To feel there's something 'wrong' with DD1 at school?

[dontrunwithscissors]

I'm sorry--this will be a long post, but I don't want to drip feed.

DD1 is 8 and has just gone into P4 (in Scotland). She's a bright, articulate, and friendly girl. Halfway through P1, a teacher contacted me and said that she was struggling with reading and they would give her extra support through a new reading programme called 'Read, Write, Inc.' I was promised regular updates, which never happened.

She has continued to struggle with her reading, although she enjoys doing it. I'm really sad to admit that we haven't done as much to support her as we could have. I was very poorly and in/out of hospital during her first 3 years at school. We did spend time with her, but there were some points where DH struggled to keep everything going. DH and I both worked FT. He was in a terrible, bullying company. `I went into her school a couple of times last year to speak to the learning support teacher. I wasn't impressed. She mentioned possible dyslexia and that she would look into this, but later said she wasn't dyslexia. I asked her about DD1's reading age a year ago and whether she was catching up. The teacher said she doesn't know as she has not way of assessing this

She's been in P4 a few weeks and it's clear that she's struggling with all of her work. She's very unhappy and said she's 'not school material' to me last night DH was made redundant 5 weeks ago and I'm much better health-wise. We've had much more time to spend with her on schoolwork. She continues to go to Read, Write, Inc, but that's only 2 x 30 mins a week.

My gut feeling is that there's something else going on. She really struggles with her concentration. She's always been a child who cannot filter out noise or stimulation. She suffers from insomnia and is quite an anxious child. She's very sensitive to other people's emotions and can sometimes feel quite overwhelmed by all these emotions. I feel that her poor concentration is a big part of the problem. She's said to me that she struggles to follow her teacher's instructions because she can't remember them long enough. She works very slowly and gets upset when she doesn't finish her work.

WIBU to go to the school and ask them to make more effort to assess her for additional learning support? I feel she's been pushed aside because she's quiet and doesn't cause trouble. Is this a suitable situation to ask her to be assessed by an educational psychologist?

What are her motor skills like? Quite a lot of what you say overlaps with my dyspraxic teen. Though Dyslexia / Dyspraxia overalap a lot.

Do you know what her phonics is like? If she didn't grasp phonics in early years, when you didn't have the time/space to practice, then it could be holding her back. As I understand it, RWInc is good for learning in infants, but perhaps not so good for remdial stuff in Juniors.

Children who don't know their phonics can hit a wall later as they can't decode or guess newer longer words.

Regular practice at appropriate level is also key. We still listen to my y6 read out loud.

Thank you. I've been unsure how to approach this. I'm thinking now that I will ask for a joint meeting with her teacher and the learning support teacher. Express my concerns, including her emotional difficulties. Would it be appropriate to ask at that point that she sees an educational psychologist? I feel that this has gone beyond the school's ability/willingness to help.

Would I also take her to the GP at the same time, or wait until we see what any assessments show?

My big concern is that I am going to be away with work for 3.5 weeks later this month. It's a one off, but I know it's going to hit DD1 very hard. At least the last week is school holidays so she'll be with my parents, but I'm still dreading it.

My DH being made redundant has been the best thing possible for us. We just had too much to do. The stress of us both working kept making me ill. I know DD1 was affected by the admissions and asked just recently if I would be going back to hospital again. What a mess. I feel so guilty that we haven't been on top of things before now.

Sorry, x posted

moonrise' yes, it's a direct quote.

dayslikethis we are in Dundee. I wondered about tutoring, but we just couldn't afford it now we're living off just my wage. There's no money left over for anything.

Regarding the GP, take a,list of your own concerns. If possible as the school to wrote a letter noting their own concerns. You can go without your DD so you can speak more freely. Unless you pay privately the assessments are likely to take a long time so I wouldn't wait for the school assessments before seeing the GP.

Sorry, missed your post teenandtween. I would say her phonics are reasonably good.

I've found that she will be able to read a difficult word without any trouble, but when the same word comes up a few pages later she can't read it and insists that she's never seen it before. I don't understand what that's about.

My 9 year old son really struggles with lots of things you describe, he has dysgraphia (problems with writing) and suspected dyslexia but school don't test for that (England) is that quite common or just our school? Can you get assessments for dyslexia?

He also has sensory processing disorder.

I had to push to see the schools senco, and got referred then to occupational therapy, who made suggestions to school once they worked out dysgraphia.

School are still useless, but the teacher this year seems switched on, so I have a bit of hope.

Yes push with school, but also go to the GP in the meantime.

I struggle with concentration too, and struggle to follow instructions so I can sympathize, good luck

(May be a little cross posting as took me ages to type this essay out one fingered on the phone after lost first attempt when trying to get the links!)

We are in Scotland and have seen very similar issues with DS (9), best advice is work with the school to create an Individual Learning Plan (name may have changed) which will detail what you and the school want to achieve with DD, what works and doesn't work for her learning style, details about home as this can affect behaviours and then progress made. We review DS's every 6months or so.

Things that have worked for him that you may want to consider if you haven't already

• sight test, DS is slightly long sighted and concentration goes down when the glasses are 'forgotten'!
• extra curricular activities such as Judo as will help develop co-ordination that can help with handwriting
• the Toe by Toe reading program, designed for adults but can work better for some children than the standard phonics Biff, Chip, Kipper etc
• online sites such as Teach My Monster To Read and Sumdog, both used within my DS's school and fun enough to be played at home
• games like Dude Dice www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B00HUAL1DI/ref=pd_aw_fbt_21_img_3?ie=UTF8&refRID=1V748M3QE6J4XXF9PR4J we sometimes swap the dudes for moshi's. Or Rory's Story Cubes www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B003NFJMBM/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?qid=1441716761&sr=8-1&pi=SX200_QL40&keywords=rorys+story+cubes&dpPl=1&dpID=41PS8nFsRfL&ref=plSrch as creating the story makes DS follows a logical path from beginning to end
• I read to DS as he enjoys story's far above his actual reading level and will often do this instead of forcing him into his reading homework with the schools knowledge and agreement as it keeps the pleasure there so reading is not seen as a chore to be fought against all the time

I have thought with DS that he will never get anywhere at points and have nightmares about him being totally illiterate as an adult but he has come on in the past few years, his biggest jump was in primary 4 (still 2 years behind on average but is now able to sight read and sound out more words than ever before)

From what you've said, I'd also suggest APD, as mentioned by a pp. My 11 year old has this and Short Term Auditory Memory Disorder and your post is very familiar (my dd doesn't tick all the boxes but was diagnosed by an audiologist and the more we researched it after her diagnosis the more sense it made) We've had a difficult couple of years since she was diagnosed but we're coming out the other side now and she's doing well in school.

Thanks for the suggestions. DDs coordination is fine. She's very, very artistic and has a fantastic imagination. I can see her being an artist. When she was assessed at the start of P3 (aged 7), she had a vocabulary of 9-10 years but a reading age of 5-6. Part of the teacher's justification for not flagging this up is that it 'averaged' out as 'normal' for her age and was therefore OK.

I was stunned when she told me at the end of P3 that she had no way of knowing whether she'd closed the gap because the council does the reading assessments and the next one wouldn't be done for 2 years. Surely any teacher should be able to tell how well a child has advanced during an academic year? Seriously, if this is the 'best' school in the city, I dread to think what the worst are like.

Sorry, another x post blueshoe---how did you get to the point of seeing an audiologist?

Just a word of consolation. 8 is a good age to make changes, it was the year it turned around for DD1. My DD1 didn't do well at school until she was in a different class with a fab male teacher, who had a different set of priorities to the all female primary school teachers she'd had up to then. She then went on to change schools and had another brilliant teacher. Life changing experience - and one year on, she was top of her class last year.

She is a pretty awful sleeper too. But, get to grips with it all this year if you possibly can even if it is just at home. And what makes a brilliant school for one kid doesn't necessarily make it a brilliant school for you kid.

Thanks wallywobbles--it's difficult to know whether it would help her to switch schools. I'm not sure what factors can make one school different to another. She's very unhappy with her new teacher. DD1 said that when she complains that x & y have distracted her, the teacher tells her to 'stop telling tall tales.' It sounds like she's getting into trouble for not doing things fast enough/not paying attention, which I know she would find very upsetting. She's a kid who never breaks rules (unlike her sister ).

Poor girl!

She may well not be dyslexic, but it does sound like she needs extra support with whatever her issues are.

What makes her anxious? Is she slow at work because she's worried about making mistakes? How does she react when she does make mistakes?

Struggling to read and write will impact a lot of other areas of her work, so see if you can find out if she understands what she's taught in history (for example), but struggles with writing answers to questions etc

Yadnbu to push for help for her. Poor mite, thinking she's not school material

I could of wrote this exactly as was in your position.

As soon as my dd1 started p1 we had issues. She could not differentiate at all between at i and t, no matter how many times we showed her.

She didn't get Reading, her writing was shocking and illegible and similar to the way my sister spelled as a dyslexic child. Straight away I knew there was an issue due to doing my sisters homework with her (she was seven years younger) she has been tested numerous times foe dyslexia and it's come back negative although the school did say they thought she was possibly dyspraxic. however they coukdnt check for that. She couldn't tie laces till about end of p5, still can't do her tie in p7 now.

Anyway, when she was in p4, she suddenly just 'got' reading. She was still quite far behind. She was in bottom group for reading,writing maths. But her writing was still a mess.

P5 came and over the summer she had somehow managed to 'get' writing. It was neater, (the little triangular grips you get can really help) and she rarely made mistakes. She still does when rushing though.

Last year (p6) her teacher said it was more poor concentration she had, hence the reason she struggled with the reading and writing as she'd forget what she'd been doing. She got extra support for maths and it's come on leaps and bounds and she no longer needs it this year.

Our school had something called cogmed that basically was little memory games that has improved her memory alot.

I'd push to get her checked. I forgot to mention I'd also went to my doctor and he referred us to the optometrist up at the hospital where she was checked to see what her eye sight was like further than they can in the opticians and it also checks not just sight but other signs that could indicate a problem. You can also pay privately for an educational psychologist.

No knowledge or experience on the educational side, but have you thought about keeping a sleep diary? Every day write down (you and her) what she was doing before bed, what she ate/drank, what she wore, what her room was like (dark? black out blinds? night light on etc etc) and then note in the morning how she slept. Did she find herself waking and fighting to get her pillows comfy? Does she wake needing the loo.

You may find that there is a pattern - which may help find the cause or a solution. Or at least it will allow you to start tweaking things to see if you can help her get to sleep - maybe soft music would help her drop off? Or ear-plugs to block out any noise. Find your base-line and work from there - changing one thing at a time.

It will not be a quick fix - but it will offer some insight - and if you mention the insomnia to the GP they would probably ask for such info anyway iyswim.

Fix the sleep and some of the other stuff may get a bit easier for her too poor thing.

Thanks for those posts. Her teacher rang me back as I was leaving work. Nobody had passed on details of any of these problems to her, despite being assured that they would. I chatted for a little while anout everything and (as usual) she was surprised by it. Whenever I explain to people how DD1 struggles, they say how happy as outgoing she seems.

I have an appointment to speak with her next week.

Right. Note down that phonecall and who you spoke to and that information wasnt passed on. Some people need to know that someone is keeping tabs on them as motivation to do anything.

Your little girl sounds quite similar to me in some ways when I was younger.

The worrying about others and finding that really difficult I was always the same way,still am now but it has got easier as I've got older,my Mum used to call me her little empath. it's not a bad thing to be but it can feel really scary as a child as you can feel different to those around you.There's alot of informartion online now about helping children and adults that are very empathic.I also had the same thing with my hearing,I still do,if there's background noise and someone trys to talk to me I find it very hard to filter out the background noise.

There's alot more understanding of that kind of hearing problem now than there was years ago,there are even hearing aids now that can help block out the background noises.

Does she get out in the fresh air often?
I never liked school much - being cooped up with 20+ other DCs day in day out not my idea of fun.
Walking in the countryside, playing, cycling was a great break for me.

dontrunwithsissors I see you are in Dundee with me, my best advice is go to the nearest brick wall and bang head against it hard!!

On a more serious note I can probably give you some serious advice.

We've had really good results with this at our school.

It's ??25 a month but first month is free so you could try it out and see if it suits.

And these books are good too.

Youthecat, my childrens school uses Lexia - it's loathed by children and parents, it's so dull!

She sounds SO much like my dd! Even down to the fabulous art skills. However my dd has CP so has always been very well supported in school and I'm sorry your dd hasn't had the same input.

Dd has a sensory processing disorder which causes her problems with retaining multi-step instructions, patterns etc. school have developed strategies to help since this was identified.

Ask your GP to refer to occupational therapy to be assessed for processing disorders. Push push push the school. DD has part time 1:1 and is on school action + with an ILP and has made astounding progress with reading this last year (she's 9). School nurse may also b useful yo you is yours is any cop.

Also, I've had health issues myself the last few years and totally understand how hard it is to just keep head above water never mind help with homework etc. please don't beat yourself up. You're aware there's an issue and you're concerned - you're doing a fab job and this isn't your fault.

Out of all the dyslexia related computer things I've seen, Lexia is the least dull by far. It is repetitive but it needs to be.

I don't run the groups any more, but my year 2 and 3s used to really enjoy it. or maybe that's down to me being fabulous

It is a hard slog for kids with dyslexia. There really is no easy way.