..to wonder if it's possible to get over this fear of childbirth?

[Runningupthathill82]

I'm 21 weeks with DC2 and terrified of giving birth again.

When I was pregnant with DS I was a staunch believer in hypnobirthing, the power of breathing exercises and the capability of my own body.

I practised yoga positions in the run up to labour, and had lots of breathing exercises memorised. I honestly believed that the birth wouldn't be that painful unless I allowed it to be so; that my body knew what it was doing, and that being a very fit and positive person would get me through.

Anyway, a 24-hour back to back labour later, ending with forceps, and I now know this not to be the case.

DS was in a very bad way when he was born, and was readmitted to hospital twice as he couldn't learn to feed. I also was very ill during the birth and afterwards. I then struggled to heal and still have ongoing issues with incontinence from the forceps.

We delayed ttc #2 because I was so scared of doing it again, but now it's happening. I'm terrified. I don't want me and my baby to almost die again. I don't want to feel so out of control and helpless.

Has anyone who has been in a similar position got any sensible advice? I can't go back to yoga/hypnobirthing etc because I know it didn't help last time, and I don't want to be the voice of doom for first-timers. But then I don't know if asking for an ELCS would be best either. I'm really stuck.

What I'll say is this...

Every birth is very different. Doesn't mean your second experience is going to be the same as your first.

They say that your second child is quicker then your first. Mine certainly was. 5 hours from start to Finnish.

Worrying about it really isn't going to help. You have to do it, so just let your body take over and deal with it at the time.

Your not going to die and you didn't last time. Your going to have a beautiful baby after all this and every time you get anxious, think this thought.

I had a horrendous 1st birth but a (as nice as they can be) uncomplicated second birth- and he was back to back.

Good luck OP. When your in labour..you won't be the only one..there will be someone hating it just as much as you

I had a horrendous back to back, forceps/emergency/nearly a c-section with DD (now rising 7). It was the most awful, painful experience of my life. We both nearly died. I had to see a consultant during my nextbpregnancy, and had to be debriefed on DDs birth from my midwife. I still get nightmares and flashbacks.

When I went into labour with DS (now rising 5), I was panicking that it would be the same. But honestly, it couldn't have been more different. My midwives were tyrannical angels (i.e. telling me exactly what to do, explaining what I was feeling, telling me off when I used too much energy shouting etc), and I had pethidine. Our son was born calmly and the pain was different. Its like my body knew what to do. My most vivid memory is DP laughing as they put our son on my chest. He was so relieved that it had gone so well.

Speak to your midwife. She'll be able to advise better than any internet forum. But definately trust your body.

I'll add...I had forceps with first...he wasn't back to back....bo forceps with second, who was back to back.

I don't think I properly healed after DD1, pain etc. After DD2 and being stitched up the second time, I healed properly and got better, no more pain now. So it could be a lot better for you this time.

Please speak to your midwife, and ask for a debrief if you haven't already had one.

I'm so sorry you had such an awful birth, but please try and remember that this labour is likely to be completely different. Have you thought about pain relief to help you cope should you need it?

I think I'd be be pushing very hard for a CS.

Can you request a CS?

I mentioned my fears to the midwife at my 16 week appt and she said it was too early to talk about it, and to raise it again at my next appt, which is 28 weeks.

She was kind and polite but quite dismissive, in a "heard it all before" kind of way.

I think I want a CS if this baby is back to back, but I guess there's no way of knowing until much closer to my due date. But I don't know if I would "qualify" for a CS anyway.

Thanks to all those who have commented so far. This has got me so wound up that I'm getting teary just reading the thread!

In terms of pain relief, I'd be happy to have anything and everything!

I was anxious about my second, as DS1 was back to back, a long labour, he got stuck, had to have a section after 2 hours of pushing.

I was offered another section but there is only a 20 month gap so I had to be able to lift toddler DS1 after the birth.

I had a VBAC and it was a quicker labour, and although painful, a completely different experience, and I managed a vaginal birth.

Ask your midwife about it, but mine suggested things to help back to back, like sitting for about 15 minutes a day on a high back chair, but the opposite way round so you are facing the back of the chair, the positioning helps.

It worked for me as DS2 wasn't back to back.

It's perfectly normal to be worried but as others said, no 2 births are the same.

I'm sorry this happened to you OP. I think you are very brave to go again. My DC will remain an only as my DH and I cannot put ourselves through it again. (52 hour back labour, forceps, serious damage to both of us, infections etc.) I will say though that my DSIS had very similar to me but went again and had a good VB with number 2 and even better with number 3. Personally I would ask for an ELCS. Good luck, I really feel for you.

I had a hideous forceps delivery and knew I didn't want to do that again. Asked to see the consultant at 24 weeks and she booked me for an elective CS. Ask for a consultant appt to review your previous birth and explain your worries, don't be put off if the MW are reluctant.

I was in a similar position. I felt so much better once it was agree with the consultant that as soon as labour strayed off the normal, manageable path there'd be no messing with other options, it was straight to complete knock out and C-section. But my second labour went to pot in a different way. DS arrived so easily and quickly that he was born in the street as the paramedics desperately tried to drag me into the back of the ambulance.

I gave birth by C/Section. But with a natural birth I'd be more worried about the embarrassment of them seeing my bits, yes I know they've seen plenty but not mine they ain't. Anyone I've said that to says. Oh you don't give a shit.
Would you not consider the epidural. I had it was in full blown labour but slept through most of it, need the c\section due to only dilating 1cm and having pre-eclampsia. I'd recommend it, there are no prizes for bravery.

i think it helps the mws if you can work out exactly what it is you are scared of. With my first, everything was done to me, presented as a done deal and i didnt know i could say no. i had quite a straight forward induced birth, but felt v out of control and not listened to re pain relief.

When i was pg with dc2 i switched onto a known mw scheme where i could be reasonably sure that i would deliver with one of 2 mws. They wrre v understanding and wrote lots on my notes in case it wasnt one of them at the delivery. The physical side of birth was more traumatic than the first, but because i was consulted and had options discussed with me it was absolutely fine.

Are you scared of labour with no pain relief? Scared of potential damage to your body? I think a debrief eould really help.

All births are different.

Are you the kind of person who likes to know everything that's going on or not? If so (I am of the 'knowledge is power' school) then getting your notes form last birth and asking for a debrief will help you. It will help you see the immense number of variables and maybe explain some of what was going on and seemed so scary at the time. Independent midwives will go through your notes with you for a small fee and I think this would be helpful for you.

Also consider the birth plan thing: I think a lot of first time mums are romantic about what they want, and are encouraged to write a plan to this end at antenatal classes.

I would say that you should write a birth plan, but rather than a 'fairy story' write a 'choose your own adventure'* style plan covering all eventualities. This can make you feel more in control of whatever situation the birth throws at you, and feel happier about holding off on choices or changing your mind ( I don't want to be induced today, I might tomorrow). I've had the most extreme ends of birth (EMCS, home birth with twins) and when I wrote a 'take no prisoners' plan second time around I felt much happier, and I knew that even if I had a GA, EMCS, and the DTs ended up in ICU I would feel that I had considered it and thought of my preferences (DP go with baby, make sure he gets skin to skin if I can't, etc etc)

You can change your midwife to someone more sympathetic.
AIMS is very good for advice on debreifing birth trauma
best of luck to you.

*I'm dating myself here - google it!

I think a good talk with your midwife will help but I would say that this birth may well go fine. A baby being back to back on its own doesnt always mean a terribly difficult labour - especially if its not your first. My 4th dd was back to back and came out with one hand over face and I had NO idea anything was different until the midwife and dh mentioned it abotu an hour later!.

I would really try and seperate out what happened last time to this time it is a different baby, different body (you have now successfuly given birth before!) and it will be a different situation and labour.

Thanks, all.

I'm definitely the sort of person who likes to know what's going on, and why. I don't like to be kept in the dark and would much prefer it if someone had said to me, from the outset, "look, this baby is back to back, you're not progressing quickly, and he might start to struggle - probably best you get out of the pool, turn that bloody music off and get within shouting distance of a consultant."

Instead, I was in the pool for hours and hours, not progressing and in indescribable pain, with no clue as to what was going on. I didn't know I wasn't progressing and that things weren't going as they should.

I mean, I had the inkling that something wasn't "normal" as the pain was all in my back and so overwhelming. But to discover after more than a day of full-blown labour that DS was no closer to being born as basically his head was just grinding against my backbone, was psychologically really hard.

Not long after that, they discovered DS was in distress and my own heart rate was far too high. So it all went from dark rooms and gas and air, to panic stations, prepping for a EMCS and interventions, which was a shock.

One of the things that upset me the most after DS's birth was the feeling of powerlessness.

Through the yoga and the hypnobirthing I'd been led to believe that I could take control and, without fear, my birth experience would be what I made it. So when it wasn't like that at all, I felt I'd failed.

I also still feel upset by the fact that I don't remember DS being born, or being put on me for the first time, as I was so out of it by that point (the diamorphine was to blame for that, I imagine). Again, it wasn't what I expected. I hoped he'd be born, we'd do skin to skin, he'd feed.

So when, instead, he had to be resuscitated, I was too out of it to know what was happening, and then he couldn't feed, that was a real shock. I'm not naive, I know things don't always go to plan, but I'd bought into the whole natural birth thing absolutely wholesale. There was no discussion of births like mine at all in hypnobirthing or yoga, and very little in antenatal classes, other than to say they were "rare." Which they're not, not really.

Sorry, this is so long. This time I want to feel in control. I will have any pain relief offered and just want what is best for my unborn baby. I just don't know what that is, an ELCS or another go at a vaginal birth.

Thanks for reading this far, if you're still with me!

OP, you are not alone. I was a midwife for 25 years and your situation is very far from rare. It's a tricky one to advise on because there are so many variables with labour. In the majority of cases a second labour and delivery is far quicker and easier ( not pain free, just easier) second time around. The first birth is doing the hard work which you benefit from second time around. The fact that you did have a vaginal birth does demonstrate that you are physically capable of doing so. However, there are never any guarantees and a leap of faith to some extent is required. The back to back position is also a bit of a red herring because a baby can turn quite easily sometimes, especially when not the first labour.

Second labours also tend to have much shorter latent phases with the cervix both shortening and dilating at the same time.

The 'fail safe' option is to persuade your obstetrician that you need a LSCS and get it booked for 39 weeks. The snag here is that you have major surgery, all the attendant risks and pain when you might have had a lovely straightforward birth. Tricky. Nobody can know.

Perhaps the safest solution is to plan with your obstetrician and agree that labour is closely monitored and any deviation from norm results in LSCS sooner rather than later. If this is clearly recorded in your notes it should be adhered to by the staff working on the day. There are many cases of women who feel more empowered and safer in that they know they will get the CS without a fight but actually have a great birth and are happy to have avoided surgery.

You need to request a meeting with your obstetrician at 28 weeks for a discussion. Your midwife may be very kind and so on but simply cannot make the decisions so you need to see the doctor. Keep an open mind but be clear that you cannot entertain a repeat of last time.

And finally at the bloody idiotic idiom of hypno birthing and the notion that you can breathe it all better. No doubt it works when all is going well but in cases like yours it leads to a sense of failure when in reality you have given birth to a beautiful baby, surely a wonderful and miraculous achievement and thank goodness for modern medicine when it is needed.

Good luck and best wishes.

I'm 17 wks with 1st pregnancy. I know that no matter how hard I prepare its going to hurt like hell and may all go tits up but am hoping for the best (whilst trying to keep in mind I could need intervention)! Matilda's advice seems really good but may I also add that I just bought Juju Sundins, Birth Skills book which seems to have some damn good advice in it for pain management. I bought it on the advice of other mumsnetters and its so practical and doesn't try to persuade you that it won't hurt. She also doesn't suggest that needing medical help with the pain is bad. give it a go, it may help and can't hurt! Good luck! I hope you get the birth you want and just because it happened the way it did last time, doesn't mean it will again! Xx

Matilda, that's incredibly helpful. Thanks so much.

Also, thanks AmyLou, but - as for Juju Sundin, I read that to death first time round, along with several other books of its ilk.
I tried and tried to use those techniques, but with the birth that I had, it was about as useful as a chocolate kettle. In fact, less so - I could've eaten the chocolate kettle...

Nope .. It took me 7 years to be brave enough to do it again .. I begged for a c section .. It was much better although I'm glad I don't have to do it again. Good luck .

Op can I ask which hypnobirthing course you followed?

I'm 35 weeks with my first and have been using the Maggie Howell books and cds. I find them to be rather more 'medical' than a lot of other ones out there. they don't lie to you that it will be painless, and a constant message throughout is however your baby is born- you have done well and brought your baby into the world.

I definitely agree with Matilda some hypnobirthing books I've leafed through would make me feel like a total failure if I couldn't just breathe my baby out. I avoided those at all costs.

Instead, I was in the pool for hours and hours, not progressing and in indescribable pain, with no clue as to what was going on. I didn't know I wasn't progressing and that things weren't going as they should.

This sounds like quite poor quality care too OP- Were they checking your cervix for dilation?

I really hope things go better for you this time round, I'm sure they will as you know what type of person you are and whats important to you in labour.

This might help? I think she does workshops too.
birthtalk.org

I hope you find support and a way through this. My 2nd birth helped heal my 1st but its still there in the back of my mind.

Sorry this was who does workshops birthingabetterworld.co.uk