Iabu/ridiculous/pfb, aren't I?

[Ohfourfoxache]

Huge backstory but I'm going to be deliberately vague because I'm worried that the "historic" past is clouding my judgment. Please bear with me - this post is based on the last few months.

Ds is 5 months old.

We have relatives visiting on Saturday - I'm going to call them husband, wife (both 60's) and son (40s). These relatives have been asking us to have children and add to the family for 15 years now. Ds is our only DC and we were told that they were very excited that we were expecting and that they would have a child in the family.

Reality is that they don't bother visiting, even when they are in the area. The visit this weekend has been prompted by the son having an appointment in the area and other relatives posting pics of Ds on FB (I know ) - they get insanely jealous if we see other people/relatives and this has been the source of much bad feeling over the years. We have tried extremely hard to maintain a relationship but in vain.

My issue is that wife and son insist that they watch ds's nappy being changed whenever they are around and the need arises. There is no offer of "oh we'll change his nappy", they just stand there gawping at him, neither use or ornament and just get in the way.

I don't have any child protection concerns per se, but it makes me very uncomfortable. I feel judged and a bit protective of Ds, even though he's only 5 months old ffs.

The wife is very manipulative and cries to get her own way (she once cried because I turned the centre light down in our own lounge as I had a headache - she doesn't like dark rooms ) So if I say something then WW3 will break out.

Sorry for the essay - please tell me iabu and to get a grip and it's only a fucking nappy change fgs and to stop being so precious

Dh tries very hard to placate them, and, tbf, he has done the vast majority of changes whilst they are here.

It's the insisting on watching that doesn't sit well primarily, the annoyance is something I'm fairly used to (although I do feel terribly judged which in itself is more of an annoyance iyswim)

what are some of the historic issues? be vague.

general bitchiness?
criticism?
them not liking you at all?

I know you don't want them to be part of this discussion but clearly the behaviours shown here are/might be linked.

Op, do you feel that they are insisting on watching purposefully as they know that it upsets you?

If he does cry then dh encourages them to hold onto him

Oh no no no, that's not right at all.

Start firmly taking him back. (I know it's hard; I find it hard to ask people to pass DD back - no idea why!)

And get a lock for your bedroom door.

I'm assuming there is a massive massive back story here otherwise if you're not willing to just go and change a nappy without telling them you're just going to have to let this one go. In the scheme of things it's weird but not a family deal breaker? However, like I said I'm assuming there's a massive back story,

The looking around bedrooms is a no no, get a lock and lock your door before they arrive if needed. Where BiL lives is irrelevant.

It sounds like the actual problem is DH's relationship with them. Everything else is symptoms. My lovely DH has a complete blind spot WRT his DF. We have basically worked on what his line in the sand is and what mine is. Mine is no emotional or other harm will happen to DD and he will never live with us. There is no discussion about these things. They are absolute deal breakers.

It helps that I take no nonsense from DFIL and he accepts that so my relationship with him is different to basically everyone else's.

You will have to rework your family dynamics before DS is older.

Discreet bathroom locked changes is the future OP.

I wouldn't be standing for any of that bollocks. If they said to me that they wanted to watch me change my DC I'd be scoffing "Don't be daft!", breezing out DC in arms and totally ignoring any histrionics. If I was pulled up for making insane MIL cry I'd ask " Why did it make you cry?" in a baffled tone and remained baffled through any explanations, such as they are. No apology and I'd continue to take my DC out of the room for nappy changes.
Your house. Your baby. YOUR rules.

And yy to the actual problem being your DH. Is this the famous 'FOG' we hear so much of?

I started reading this thinking "WTF" and then I remembered MIL used to come & watch nappy changes when DD was little. I never understood it at the time. It was as though she wanted to know exactly what happened but, as with you, never actually helped. When DD started weaning, there was one occasion when I wanted to cook up some more puree so she watched me peel the veg, cook it, blitz it, let it cool & put it into the ice cube tray. At meal times, she used to watch me get some puree out of the freezer, microwave it, let it cool, get DD ready for her food & feed her without ever offering to help. It was all slightly odd but she is otherwise lovely & entirely normal. Just not very hands on.

Agree that it was pretty obvious it was your IL's!! Only IL's are this bat shit crazy!!

My perfectly normal and sane MIL (whom I adore) is a bit nappy obsessed. With both DC she'd say 'I think he/she needs a change. Shall I do it?' Or if I started to change them she'd offer to do it but most oddly on the very rare occasion she has just started to change them!!!

I have never had any issues about it though, other than thinking it's a bit weird. I also have no problem telling her 'thanks but no thanks'. She recently babysat for us and I came home to both toddler and baby lathered in Sudocreme, despite me ever using it I think she had her own tub!!! but as I say she us generally lovely and normal so no buggy.

Does your husband know how uncomfortable you find this? Does he find it weird?

I'm of the "whip baby off them and change elsewhere" school of thought. Also if baby cries then you must take him back. I cannot abide people who refuse to hand over a baby when asked by the mother.... It makes me feel muderous.

I wonder what people would have made of this thread had it been the opposite problem (IL's asking baby to be changed in other room!). There seems to be a lot of angst on here about nappy changing etiquette in general.

I understand. MIL always followed me when I went to change DS1's nappy and it is so irritating. As my MIL is otherwise lovely I just assumed it was cos she wanted to spend as much time as possible with him during visits so I bit my tongue. Fortunately she stopped after a while and has almost never done it with DS2. She's too elderly to do the changes herself so I think she just wanted to be involved. I Was uncomfortable though.

I Think your problem is different and that you need to work out a plan, preferably with your DH onboard, for how to treat this and other future issues.

I Found MIL's questions very intrusive during my first pregnancy (how is your cervix?!) but I answered to be polite and to Involve her (DH is an only child). Also she was a midwife so I think that's why she asked. With my second pregnancy I told DH I didn't want her ringing asking personal questions after every appointment and he said something to her and she backed off which was great.

Can you store some nappies and wipes etc in a bathroom with a locked door?

Take a deep breath, state "right come on DS, time to come with mummy now" and just walk to the bathroom, saying nothing, don't tell them why and lock the door behind you!

They sound hard work tbh. Nothing specific you've said but just the time of your posts hints at continual digs that you don't want to list in fear of being accused of IL bashing.

Your husband is your problem, you need him to back you up, not be placating them and giving in to her emotional blackmail, he must see they're weird?

Good lord, they would give me Ultimate Rage.
Tbh if my kid was crying in anyone's arms, let alone your mental ILs, I would start crying myself! Totally unacceptable and I agree with PP who said people not giving babies back to their mothers when asked make me furious.

Re nappy changes, do as others have said and take baby to the bathroom.

What you do and say now sets the tone for you and your child's future relationship with ILs. You wouldn't want your child to feel awkward and uncomfortable with a situation and not say anything in case Granny cries.

YANBU.

Like PP, people not giving me DD back when she starts crying and even worse, reaching for me too, makes me want to cry myself. I was recently told 'it's good to let her cry sometimes'.

Why, why is it?!

Ok with exception of the added pressure of bil your experiences with inlaws and a new baby sound so similar to mine.

Esp not handing crying baby back ( his not screaming enough to need you being low point) and constant watching of nappy changes. Now my mil was selfish and at times down right nasty to me as a new mum. But in time I realised that it was about her and her insecurities. She drove me crazy stalking me for nappy changes. She constantly had a go and complained about me not using Terry nappies. It turned out she had made doing a nappy wrong a huge thing in her head and it stop once she got brave enough to change one. ( this took ages as she would only try of she was on her own and either I or my OH felt ok with leaving with the baby for a longtime for lots of reasons) regarding nappies I found asking her to hold wipes etc giving her role made me calmer.
Re the bigger picture I know I allowed my parents to do more with the baby. This was because they showed care and consideration for me and treat me and oh as baby's parents not obstacles. My mil territorial nature around the baby and unkindness to me, caused me huge discomfort.

But my mil loves her son and grandchild so I felt that I had to find a way to make it work while protecting myself and child a bit. Getting my oh on board re not always putting mil wants ahead of baby's and my needs was essential. But so was making time for my inlaws. They felt left out, deciding how often I could cope with seeing them ( once a fortnight for no more than 6 hrs) and inviting them regulary helped. Agreeing what was reasonable with oh before made it easier for him to see when I was being unreasonable ( which I was at times) and when his parents where. That made it easier for him to manage too. Sorry for the essay I hope it's helpful x

Any ideas how I can avoid questions/challenges where they argue that because my family change him, they should be allowed to watch?

That's easy enough, isn't it? Say "Oh, so you want to change him, do you? Right, there's the nappies, there's the wipes, carry on." And if they say no, they just want to watch, tell them that that's the difference between them and your family. And I do agree with the suggestion that you keep asking them in baffled tones why on earth they would want to do that. If the answer is along the lines that they want to spend every moment with him when they're there, ask how long that's going to go on for. Will they be accompanying him to the loo for the rest of his life?

Not at all helpful but I just can't get the image of Edward and Tubbs out of my head. And their son David after his transformation.

I find it very difficult not to resort to "fuck off" when responding to them, especially as they are so confrontational that they get me flustered

P'raps you do just need to say 'Fuck off'. I probably would.

Thank you for all the suggestions - I'm taking them on board.

I spoke to dh immediately this morning (having been awake for hours) and he feels that I'm deliberately trying to cause a problem with his family "because that's what you always do when they visit"

He is definitely, definitely deep in FOG. I gently suggested that he perhaps can't see how fucking weird unusual this is because he's been conditioned. He accepted that to an extent, then lashed out about my family.

Upshot is he agrees that, if a change is needed, I will do it and he will stay with them. I'm prepared to be blunt; he doesn't know this.

I've confided in one of dh's relatives (who is comparatively normal - I've sent her the link to this thread ) - apparently mil's mother did the same when dh and his brother/cousins were babies so it may well be learned behaviour.