to think that a lot of small businesses are essentially con artists?

[SecretWineBox]

Even if they don't admit it even to themselves?

I'm getting rather sick of crap service from builders (there are NO honest ones!), driving instructors (ANY instructor you are paying in fact), small online shops, local food suppliers, bad restaurants...

I really want to support small businesses but i can't afford to be ripped off all the time.

At least large organisations generally have a proper complaints process.

Then people blame big corporations for the demise of small business.... If there was a national chain of builders and tradesmen I'd be over the moon!

We had 2 experiences recently with small local companies (2 different trades).

One turned up on the wrong day at the wrong address, without the parts he'd been told were needed. DD then escorted him to the right address - her GPs, both with dementia. He presented the bill before leaving, which my MIL insisted on paying there and there (GPs are both terrified of 'owing' anybody money). DH discovered that not only had they not completed the job, they charged more per hour than they told him on the phone, had a 400% markup on the parts, they charged for the time to go and get the parts, and the problem was not fully repaired. DH has complained and we await the outcome (silence so far).

The other experience was someone who was prepared to come out one evening, said he wouldn't charge for his time to take a look at a problem and advise us, went and got new parts and fixed things there and then, all at a reasonable cost.

Guess which one we will use again.

My experiences with small businesses have a tendency to be extremely good or really quite bad, while the big companies tend to be a bit blah but acceptable.

I'd agree with being able to rate clients as well as rating traders. At least tripadvisor and eBay allow comments both ways. When my dh ran his own business (he's so far from a conman it's laughable), he is the nicest man you could meet in a month of Sundays but he didn't lift a finger without money up front. It would be better if that were more common, and fewer small businesses would go bust. There's a general opinion though that if you give a small trader money up front they'll never appear again, which is sad whether it's true or not.

there is a head office or even a regulator to complain to
Speaking as a small business owner who makes my living advising small businesses I'd tell my clients to tell you to take a running jump.

You want big business efficiency?
Fine, off you go.
Leave us to deal with the pleasant people.

Use trusted traders sites, personal recommendations or ask your local Chamber of Commerce.
I use big international businesses for some things - car insurance, mobile phone, - and good local ones for others- butcher, hairdresser, car repair. The local garage addresses me by name, and always goes the extra to deliver great service. The first space they have for a repair needed at the moment (not desperately urgent) is Friday, but I am going on holiday on Friday. So, I will park the car at the garage on Friday night after work and drop the keys through the letterbox, they will fix it and then bring it back to my house and drop the keys back through MY letterbox. Just pay when you get back...
Don't get that from a big faceless business.

Had a bad driving instuctor (recommended!) ditched him and found a better one. He was very patient and got me through the test. Long time ago, but alway been grateful. Was advised not to go with the big players (BSM etc) and it paid off.
The young plumber (27) who changed our radiators was very professional, cleaned up after himself and I would recommend him to anyone. For someone so young starting on his own he was very mature. Same with our landscape gardener, word of mouth found him and he has worked on most of my road ( its a long road) neighbours too.
My dads little local costcutter are brilliant with him, help him pack his bags and know his name. I use the more faceless places myself (cost mostly determines this choice) found customer service ok. Worst are chain restaurants i think, a smaller place will make a bigger effort. Sorry you have had such rubbish service. Maybe i have just been lucky with builders and tradesmen, most have been very good.

TalkinPeece Sat 10-Oct-15 17:20:27

there is a head office or even a regulator to complain to
Speaking as a small business owner who makes my living advising small businesses I'd tell my clients to tell you to take a running jump.

You want big business efficiency?
Fine, off you go.
Leave us to deal with the pleasant people

THIS. This is the attitude you often get - if you raise the slightest concern the small business owner often takes it completely to heart. It's understandable as people will often put their heart and soul into the business but bloody frustrating when you just want stuff done.

I use independent shops and trades wherever possible
the key is go by word of mouth recommendations IME

this is the reason we've delayed building work to our kitchen - no-one can recommend us a builder (although plenty have told us not to use the people they used)

I'm not taking anything to heart.
I can pick and choose my clients.
I'd choose not to deal with somebody with your attitude.
Simple.

I came onto this thread to say what the PP just above said: word of mouth recommendations are the way to go. They're not infallible, but they are good 90%+ of the time. This has gone for carpet fitters, plumbers, handymen, cabinetmakers, builders...

Even so, I do have a shit-list of local tradesmen I will never use again: one sparky (didn't listen and didn't finish the job and didn't do a particularly good job, either), one builder (arrogant, messy).

YABVVU

I always use local small business when I can. Today we were out and got a coffee, we chose the local coffee shop a few doors away from Starbucks. Friendly and welcoming service, local couple, the money they make will stay in the local community, if I had gone to Starbucks where do the profits go?

When I moved house recently I relied on local business a lot.
Local removal company, did overcharge me, I complained and they sent me the money back.
Local carpenter, came and made my Ikea furniture within 24 hours of asking. Much cheaper than Ikea would have done it.
Gardener came and in 3 hours had the over grown garden looking great.
Rubbish left at my old house was picked up and disposed of legaly within 1 hour of calling.
I needed a tiler to cut some tiles so I could fit my cooker into the space, came within 2 hours of calling and only charged £20.
Toliet blocked, plumber came the next day and fixed it.
I have also used local electrician, carpet cleaner and roofer. They have all been prompt and done a good job.
I avoid chains when I can.

Our town has a facebook group called townnamefriends, and we all recommend local businesses. I tell businesses that I heard of them or were recommedned on the site and they know that if they have done a good job word goes round.

Cries. (sorry 6 days worked this week, i am my business helping i hope patients). Very sweeping statement op. Ive just done my tax return and if you know what i earn per hour (less than min age) you wouldnt do my job but i make (i hope) such a huge difference and seeing the improvement in patients is worth more than money.

Some customers are just professional complainers, hoping to get compensation and something of quality, 'cheap' and will go to any lengths to get it.

Just sayin'.

*THIS. This is the attitude you often get - if you raise the slightest concern the small business owner often takes it completely to heart. It's understandable as people will often put their heart and soul into the business but bloody frustrating when you just want stuff done.

I disagree, however let's say that is correct. How does that translate into 'con artist' . The fact that you can explain why your consider small businesses to be a con, means you know Yabu.

You don't like using small businesses. That's fine. To label entire industries or all small businesses because you have had bad experiences is not fine.

I do not advertise. At all. In any way shape or form.
I use this Posting name to give tax, accounts and financial advice but actively separate it from my paying work.
I only take on clients who are recommended to me by other clients or good friends

because I've had enough of crap clients who want it all for nothing and complain about everything
just saying

TalkinPeece Sat 10-Oct-15 17:33:02

I'm not taking anything to heart.
I can pick and choose my clients.
I'd choose not to deal with somebody with your attitude.
Simple.

Oh this too - I really hate being made to feel like I have to pretend that the person is dealing with is a friend, that we have to like each other...

No, just exchange money for good and services.....

Talkin didn't say you have to pretend to be friends.

I think you have a bee in your bonnet about small businesses. Are you jealous of people who are self employed or is someone you really hate self employed?

Because your not make sense at all. In fact maybe that's why you get such bad service, because you don't make sense.

Some of my clients happen to be friends. But I still charge them the going rate and treat them as I would any other client.
Other clients are by no means friends : they are just a source of income.
But I treat them all with professionalism.

When I used to work for others I had real problems explaining to some colleagues that
you do not have to like the people you work with
you just have to work with them

I think the OP expects loyalty from traders
ah well.

I thought you were going to talk about all those fried chicken shops being a money laundering service for drug dealers.

Let's not forget VW fiddling with their diesel engines. If that emissions scandal isn't evidence of VW getting caught out in a giant con trick then I don't know what is.

I run a small business. I have never claimed tax credits, in fact I am a tax payer individually and the business makes a profit which is taxed. I am not yet big enough for VAT rating - we think we'll hit that in our next financial year and are beginning to plan for it. I am massively proud of the fact that our business manufactures in the UK, creating jobs and an apprenticeship for a young person. We do not advertise - a deliberate policy. We have many, many happy repeat customers. We aim to give great customer service and to make the best products of their type on the market. We are not the cheapest but I'm proud of the fact that we don't manufacture in an overseas sweatshop (many of our competitors do), and that we can also do a huge amount to help charities who are active in our specialist field. I go to bed every night with a clear conscience and I love what I do. We use a range of specialist suppliers, also mainly small businesses for things like labels, specialist textiles, etc. In general, I find small businesses (especially in specialist niches) are helpful, friendly and really know their stuff.

The vast majority of our customers (both UK and overseas) are really lovely people - I think in nearly four years of trading, I've only had two who seriously took the piss.

I've never had any building work done, so can't comment on that.

So YABU.