To say thank fuck for Nicola Sturgeon

[Chippednailvarnish]

I can't stand her anti English stance, but at least one political leader is doing something for the refugees...

Hamiltoes - teenagers are never off the fucking Internet. It is the single biggest distraction to learning there is. You talk pure shite and clearly couldn't give a stuff about children with special needs or struggling families as they always had a crap time at school.

SNP seems to have a race to the bottom agenda.

Today 12:36 RJnomaaaaaargh

I cannot express my disgust at the word "feckless" deeply enough. And both of you used it.

I hope that wasn't aimed at me - I merely used that word to highlight how offensive Hamiltoes was for using it. I find that term abhorrent and very bothering.

I am sure being required to sing: 'Scotland my Country and my land of Birth' at almost all assemblies, being 'able write a poem in Gaelic', and to 'discuss the First World War from the perspective of Crofters in Shetland' will be of more use to him, in either profession, than a good solidgrounding in maths and English

No it wasn't a sarcastic comment. It's a statement of what is being taught.It's because certain true Scotspersons still hold a grudge about the Clearances and attribute an importance to crofting and Gaelic neither deserve- including foisting Gaelic place names on parts of Scotland which never spoke Gaelic.

The analysis of the First World War from the point of the crofters is ridiculous. There's not a town or village in Scotland which did not lose men. Ordinary working men, tenant farmers and the sons of "the big hoose". They would have done better reading Lewis Grassington Gibbons' Sunset Song for an analysis of the impact of WW1.

And about Scotland's economy, when those with a 34% pass in HIgher Maths go looking for global work.

Or even more scarily start work here in any job where a knowledge of maths is actually needed.

What part of anything I said equates to me not giving a fuck about children with special needs or struggling families

I have 2 children who I raise myself, work in a career where women have to fight for things male colleagues are handed on a silver platter, and have just finished a HND in the evenings and about to embark on a degree. Pretty much the definion of struggling so don't try to tell me I talk shite about struggling from your high horse.

No queen sorry it was not you, someone else upthread used it. Definitely not aimed at you.

Oh ffs "Lewis Grassic Gibbon" one of Scotland's finest writers. And an internationalist.

You know nothing about my career or background do I would love to know why you think I am on a high horse.

I merely used that word to highlight how offensive Hamiltoes was for using it. I find that term abhorrent and very bothering.

Yes, as I did to highlight the poster befores use of the word.. yet somehow that makes me offensive and you obsolved?

I can see that if I say black you will say white, and me saying black will probably have me labelled as "offensive" on this thread as you can't see past the exact opposite of anything I say.

So with that I'ma flouncin

Hamiltoes I am actually losing the plot as to what your point is as you seem unable to construct a coherent argument to support it - are you an snp speechwriter?

Does the National have a talk forum? Perhaps Hamiltoes is stunned to find not everyone agrees with her?

Hamiltoes

your comments about educational provision for those with SEN being 'the same as 20 years ago under labour' (therefore dont criticise the SNP) doesn't seem to value educational progress and the holding to account of it's providers very highly to me?

The problem I know most about is education.
I am not 'feckless'.
My children are both SEN and non-SEN.
I know parents from across Scotland and our situation is sadly not unique.
These are real problems, documented in the National newspapers of note, and amongst educational bodies.

I would like NS to look at this, as well as committing Scotland to accept more immigrants from Syria (and elsewhere).

My point? I'm quite happy with my childs education and with the curriculum for excellence and with the SNP gov.

This, like many conversations with Nationalists, is pointless. They will never, ever accept any criticism of the SNP and will defend them to the death. Hopefully one day the strange hold they seem to have over half the population will wane but it worries me what they might manage to do until then.

Clear to clarify, I don't think anyone is "feckless" and used the word to echo the previous posters use of the word.

I agree that if thats your experience of education specifically related to SEN then more should be done to help those children. My previous post related to how education relating to a child with SEN can't be used to make the assumption that education is failing every child and is worse now than it ever was purely because of the SNP and NS's time in gov. I was only trying to bring a little persepective in my comparison to 10/15 years ago, and of course we should be trying to do better now than we did then.

Do you know how much box ticking is going on in Early Years in Scotland right now? I would suggest just as much as in SE England...more time spent on admin than teaching/working with children...
It is all well and good saying well parents should be stepping into the gap ...filling in what they aren't being taught at school.
Except that is probably why the gap is widening - because some parents are crap, some will be unable to read and write, some will not give a shit, some will just not realise that their child should know/be taught XYZ by now and they haven't been - the amount of parental support varies enormously.
(And this is not a Scotland only or recent event - believe me I worked in an inner city primary in London 20 yrs ago - we had children turning up at 3 in nappies, unable to use cutlery - but also with no concept of how a book worked. No concept of turning pages, telling stories, letters.)

The PS my DC attends/attended is a good one - I am pleased with the progress they are making. But I never had any worries before they went. Because a long time ago I realised that the most important thing is parental attitude and support. We live in a nice area - there are virtually no children there with anything less than supportive and interested parents.
You can't change the parents - so the only way of helping these children is through the school, education. They need someone to concentrate on the basics with them - teach a child to read and to enjoy reading and they can learn anything. (although we should all be slightly doubtful of the truth of everything on the internet) Instead of concentrating on all the lovely ideas in CfE. Not much point teaching a child how an engine works if they show an interest if they can't read - and whilst you can improve reading etc whilst teaching that they need to know the alphabet at least first. And in a class of 24 children not every child will be interested - so are they supposed to cover everything the rest of the children are interested in? Or do you/can you do that on an individual basis? It is all time taken away from learning things they won't be taught at home. They need more support - TAs etc in the classroom -so they can get more individual attention.

And there are certain areas the schools need to cover...that actually restrict them even more.

And that isn't starting on the requirements of the secondary timetable so many subjects/time requirements they couldn't fit it in the school day in S1 and in S2 they had to drop 'exam' subjects to fit in things like computer studies, business studies, design technology etc - which I am sure could have been covered to a satisfactory degree in less time. (DD1 at a good secondary - spent a lot of these lessons on You tube... which I guess might be an indicator of them having bad teachers - or at least ones not trained for their role -but then hardly surprising as they mustn't have been many around).
I think the most interesting thing about this thread is that people are seeing through the SNP. The back lash seems to be starting. They promised to be all things to all men -they could do it so much better - that is why they are getting criticised. They have had long enough that things should be improving -and they aren't...if anything they are getting worse. And I am hopeful that more people will turn against them. Just before the GE it reminded me of what happened with Blair and the 1997 election - everything was going to be fantastic - look how that turned out....

THey will never, ever accept any criticism of the SNP and will defend them to the death

They really don't do they? Yet it's quite easy to find critical supporters of the other main parties- even the Greens. Remember Robin Harper's criticisms during the referendum? Compare and contrast with the SNP's brushing over of Sillars' nonsensical utterances.

Yes I most definitely agree with the sentiment that the SNP have tried to be "all things to all people".

And I think the GE results this year will have an effect on wether or not people continue to support them or move on.

I'm interested though in who would do a better job? I'm not pretending to know all things about all parties and like I said waaay back in this thread can only judge on the things I have read and seen (which for my entire adult life has appeared to be, tories cutting everything in the name of austerity and the SNP trying to stop the worst of it. I'm not saying thats how it is, I'm saying for a shit load of my generation, that is how things appear.

And I can't see an alternitive party that offers anything credible that has any change of gaining power to do anything. Except maybe if Corbyn manages to change Labour. Although that in itself could prove very interesting as I see very little of Corbyns ideals in KD.

"your comments about educational provision for those with SEN being 'the same as 20 years ago under labour' (therefore dont criticise the SNP) doesn't seem to value educational progress and the holding to account of it's providers very highly to me?"

They're not the same, sadly it is in fact better now...it's not good enough, but it has improved.

I think people are starting to see through all of the SNPs bluster and deflection.

I thought Tony Blair was amazing (the scales eventually fell from my eyes). I will never be taken for a fool by a politician again, subsequently, I now pay much more attention to what they do not what they blithely claim.

They will never, ever accept any criticism of the SNP and will defend them to the death

Not completely true, I for one don't support council tax freezes, or free prescriptions. And there are many like me who I've spoken to.

Hamiltoes, I think any party which will actually give 100% attention on running the country as best it can instead of expending a significant amount of its time, energy and resources on flag waving and constitutional obsessions would be better.

I voted for them in the last couple of elections...not because I support them unwaveringly, but because they're currently the best of a bad lot.

Some criticisms are fair enough, but not everything that doesn't work is because it's under SNP control.

I'd certainly rather NS spent less time in America / China and more time in the UK.
And, whilst she is here, less time criticising the BBC (though certainly it needs it...) and banging on about Independence and more time sorting out Scottish problems.

The SNP do not encourage independent thinking and are pretty ruthless with their own who ask questions.

It took a long long time for anyone official to say anything about the racism being encouraged during the IndyRef.

I also thought TB was a 'good'un'.
NS strikes me as similar - populist, polished and entirely self interested.

I don't know how many times I can repeat that I am also talking about the educational experience of my child who doesn't have SEN and all of their contemporaries?

Sturgeon's recent attack on the BBC was extraordinary. I don't suppose it could have been intended to divert attention from Police Scotland or the unnecessary public subsidy awarded to a hugely successful commercial event? (T in the Park)