To think if we eat and adopted some of the lifestyle of the europeans we would not be the fattest country in Europe.

[WonderWendy1]

I went on a med cruise two weeks ago we stopped in Portugal, Spain, South Of France and Italy.

I think of myself as a fairly fit size 12 (14 in some things). I would say i'm on the slimmer side in the Uk. I go to these european cities and the women (and men) are much slimmer then me and dh.

I was then in Paris for a few nights a week ago and I can only say my gosh nearly everywomen I saw had the legs of Taylor Swift.

Aibu to think we need to be doing what the europeans do to avoid becoming the American country of Europe.

Exercise makes a big difference to weight - not just because exercising a lot makes you lose it, but also because if you're into cardio exercise, generally you'll want to be lighter so you can move more quickly and be better at the sport that you do.

I am talking about proper, hard, regular exercise rather than the odd reluctant gym class or an infrequent walk with the dog though...

There are countless running studies that demonstrate the relationship between weight loss and speed. I've also seen it myself. After losing a stone, running became far easier and that was reflected in my PBs.

But for a simple visual example, go to any 10k race.
From my pretty extensive experience, any of the women finishing in under 40mins (ie very serious runners) will be very lean indeed, with barely any extra flab.
The vast majority of the women finishing in under 50 mins (lots of training required) will be slim.
Between 50 and 60 mins (average time for runners of all abilities) the women will be anything from slim to average, with the odd overweight person here and there.
And any woman finishing in over 60 mins (first timers, usually) will be any shape and size at all, because generally they're not yet running hard and frequently enough for it to have made a massive difference, or they haven't been doing it that long.

Ok, it's not scientific - but there's a reason there's virtually no successful runners, cyclists etc that are overweight. That's because they train hard, eat well and don't live the sort of lifestyle where a trip to town means a gallon of creamy coffee, a cinema visit means a vat of popcorn and a family day out means McDonald's.

There's also a reason why the average size of people gathered at a 10k race is generally far less than the average size of the same number of people at a cinema or in a shopping centre.

People have such a warped idea of what "normal" exercise levels are that they say "I'm fat and fit" - yet their version of fit is being able to walk on the flat for a couple of hours, or make it through a step class once a week. They're kidding themselves.

I have to wear a size 18 blouse due to the size of my bust. I have a fitted skirt from 2003 in a 12 and yes it fits. It depends on body shape ...im an hourglass.

If they found a lack of smarter clothes to fit them surely that would effect their chances at a job interview for instance. Then they can be judged even more for not having a job.

Running there have been more recent studies done which prove excersise does not aid weight loss.

The ones in my Slimming World class excersising really hard , it shows a gain on the scales and then they jack it in.

Runningupthathill82 I couldn't agree more with your post.

I have been to countless sporting events over the last 20+ years and almost all participants are slim.

The only possible exception are some of the rugby matches I've been to, but even then none have been massively overweight/flabby.

It's not about 'judging', HelenaDove, it's about manufacturers cynically and calculatedly marketing for obesity. Health should be the only concern really but slimness is the marker for that, it just is, and looks come into it too. If you're (general) overweight/obese then that is the thing that other people see - including employers - and they can discount you from jobs on that basis without ever having to declare it.

A fitted skirt from 2003 will not be like a fitted skirt from 1980, which in turn will not be like a fitted skirt from 1950.

Dieting is a major industry and the gain/lose and keep it off ratio isn't inspiring. My thoughts on this are that, if you're coming from the position of having to lose weight/having lost weight then you'd better get used to the idea of changing your regimen permanently to a healthy lifestyle and way of eating, or risk gaining it all again. It's very worrying.

Helena, with the greatest respect, that's just not true.
If you eat 1500 calories a day your weight may stay stable.
If you eat 1500cals a day and run 10miles a day too, you'll lose weight.

Are you seriously saying that, say, the tiny frame of everyone in the TdF peloton has no relation to the fact that they spend every day cycling, hard, up hills?!

If I were to hazard a guess, I'd say that your slimming world colleagues were either:
a) Doing weights and little cardio - ie building muscle
b) kidding themselves about how much exercise they were doing
C) Or eating more to regain the calories they lost through exercise.

Exercise alone is not the key. But it's a big part of a healthy lifestyle - and a healthy lifestyle overall is what you need to get, and stay, slim and fit.

Agree with Running very much, health is the objective. I think it's very much easier for somebody to do that when they're not coming from a 'defecit' of overweight as well.

Exercise may not aid weight loss on the scales Helena. But it aids fat loss, which is the point. As for clothes, you mean overweight people shouldn't have to face the level of difficulty of finding something akin to a 90's size 6 or 8? Or the difficulty if you're tall, or short, or disproportionately busty? Or basically like any of the other people who can't buy off the rack easily? They've even done it with school uniforms, God forbid chubby Charlies parents struggle to find stuff that fits in width and length, so we'll just shove that burden onto healthy kids.

I absolutely agree Lying

And HelenaDove you've done so very well in losing your weight

But I'm surprised to hear you're still attending Slimming World classes. I genuinely thought from other posts of yours in the past, that you'd cracked it all and were now in a place where you could live your life without that sort of thing.

Not that there's anything wrong with diet clubs in the short term, but I'm not sure they're something healthy to continue with into the future, once someone has made a huge dent in their weight loss.

That ^^ came out garbled but what I'm trying to say is, at some point you'll need to stop paying SW and start maintaining your own life long, healthy regime if that makes sense?

Probably not

Yeah ppl who are overweight and trying to lose it must be liars eh

There is no way a 12 is a 90s size 6

Im at target so i dont actually pay They may have to move it though as last week i dropped another 3 pounds below it

I probably have become a bit too reliant on the class though.

Other way around - a 90s size 12 is like today's size 6 or 8.

Im used to eating healthily now and have totally lost my sweet tooth. So its second nature now.

Ahh right I had no idea you don't have to pay if you're at target or how it works really.

But thanks for taking my post the way it was intended, cos it wasn't meant in any kind of bad way

No probs Worra and thanks

I know i get a bit prickly on here sometimes

CamelHump I agree about the snacking. I worked in France for years and they eat very differently, there is very little - if any - snacking, but they eat well and enjoy their meals socially, everybody eating together and eating at desks was unheard of.

Camel i agree I posted about my exes driving job further upthread His boss was a nightmare.

Camel a longer lunch break isn't going to make the quality or volume of food eaten any different, is it?

Like if you eat a light, healthy lunch in 20 minutes, or eat the exact same lunch in 60 minutes, what difference would it make to the calories consumed?

I know i get a bit prickly on here sometimes

It certainly does, but it's nice that so many of us can vehemently disagree with each other, yet remain fairly polite and civil

If that was to me, then I agree a 90's 6 is in no way like a 12. I meant because sizes are so much more generous now to flatter and accommodate the top end, it means those people who could have bought size 6 or 8 in the 90's are fucked now. But clothes manufacturers make for the market, they don't actually sit there thinking 'let's help the overweight feel good, screw the slim people'

Agree Worra

Oh sorry Helena, I read that as It gets a bit prickly on here sometimes.

YOU don't get any more prickly than the rest of us to be fair

It's always been a prickly subject for many of us