To think an English teacher should know the correct pronunciation of Glamis?

[susannahmoodie]

As in Thane of......?

Or is it now ok to say "glam-mis"??

I once asked for directions to Beauchamp Place, pronouncing it as if it were a French word (which it is, really) - ie, something like Bow-shon. The very kind woman directed me to Beech'm Place, without emphasising in any way that I'd got it wrong, just a little twinkle in her eye.

There seem to be a number of posters here who know the pronounciation of everything and the value of nothing.

Exactly, ChickenKorma

But on a general note to posters - read Macbeth - see the play (you can rent a DVD) - it is wonderful.

Brilliant weasel

HA HA HA HA HA!

GUESS WHAT i JUST FOUND???

The pronunciation of 'Glamis' in Shakespeare's day was a DISYLLABLE! So it is 'Gla-mis' not 'Glamz'

I have read it and seen it. I don't actually think it is one of Shakespeare's better plays, and I certainly don't believe that the hallmark of a quality degree is having read it. In fact, I suspect it's popularity is mainly due to its amenability to being studied at GCSE level.

Also, the fact that I've seen it is mainly due to the fortuitous fact of having the RSC on my doorstep, and being able to afford their ticket prices. It's not like the play is regularly shown on the TV, is it?

I'm from Angus and have heard it said both ways. (Obviously never with an r in it, only a southerner would do that). No one bats an eyelid either way.

Menzies however... No one seems to be able to agree on that!

And before some pedant points out the errant apostrophe in my previous post, that was my phone autocorrecting.

I did notice it Jeffery but decided to rise above it

Menzies is Ming-iz as I have always understood it.
Up in Scotland the old stationary store chain John Menzies was always known just as 'Ming-is's'.

Jeffrey I am very sorry you have never read Macbeth or seen it performed. I suggest you do so. You have a treat in store.

But it is likely that, if not for this thread, you would be concentrating more on the play than the spelling of 'Glamis', which I think (using the power of the Internet) is only mentioned 4 times in the play.

Belvoir is surely Beever except when it is the name of our managing agent. I find it hard to call them Bell-vwoir which is what they irritating call themselves.
Not such a crime as 'we was', but DGD's new teacher apparently pronounces something as somethink which annoys her no end.

The snobbery here is crazy.

I did English Lang & Lit (yeah yeah, Lit's lesser cousin) at a RG uni and have barely studied any Shakespeare. We did Romeo and Juliet at GCSE. The Merchant of Venice at A Level. At degree level I did one unit in Jacobean literature and our main text was The Revenger's Tragedy (not Shakespeare), though we did read Shakespeare too, just not in as much detail.

Anyhoo, I'm TERRIBLE at pronunciation. Give me any word I don't use day-to-day and I'll probably say it wrong. I'm an excellent editor, proof-reader, etc (maybe not on here, don't jump on my posts!), but reading unfamiliar words... I say them, but I say them based on how I think they sound and always guess incorrectly. Of course I'm not a teacher, but it is possible to study English to a half-decent level and still mis-pronounce things you know.

Saw Macbeth long long ago and would still say Glamis incorrectly.

I imagine it will really piss all the snobs off on this thread to learn that Shakespeare wasn't pronounced anything like we do it now. So it's all moot either way. The fabulous linguists from the Crystal family have actually argued a very valid case that instead of an upper register type RP, the plays would have been delivered in the local London accent at the time and it was more like a brummy/cockney farmer than the sort of accent you all assume. It also transforms the texts and the entire feel for each play.

And yes, I have an English degree. No, never heard it pronounced. I specialised in Romeo and Juliet and A midsummers night dream, linguistics, creative writing and Chaucer. Apologies for you for not knowing how to pronounce a single place name from a play......will have to tell my assessor that I am in fact NOT "a dynamic teacher that successfully engages er students to get consistently high results".

Now please, get over yourselves!

Glamis thou art ,and Cawdor, and shalt be what thou art promised...
It sends shivers down my spine, the start of Lady M's road to Hell.

In support of my last assertion - there are lots of references, but this is from a Longman study text for Indian students.

So the teacher is actually correct.

Much obliged, Twm . I'd also like it made a matter of public record that Mumsnet does not allow me to insert the appropriate possessive apostrophe into my username. Effectively forcing me to look like one of those illiterate oafs who graduated from a former Poly.

" Shakespeare wasn't pronounced anything like we do it now. "

I have heard that in Shakey's day 'asked' would have been pronounced 'axed' which is something that certain people get hot and bothered about when teens use it these days!

I find it more appalling that all these people only learnt to pronounce Glamis because it's in a story!
I have never read Macbeth, nor seen it performed (which isn't really acceptable for a British adult, but ho-hum, I only went to an English RG not Edinburgh, and did science) but I know how to pronounce it because it's a British place name and has a castle.
Does no-one travel within their own country any more?

Ah Pictish I know that, but I know more people, whose name it actually is (and are Scottish) who say MenZees. Even loads who'd go to the clan gatherings seemed split!

If the teacher was busily telling the students that Macbeth had encouraged his wife to kill Duncan or didn't understand how the 'man of woman born' prophesy works, I'd be concerned as it shoes a fundamental lack of understanding of the text, the fact that she has a non-standard pronunciation of a place name is neither here no there, it doesn't fundamentally alter the students' understanding of the plot or the motivation of the characters.

It is also interesting that some of the sneering is coming from people who are are insisting that the correct pronunciation 'glarmz' which might be considered equally wrong as 'glamiss' given that within Scotland it is almost universally pronounced 'glamz'.

I always pronounce Menzies as Ming-is, but the shop is John Men-zees. No idea why!

" forcing me to look like one of those illiterate oafs who graduated from a former Poly." oh you know that was just tongue in cheek. I should talk, I graduated with a lower second from a tiny far provincial uni that was incredibly easy to get into

Did anyone even read my last post?