

Yanbu they sound like they are targeting vulnerable people for their religion, as they are least likely to say no.

SoupDragon · 14/10/2015 10:26

She used it as a metaphor to conjure an inage that we could all understand. She was intentionally insulting or targeting anyone. It wasnt meant as an insult or to make fun of people with tourettes.

Whether it was meant into be intentionally insulting or offensive or not, it was. There are many metaphors that could be used to conjure an image we all understand. They might racist, homophobic or disablist but who cares eh?

Some people take offence too easily.

Some people need to think before typing.

SoupDragon · 14/10/2015 10:29

Bride has had the decency to apologise for any offence caused. She hasn't argued that people should stop taking offence so easily and tried to brush it under the carpet. Good on her.

Ouriana · 14/10/2015 10:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

saucony · 14/10/2015 10:43

When I worked in mental health, there were a surprising number of service users who had grown up in JW families or had recently converted. I appreciate that is an anecdote but it does affect my view.

BeautyQueenFromMars · 14/10/2015 10:44

I had a friend who was brought up JW and was married and had 2 kids within the community. When her youngest child 2 years old was diagnosed with cancer she was told in no uncertain terms that if she sought medical treatment for him she would be cast out. So she moved out with only the clothes on her back.little one thankfully recovered but she gets at least one letter per week(and shes moved house multiple times)from her parents and other community members telling her that her children will burn in hell for all eternity. Pure unadulterated evil

Really? The only medical treatment the JWs are against is blood transfusion. And they don't believe in hell. They also believe that once you're dead, that's it, you're dead. Unless God brings you back to life in the future paradise on earth they believe in. But they definitely, absolutely, positively do not believe in hell.

BeautyQueenFromMars · 14/10/2015 10:49

If you are kicked out of the religion (disfellowshipped) or offically leave (disassociate yourself), then other baptized members of the faith are not allowed to talk to you. If they do, then they are spoken to by the 'elders' and if they continue to talk to you then they themselves are disfellowshipped.

If you leave without ever having been baptized into the religion, then they can all talk to you.

QueenStromba · 14/10/2015 10:51

If the cancer treatment was a bone marrow transplant then that's a bit of a grey area as far as JWs are concerned.

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