Does my 6 year old DS have aspergers? What should we do next?

[Burgundycoralpink]

Hi everyone,

After a difficult Reception year DS has just started in Y1 with the same ongoing problems with his behaviour. I think it's getting worse.

Brief history of him. He was clingy and cried a lot as a baby. Really difficult to settle and very fussy. He got along well at nursery but teachers noted he has difficulty transitioning between activities. He hates leaving something if he hasn't finished it. They accommodated him well and understood him.

Apart from that no problems at nursery. Fast forward to school, a much bigger and noisier environment and he has struggled. He doesn't always do what the teachers ask him to. He is physical at playtime and lunchtime, and sometimes in the classroom. Scribbling on his work or someone else's, pushing, name calling, annoying behaviour. Not stopping when asked to.

Have had a meeting with class teacher and SEN. They don't think we need to look at SEN. They think he is immature and lacks impulse control. He is a September birthday. They want me to continue talking to him at home but no other action will be taken. SEN said that at our school they decide if a child "needs support or is choosing to behave like this". My DS is choosing to behave like this according to their observations. Therefore they will not be offering any additional support.

His other personality traits are:

Very loving and cuddly
Very polite, beautiful manners
Extremely articulate
Lies awake after lights out, needs less sleep than other children his age
Is brilliant one to one, very engaged in conversation
Can go on and on describing something without realising he needs to edit and has lost other persons interest
Bad loser
Excellent with number/sums
Excellent with Lego and Puzzles from a very young age
Excellent memory
Loves a couple of subjects but does show interest in all sorts of things
Naturally inquisitive
Finds change difficult - it makes him behave more rigidly
Very grumpy when he's anxious or unhappy
Not at all intimidated by adults and talks to them as though he is talking to another child
Likes to get his own way, dictate the game, is bossy with other children
Finds it difficult to have friends in his bedroom/space/sharing his toys
Hates loud noises (motorbikes, sirens) and noisy places
Very good at concentrating for long periods

I suspect he has mild aspergers but know very little about the condition. School do not think it's a special need at this point. What should I do next? I would like his observed by an ed psych but do I need schools cooperation and back up for this?

Vaticancameos we had the same with the infants school our son attended.It was madness,in the end we moved schools and spoke to our DR's and at 8 years old he was diagnoised with asd,I'd seen the signs at 18 months.

The school we moved him to were so much better and so is his secondary school now.His younger sister goes to the second school we sent him to she's also asd but her's is much more severe than our sons and they've been amazing.

Even if he is asd and gets a diagnosis it isn't going to change anything much.

I disagree. A diagnosis may take a year or two to come by at best, and is invaluable in all sorts of ways. I can't wait to have a diagnosis for ds - even if it is not what I expect.

Gudrun the not being able to deviate from a plan is something that was very strong in our son when he was younger,with age and help and support that is one aspect that have really improved for our son and for years we thought that part of him would never change.

Don't know if you've spoken to anyone from here OP but they were amazing with us www.google.co.uk/search?q=scabies+images&biw=1920&bih=956&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAWoVChMIoP_FhdfzxwIVwTcUCh0cUw8w

And this is another place that's been helpful in the past
www.autism.org.uk/?gclid=Cj0KEQjwvdSvBRDahavi3KPGrvUBEiQATZ9v0Pk1t0b1ekEki3NhZRCqsEhS-XmIVbHztJNECnyuHi0aAm438P8HAQ

Oh good news, thank you for that

He is so anxious
I wonder sometimes if it isn't autism but OCD. Or a mixture of the two...

I'm glad your son has been able to relax a bit in that way.

Not the first one sorry that was for someone else on another thread I meant this one w3.cerebra.org.uk/

I've thought for years that alot of adults and children that are asd also suffer from OCD.

I have OCD myself,I think mine is from learnt behavior as my Nan and my Mum both suffered with OCD.It's a bloody pain in the arse it really is

Impressed at people's diagnosis skills over the internet...and now I'll go for it!

FWIW, he sounds almost identical to my 6yo DS who was diagnosed with autism (asperger's or high-functioning type) a year ago.

The only major difference is that DS gets very stressed and lashes out at the other kids when he is triggered.

As others have said, DS was doing mostly fine - although we had some concerns - until the demands of school appeared to completely outstrip his ability to cope with them, and then he very quickly unravelled at the end of the first term in reception (no other word I can think of to describe it - and you will be in no doubt if you see it).

There is plenty in what you have described to warrant you asking your GP for a referral for assessment - if that is what you want to do. You don't have to, of course, if you don't think it will benefit him to have a label. It might encourage school to put some different approaches in place, e.g. social skills groups, calm down time rather than time out.

I would go to GP and ask for referral to Child Development Clinic. Ignore advice that the SENCO will know what to look for - they are just teachers who have taken on that role, no specialist knowledge and certainly no specialist training in ASD, most definitely no diagnostic training.

My friend's DS has ASD and school saw no need for referral, apparently, even after diagnosis they had difficulty accepting his condition and that his problems weren't behavioural.

I know... my mother's OCD was dreadful and I suffer with it too. Not hand washing or physical issues so much but the thoughts, and spelling words in my head the whole time, making sure they are spelled correctly and can't be turned into other, more 'dangerous' words by mistake.

I know that sounds nuts. I digress but I kind of get where ds2 is coming from more than my NT children.

Not sure what area you in,but where we are there is a specialist unit www.dingley.org.uk/ these people were amazing.Even if it doesn't cover your area or your childs age it's well worth giving them a ring as they should be able to tell you how to go about getting a diagnosis.

Camhs in our area can be a bit hit and miss,where we are they tend to work better with teenagers and mostly with teens that are self harming,have dependency issues with alcohol/drugs,have suffered abuse or our school refusers.

No doesn't sound nuts to me I do the same.

Ask your GP for a referral to a developmental paed.

My son has been diagnosed with asd. Sometimes it seems very obvious, other times I wonder if he even has it! A diagnosis does give the opportunity for more help.

As others have said, go to the GP. I am involved with diagnoses and the process is not all school referred, in fact schools are the fewest referral points here. It can take 18 months to two years for a full diagnosis so please don't go hoping for any sort of instant answer.
Good Luck.

Another thing to consider is maybe glue ear. A lot of primary school children suffer from this and it isn't picked up on and they are just labelled as naughty kids.

Your son maybe not be hearing the warning that all the kids hear when the tell them they are moving on to the next activity so doesn't realise he's got to finish so its a surprise to him when suddenly he's got to finish up and move on. (Assuming they give them some sort of warning) It may also explain why he's okay at home but not at school as there will be background noise to contend with.

My DD has this and has been given hearing aids and the change in her behaviour has been amazing. I think the day was a constant struggle for her and it made her moody and tired. Now her behaviour has improved massively. The only thing I can't work out is if she's half deaf how can loud noises bother her but they do?!

Please someone correct me if im wrong but...

high functioning autism = autism with average or above average intelligence. Nothing to do with percieved "coping" ability

Aspergers = HFA with no developmental delay. Again, nothing to do with percieved "coping" ability

As others have said - it's pretty difficult to tell from a few words over the internet... but I know as a mum who's struggling, that's not what you need to hear.

However, do not take the words of school as gospel. At the end of the day you know your child best. Our school current head (recently changed) and SENCO (recently changed) thought there were "no issues" with our son. Fortunately he had already been referred under the previous SENCO and Head - he's recently been diagnosed with HFA (what would have been called Aspergers a few years back) and Auditory Processing Disorder. He shares some, but not all of your list of issues. But there is a famous saying: if you've met one person with Autism, you've met one person with Autism.

I am reading a book at the moment by Tony Attwood (kind of global guru on Aspergers) and he reckons those with Aspergers 'cope' in one of four ways. Because they are bright they generally 'can' put on a pretence of coping, at least to begin with. From those descriptions your son would fit one of those profiles, one of the less constructive ones. It might be worth reading up yourself, a lot, on your son's issues, because even without a formal diagnosis this can help you: firstly to help him with strategies that might work but are different from the normal run of the mill parenting strategies, but secondly to help educate you more about the condition so that you can decide if it fits and therefore fight any necessary battles. Because if you do go down the diagnosis route, there will be battles to fight. Resources are tight and so if you don't have school on side it's going to be harder (believe me, and I originally DID have school on side - they've had to eat humble pie now, it's quite gratifying to watch ;) ).

You know your son best. You will know all the little idiosyncrasies that have developed as he's developed. Start recording them, in bullet point, to enable you to have these things at your finger tips when you speak to others. Go to your GP and ask for a referral. But be prepared it won't be a straight road.

Also keep in mind that yes diagnosis opens some doors: e.g. school now have to recognise it and put in place the recommendations from his 'reports' e.g. where he sits etc, and interventions. But it also doesn't change who he IS. The diagnosis knocked me sideways. But it doesn't change who DS is - and that's what we need to work with. To give him the tools and strategies to cope in a non-ASD world. He won't always be in the classroom, but he needs to know how to cope with his anxieties (which are a huge presenting factor) and I view it as my job as his mum to help him as best as possible with those. We have to work with who he is, the same I do with my NT children. I might spend more time reading with one of those who struggles, whereas DS will get time practicing and receiving specific instruction, on social communication. He has to be taught what others can do easily. And that's hard. Start working on that, because whether or not he has a diagnosis he clearly needs help there.

Sorry this is long, but I hope some of it helps.

iamaboveandbeyond - I was told at son's recent diagnosis, that HFA is what would have been termed 'Aspergers' a few years ago. They don't diagnose Aspergers any more. Because it doesn't reflect the fluid nature of a spectrum. However, in my reading and research I'm definitely focussing on Aspergers as within literature etc that term is used more frequently to describe HFA than HFA itself - presumably because literature hasn't yet caught up with the diagnostic vocabulary.

PolterGoose - that's interesting because that contradicts what we were told at DS' assessment: he was diagnosed as HFA and we were told it is what would have been called Aspergers 5 years ago - which they no longer diagnose. They noted that there was no language delay but he does have very specific language issues e.g. a very pedantic style and a vocabulary hugely at odds with his age.

Our dd was given a diagnosis of High Acheiving ASD (and coordination difficulties) this year. The implication was that the Paediatrician would have prev used Aspergers as the diagnosis but it was no longer allowed. So much confusion over diagnostic terminology is really unhelpful

Op you should consult your GP for referral if you are concerned. The schools support is very helpful so you will need to be prepared for some push back if you don't have supporting evidence for your request for assessment. Good luck, the diagnosis has helped us and dd as she understands herself better and we also have a depth of understanding that has made the mystery of dd clearer, wouldn't change her for the world.

I am in a similar situation with DS (nearly 6), and do not know what to do.

He is very anxious about anything different, especially involving other children. Upon meeting up with other children (playdates, etc) he gets very overexcited jumps around and screams, showing off, wanting fir people to look at him and/or laugh. He then quickly burns out within half an hour or so, and hits some stumbling block (e.g. hurts himself, is told off for something, denied something, other child "grasses" on him, friend does not want to play what he wants to play), after which cries and demands to go home or for other child to leave, as he is "too tired" (he sleeps enough, so that should not be an issue, unless mental "tiredness").

Very anxious about going to school in beginning of term. Had to be dragged there. Still anxious on some mornings. Usually copes reasonably well at school, although occasionally lashes out at other if he feels very anxious and trapped (especially in queues during transitional times).

Says he hates school work, although ahead in most subjects and vastly ahead in reading. Hates lunchtimes, as generally does not feel hungry at school, but is pressured to eat something in the busy environment of school dining hall.

Does not want to do any after school activities, as just wants to come home. Gets distressed at tge mention of any classes he might be interested in. Has luckily agreed to do a mini athletics class during lunchtime on thursday (mainly because he is happy he can just leave the lunch hall quickly).

Hates loud noises and babies/small children.

Was relatively late to walk and talk, although was still within the normal spectrum. Did point, etc. Almost incapable of playing alone since being a baby. Could not be left for any length of time without screaming. Now needs me to play with him if he is not on hus tabket or watching tv.

Always denies any wrongdoing, even when caught red handed. Gets very angry at anyone "grassing" on him. A few insidents of him weeing in inappropriate places, e.g. mop bucket.

Dislikes going out. Never wants to go to the park, and moans about walking (we have not got a car), but scared of learning to cycle. Gives up very easily, gets anxious, frustrated, scared, angry.

I veer between thinking that he can't help the way he is and I am trying my best, and thinking he is a spoiled brat and it's all my fault. I feel so confused. To add to tge mix, I suffer from anxiety and depression, as well as an eating disorder (hidden). Both of DS's grandfathers are strongly suspected of having HFA (one admits to it very readily), and DS's younger cousin is suspected to be on the spectrum, as well (at the age of 3.5 has very few (unclear) words, flaps, hates change, prone to physical violence, content to sometimes line up cars on his own for hours at a time).