Mothers income invisible? Child maintenance

[CocoEnglishChanel91]

Advice please. My boyfriend and I have no children. His son lives with his mum, who earns £20k a year, plus WFT Credits, Child Benefit - and is living with her new partner, a police detective sergeant who earns £50k. Combined household income (including benefits) pushing £80k.

My boyfriend earns £28k per annum, sees his son every week, has great relationship with him. He has to pay over £200 per month to his ex, and has the Child Maintenance people crawling over and vetting his income.

Yet the £80k going into his ex''s household is classed as not being relative. Surely it is?

He's not trying to escape responsibility for paying for his son. Far from it. He's paid consistently from the off (over 15 years ) but it seems ludicrous to me that his ex can have whatever household income she likes and that's not a factor.

It just feels very unfair to be, with everything seemingly weighted on his ex's side.

Why is the parent with care's income not relevant? Doesn't the child have two patents?

From people with experience is what I say about patents with care correct? And could it impact on me if we move in together?

Thanks

J

I also don't agree that £200 is too low an amount when both parents are providing a home for their child.

Do you mean £400 a month is enough to raise a child on? Or do you mean £200 is enough when the other parent is covering the rest?

Those saying £200 is enough how much do you think it costs to raise a child?

Meant to include where does it say the op's partner is providing a home? The child visits his home its not the same as providing a permanent home. And from op's posts he only provides the £200 plus presumably feeds him when he is on contact visits. So the RP is the one mainly providing a roof, utilities, clothes, food, school supplies etc etc etc teens are blooming expensive!

I think £400 a month is enough to spend on the direct costs for one child, like food and clothing. It's not enough to cover childcare or pay for school residential trips and the bigger things that come up when they're older, but expenses fluctuate throughout a child's life. As a basic monthly figure, £400 is not a bad starting point.

Both parents have a responsibility to house themselves and provide a home for their children if they are separated, and if both are doing that, then it don't think the expense of that should be taken into account.

The child visits his home its not the same as providing a permanent home.

The major expense of paying a mortage or rent on a home that your child has a bedroom in are the same whether the child sleeps in that room one night a week or six. So while I know it's not the same, as I am the single parent that does provide the permenant home, financially both parents should be paying for somewhere suitable for them to live with their child.

"I think £400 a month is enough to spend on the direct costs for one child, like food and clothing. It's not enough to cover childcare or pay for school residential trips and the bigger things that come up when they're older, but expenses fluctuate throughout a child's life. As a basic monthly figure, £400 is not a bad starting point."

Why is childcare never considered to be a true cost of raising children? Even the CSA or CMS dont calculate for it.

I live in a relatively cheap area for childcare, housing etc.

A full time childcare place for an under 5 is £3.80ph- 8am-6pm = £830 a month.

Wraparound care at £3.80ph 8-9am and 3-6pm = £330 a month not counting for full time holiday care.

Unless you expect one parent not to work and provide all childcare for free for the other parent then no, £400 doesnt even touch the sides of the cost of raising a child.

Can we please stop discounting childcare as a cost of raising a child. It is pretty much the biggest cost!

I agree it's a huge cost, but it's one that varies so much, it would be impossible to fairly and accurately include it in a CMS calculation for a set monthly amount. Childcare should be paid exactly equally between the parents after any childcare tax credit has been included.

I agree it's a huge cost, but it's one that varies so much, it would be impossible to fairly and accurately include it in a CMS calculation

I disagree. It varies yes, (as do all other costs of raising children based on a multitude of factors) but there will be a bottom floor cost. For example i have never seen childcare for less than £2.90ph and as i said i live in a cheap area. There is no reason why a national minimum childcare cost cant be calculated and child maintenance adjusted accordingly. Im not asking for the highest charging places to be covered. Just a minimum. At least a fucking nod of acknowledgement that this is a cost incurred by raising children. Instead of saying, "nah fuck it, cant be arsed grabbing a calculator so bear the full cost of childcare yourself PWCs"

But not every child uses childcare. Lots don't.

Quick calculation not including occasional expenses (eg return to school costs, birthday and christmas), luxuries or childcare my dd costs £450 per month and I'm on a basic budget!

For the love of the Lord....
I am a single parent. I provide a house, feed, clothe my child. I buy toys, treats, pay school dinner money, pay ballet fees. I buy presents for the parties she attends, I am the tooth fairy and Father Christmas. Yet due to the fact that I am reasonably reasonable, I also ensure she maintains good contact with her father. If I decided that as he pays an insultingly low amount (as is the fact) that he cannot have contact, I am in breach of the law.

I would say, "Good luck" with the man you are with. Though actually, you are the bad one as you are actually trying to find a loop hole for your boyfriend. You are the reason the new woman in our children's lives get such a bad reputation. The children are more important than you. Get over yourself and stop being so grasping. You are literally wanting to take food from the mouths of babes.

But not every child uses childcare. Lots don't.

Common sense would suggest those ones wouldnt need any paid for then wouldnt it? It isnt hard to make a calculation for child support with childcare cost and then one without. Is it?

Indeed. Our childcare was £30k a year as both worked full time and we had a lot of children under 5 and that was proper full time jobs with a bit of a commute and sometimes each of us working late (and work very hard to keep those on tax credits who choose to work part time because they know full time working mothers will work very hard to pay for others to have the luxury of working short hours!)

Janet

they know full time working mothers will work very hard to pay for others to have the luxury of working short hours!)

That option was available to you too.

why ask a question if youve decided you already know the answer.

If NRP was paying for childcare over their own 50% of responsibility (Ie: for 4 or 5 days rather than 3.5) then yes the extra is PWC's childcare bill.

Would you expect the rp to pay for childcare for when the child is staying with the nrp?

Depends on the circumstances for example if you were talking about an occasional babysitting situation then no I wouldn't but I wouldn't expect the nrp to pay half for the rp in that case either but if you are talking about a shared care situation then surely the parents would use the same childcare and so only one bill would be issued which would hopefully be split between them fairly but what tends to happen with the people I know is that the nrp uses the same childcare but expects the rp to pick up the cost.

Liesel Believe me I won't be spending my evening trawling through posts to prove my point. Sod that.

And yet you were happy enough to spend your time posting bollocks. The desire to use time fruitfully only seems to kick in when it comes to proving it. Which would rather seem to suggest you won't be proving your point because you can't.

If the child's mother earns £20k op then who is paying for the child's care while she's at work? I agree that £400 is probably over and above what a child actually costs directly each month (food, clothes etc) but childcare costs is a killer. When I returned to work ft when ds was 10 months it was costing between £500 andb £600 per month - and our cm is cheap!

As others have said, would you agree for your income to be taken into consideration too? Your dp has a child. Better get used to the idea that he must pay and be responsible for that child until he is an adult and beyond (uni costs etc) and if you can't cope with that then get out of the relationship. I speak as someone who's dh has been paying maintenance for 2 dc for 14 years. We now have a ds together so I have some idea from both sides of the fence.

I think the child in the OP is 15 so childcare not an issue but im sure it was at a point.

Oh okay Surly - I admit to not having rtwt

Nonetheless, teenagers can be expensive (dsd is 15) and now we're thinking about how to support her through uni if she goes. All stages of a child's life have different kinds if expenses.

As a matter of interest, OP, what do you think your partner should be paying? If it is, say, £100 a month, would he really be comfortable with the fact that he is paying what on any interpretation is a nominal amount for his child's maintenance whilst his ex's new partner is paying so much more?

You need to stop focusing on her new partners income. That is nothing to do with anything. It isn't down to her partner to take up the financial slack for your boyfriend. Once you can get your head around that simple fact everything will seem clearer.