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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To dislike "Radical Feminism"

985 replies

InternetPerson · 25/09/2015 21:15

I've got nothing against feminists that fight for womens rights and genuinely want the best the best for everyone and don't hate anyone, but "RadFems" tend to be full of bitterness and hatred. And I'm not just talking about kids, these are high profile, intelligent women with power and influence. Do you think it's unreasonable to dislike something where most people think men are inherantly evil and to be feared? Or do you think their hatred is fair and we should respect them for their good work in trying to make humans hate eath other even more?

Like, I said, I have nothing against Feminism, it's done a lot of great work down the years and still does, but "Rad Fem" and "Feminism" are too completly different things in my opinion. Is this a wrong conclusion?

AIBU?

OP posts:
LuisCarol · 26/09/2015 00:48

Radical in most peoples minds means big change.

Ok.

It means unrest.

Ok

It means revolution about something

Ok

and is not appropriate.

Wait, what?

Lweji · 26/09/2015 00:48

You are asking me? :)

I thought you were rude.

PoundingTheStreets · 26/09/2015 00:48

I'm really enjoying this. Smile (as if anyone cares Grin)

Haven't had a discussion on feminism in years and I am not an academic or expert by any stretch.nThis may mean I am terribly out of date so apologies for that. All I'm giving is my own opinion.

I agree with pretty much everything I've ever read about radical feminism in terms of its critique of current society. I think it's dreadful that the subjugation of women is gleefully perpetuated through state laws and the media. Through things such as no GDP value placed on childcare (even though paying others for it is prohibitively expensive and many successful men have built their careers off the back of their SAHM partners). Through men being able to walk away from paying CM with little if any comeback. Through domestic tasks being seen as a woman's responsibility, as evidenced through cleaning products being aimed almost exclusively at women. This takes out so much time from women's lives which they could be using to better effect. Through consistent emphasis on women's appearance above their other abilities. Through women having to demonstrate they made it clear they didn't want sex rather than their rapist having to prove that she made it more than clear she did.

However, I don't necessarily agree that the best way to achieve this is for women to live separately from men so that men are forced to see how much of this male-dominated world is built of the back of the labour of women. The realist in me says that getting enough women to believe that to make it a reality is just never going to happen. Instead, I think changing the law, a bit at a time, is more likely. Change rarely happens overnight and revolutions tend to involve a lot of collateral damage that is unnecessary.

Autumnnights1 · 26/09/2015 00:49

Not sure anyone cares about your links at the mo. we are having a debate where links havent been used for a change.

Lweji · 26/09/2015 00:51

Except for the OP (you may have missed it), my post was directed at it, dismissing the source (a cartoonish collection of quotes). Not sure why you decided to pick on it.

MaudGonneMad · 26/09/2015 00:53

'Radical' is not appropriate? Not seemly? Funny how the old tropes get trotted out again and again.

Autumnnights1 · 26/09/2015 00:56

Im not a wordsmith by any means. I do however know when someone is being passive aggressive or indeed just aggressive Grin you have just make my night Pounding.

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 26/09/2015 00:58

Autumn the op has been absent for ages and has now appeared to post the quotes upon which she based her opening post. They are a list of quotes on Pinterest. That is what Leweji is talking about. The thread has not moved beyond links, it is based on a link.

To answer your question to me:

things we need that are major

  • a shift away from the pornification of society, which is damaging both our boys and girls
  • equal pay for equal work
  • an end to rape, sexual assault and domestic violence
  • equal access to education for all girls, in all countries
  • a complete end to FGM
  • an end to rape as an instrument of war
  • free access to abortion and contraception to all women everywhere.

I could go on, but I should prob go to bed. But all these things are considered radical in society currently. Isn't that sad?

Autumnnights1 · 26/09/2015 01:04

Lonny, this is a fast moving thread at this time of night. We know about all that. We know about many things surely. But being a "radfem" on this website and chuffing about it is rude and not on. To make out you are a better woman, is not on and that's what I got from this. So she is not unreasonable in this instance.

YANBU OP.

Autumnnights1 · 26/09/2015 01:07

We dont need links to speak on site as people Grin

Autumnnights1 · 26/09/2015 01:16

My main difference with a man is my ability to give birth to a child, nurture and send him/her off into the world as a rounded, grounded human being. Im am honoured to be able to do this.

So lets not forget the sheer essence of being a woman.

Autumnnights1 · 26/09/2015 01:25

The rad fem click on topic, for want of a better word has become a supposedly elite unapproachable thing to post on. Not on. Its become scary. Why is that?

You are no better than any other woman.

Autumnnights1 · 26/09/2015 01:41

Water puts out fire.. Fire cannot ignite in water. which do you want to be Grin

Lweji · 26/09/2015 01:59

To stop Autumn from talking to her/his self, I have to say I have enjoyed reading this thread and learning about Radical Feminism.

CaramelCurrant · 26/09/2015 03:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

DoctorTwo · 26/09/2015 06:42

There are feminisms. Radical is one of those. There's a reason the word radical is used; it means something, thought has gone into what that is and why it's important. Things like prioritising an end to sexual violence, DV and rape; reproductive rights; challenging stereotypes, objectification and the under valuing of women's labour relative to men's labour. There's nothing inherently aggressive in that.

Buffy, if that is radical feminism then consider me an ally. It's exactly what I've tried to instill in my DCs.

I do not find the Feminist section elite or exclusionary at all, just intelligent sparky cool women, who challenge and educate.

Same here Caramel. FWR has taught me loads, the main thing being it's not their job to educate me about feminism. :o

nooka · 26/09/2015 07:38

Returning to the OP for a second, he/she stated that there were a group of high profile, intelligent women with power and influence who are radical feminists who think that men are inherently evil and to be feared.

On being challenged the OP then linked to a pinterest list of quotes. Some of the quotes come from people who are (or were in some cases - six of the ten women quoted are in their 70s/80s and three are dead - Valerie Solanas for almost 30 years!) important to the feminist movement, but outside of it are probably almost completely unknown. Several of the quotes come from books written in the 70s when surely we can all agree that there was absolutely a need to fight for radical change, even if you think that things are all fine now.

The quote from Marilyn French is not only old (she died six years ago, and the quote is from 1977) but isn't something she ever said but was a line from a novel.

Generally older women are invisible, and dead women probably more so. That leaves Sharon Stone. She's not been in a major movie for ten years or so (too old in her 50s for Hollywood) and seems to be a minor activist. Is she really a woman of 'power and influence'?

BuffytheFeminist · 26/09/2015 08:26

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FithColumnist · 26/09/2015 11:01

Radical feminists are the ones who say cowabunga, then?

BigChocFrenzy · 26/09/2015 11:02

"Radical" upsets those who've read in the Fail about all those manhating feminazis frightening the horses
< puts on glasses, looks around thread for manhaters, soothes the equines >

"Radical" is more like the opposite of conservative: real change instead of basically accepting the status quo.
I'm not satisfied with the status quo, with the violence and disadvantage that women still suffer. Docility didn't bring us our existing rights; that was achieved by past generations of radfems and I am very grateful to them.

Idiots exist everywhere. E.g. being a keen weightlifter myself, this Article is about one of my heroes: a 77-yr-old African-American woman who took up lifting a few years ago and is now lifting massive weights and winning championship medals for several different events.

But the first comment posted under that article was "So many bags under her eyes she could open a luggage shop."
I don't despise all men for that remark, just the sexist idiot who posted it.

Dawndonnaagain · 26/09/2015 11:24

Don't see how you can complain about feminism in any form when the whole of human kind is referred to as 'man'kind. The whole of history 'his' story.
Go away, educate yourself. Then discuss.

BigChocFrenzy · 26/09/2015 11:51

Unusual 1st post under this username Hmm

JackSkellington · 26/09/2015 13:12

YANBU. I'm female and not a feminist, and some (though not all) responses from feminists, when they realise this, can be quite rude to say the least, which is why I usually wouldn't mention it unless asked.

JackSkellington · 26/09/2015 13:17

Should add that I agree with a lot of the principles of feminism, but I think the best way of describing myself is as an egalitarian.

Lweji · 26/09/2015 13:21

How do you define egalitarian and how is it different from feminism that you prefer one to the other if you agree with many feminist points of view?