AIBU to report family member for benefit fraud?

[YUDOTHIS]

I have a family member who openly (to family) commits benefit fraud. she has one child, who is between 1 and 2 (trying not to out self here). She claims income support and child benefit, housing benefit etc as a single mother, however her partner lives with her (but "legally" lives with and pays tax etc from his mums house) I know that including benefits they have an income of 5k every month. I can't say which is benefits and which is her partners income as i've never asked but I know benefits are low and probably wouldn't top 1.5k max a month including housing benefit.
It really does bother me, as she is quite happy to rub it in my face, she is college qualified and has applied for jobs over the last 7-8 months or so, but has turned down 9 jobs because "I want to be able to afford my monthly boohoo shop and until I can do that in a job I'm staying on benefits" it really does irk me as I know she does not need this income and its wrong while thousands are being sanctioned every week and not having money to live on and she's laughing all the way, I've had to claim benefits myself and I feel people like her just keep the stigma going! I really really want to report but I don't know how many people she has told and if she has only told immediate family I worry it'll kick up a massive stink, I can't lie to save my life either!
WIBU to report her for fraud?

[ghostyslovesheep]

Report her if that's what you want to do

Not sure you need to start a thread about it

[SylvanianCaliphate]

Sorry but I just do not believe that
A. Family members disclose all their financial arrangements in such detail.
B. Family members report others for committing all crimes.
C. People who report other people are doing so out of some altruistic need to see everyone doing the right thing.

I.e. my brother used to drink drive (in the 80's when he felt it was still macho to defy the rules) I could have waited for him to hit the road and called the police but my instinct was to bollock him, take his keys, threats and refusing to go to his bbq because he would nip to the shop after three cans.
If he had carried on I would have ultimately reported him but it wasn't my default reaction.

Why do people report their family secretly?

[YUDOTHIS]

ghosty, Here on MN on my own threads I've never come across anything other than objective opinions and advice i consider this the start of my first flaming I was just looking for opinions and possibly knowledge from those who've been in my shoes before. thats why, Apparently I made a mistake posting!

[DinosaursRoar]

coffee - it might not be the reason the cuts are really being made, but it's the reason the bulk of the population don't give a shit that poor people are being screwed, because it's also screwing the people who take the piss.

Threads on here when someone says they might report someone for benefit fraud, everyone piles in and says "only report if you are 100% certain" - well the OP is 100% certain, and she's still being told not to report. There are some on here who do seem to have an "us and them" mentality and think it's always wrong to report

OP - report.

[YUDOTHIS]

A. Family members disclose all their financial arrangements in such detail. mine does actually, and another member upthread she knows the ins and outs of her friends finances. its the way some people work.
B. Family members report others for committing all crimes. the key here is ALL crimes, I've not given my stance on all crimes.
C. People who report other people are doing so out of some altruistic need to see everyone doing the right thing.
its out of annoyance to see someone doing the absolute opposite and rubbing it in the faces of all in our family who'll listen while homelessness is at an all time high and thousands face sanctions of up to 100%!

[Goshthatsspicy]

I believe there isn't anyone who will know the situation better than you op
I know it is nice and fair to gauge opinion, but I just don't think it ever helps.
My advice, would be to step away from here. Sleep on it, and base your next move on that.

[Goshthatsspicy]

*on how you feel on that.

[Ilovecrapcrafts]

YUDOTHIS- again, why have you waited so long?

[Elsashmelsa]

I have to say OP that I'm surprised at the number of posts saying to leave it. The costs of benefit fraud in this Country are huge and impact everyone, I would definitely report. Also rest assured that if she's boasting about it that much, someone else will know about it...

[ssd]

dashoflime, seriously, the op knows they live together as a couple yet she claims as a single parent and you are advising her to stay out of it?

[YUDOTHIS]

ILCC- I have my reasons :)

[Spartans]

OP, imo, if you know beyond a shadow of a doubt someone is committinf benefit fraud them you should always report it. Usually people don't know 100% and can be awful to be reported when it's not true. It happened to my mum.

But since you do know, yanbu to report them. I would go so far to say you have a moral obligation to.

[DinosaursRoar]

SylvanianCaliphate - thing is with drink driving, you can step in at the point the person is about to commit the offence, if you only realised after he'd got on the road, what would you do? That's the situation the OP is in, her family member isn't about to commit an offence, she's already doing it. There's no "stepping in and stopping them" option now.

It's report or not. it sounds like other people have tried to talk to her, she's been offered jobs she's turned down, there's not much more anyone can do other than report. Or do nothing and condone it.

Personally, I'd report. "A good talking to" might work with some people, but it doesn't sound like she's the sort who would listen. Might be worth a try. Would her DP's job be the sort to be effected if it turned out they were committing fraud? Or would her DC be getting to the stage where they might drop her in it by saying Daddy lives with them to someone else who might report?

[OTheHugeManatee]

She is stealing. Effectively she is taking money from people who really need it - utterly immoral. She is also perpetuating nasty stereotypes about people on benefits, which then contribute to ugly stigma and further support for cuts. I think she should be held to account.

[MarchelineWhatNot]

Benefit fraud is rife. If people did not claim benefits fraudulently then the bill would go down. Which might lead to claimants getting more benefits.

Actually, if I was the government, I would offer financial rewards for people who report benefit fraud. Like Crimestoppers rewards.

[LittleprincessinGOLDrocks]

Tell her to get a job and swap to everything5pounds.com , then she can have a monthly delivery from there at half the price of boohoo. If that is all that is stopping her from working.
I would not blame you for reporting them, but be sure of all the facts before you do.

[duckduckCHICKEN]

It takes a certain kind if person to be able to report someone behind their back, watch the fall out from it, then listen to their loved one being upset about it and undoubtedly comfort them.
If you report her then her chances of ever getting a job has decreased hugely (assuming she gets charged and found guilty).

Why don't you just tell her you are going to do it, give her a couple of weeks to sort it out, then make your decision based on her actions.

Reporting a close family member behind their back is just snidey imo, the same result can be achieved in a way that doesn't involve being two faced.

[SylvanianCaliphate]

Benefit fraud
The NAO did not break down how much of the £4.6bn was fraud, saying that both DWP and HMRC have differing definitions that make this difficult to assess. It said £3.3bn of the total was overpaid by DWP, representing around 1.9 per cent of its £164bn spend, while £1.3bn was overpaid by HMRC, around 4.4 per cent of its £29bn tax credit bill for the year.

We can extrapolate from previous figures quoted by the NAO for the 2012/2013 financial year, which found around £1.2bn of deliberate fraud on the part of benefit claimants, representing around 34 per cent of the overpayment total that year. If these proportions remained unchanged, benefit fraud would have risen to around £1.6bn. The remaining £3bn would be accounted for by mistakes made by claimants when applying, or errors by department officials.

Tax evasion and avoidance
According to official figures quoted by the BBC last year, in the 2012/2013 tax year the shortfall of tax that should have been collected by HMRC versus what it actually brought in had risen to £34bn. This eye-watering figure includes £14bn in uncollected income tax, national insurance and capital gains tax, and £12.4bn in uncollected VAT.

My bold and source www.theweek.co.uk/62461/which-costs-more-benefit-fraud-or-tax-avoidance

Putting my buns down for a second, I believe that the propaganda fosters the worst in us and makes us sneaky, weasels if you believe there are crime/fraud being committed then air your grievances face to face (if you tell her I'm reporting you unless she is thick or has genuine claims she will stop) why are people worried what their family members or the fraudster will think of them?
I have ASD and often see things black or white but in scenarios like this it doesn't scan right. Either report and tell everyone how shocked you are and lie to cover it or just say I think you are a twat for stealing and if you don't stop it I will report.

[TendonQueen]

Report it. She's contributing to the problems faced by benefit claimants who are genuinely in need by playing the system. It is effectively taking money from others. No one would tell you to turn a blind eye if you'd seen someone taking money from another person's bag so not sure why this would be different.

As for all the 'tell them face to face' advice, that just means they can blame you, when it's their own fault. Report anonymously.

[midnightvelvetPart2]

Re the points being made by more than one poster about families - yes I have the kind of family where I can stand up to the person in the wrong & confront them, & I would do if I suspected one of them was fraudulent.

However not all families work this way, my ex's family had an enormous & convoluted system of family politics & if someone did confront them in this way, then they would be ostracised & accused of being nonsupportive etc. This particular family would always be falling out amongst each other but the moment someone 'shops or grasses' then the family would unite as a whole against the 'grass'. It was horrible!

If OP is from a similar type of family then she may be struggling between family dynamics & the fallout on her, & her personal morals & wishing to act when finding out about a crime.

Talk about a rock & a hard place!

[Branleuse]

when i hear about people caring more about the state than they do about their own family, it really makes me think we are drifting into some big brother situation. Really, thats your family.

[UnbelievableBollocks]

God knows what's going on in your head. You're so principled that you want to report a close family member, have her interviewed under caution and possibly see her prosecuted and fined, but only if she doesn't know it's you who's done it to her.

If you feel that strongly, surely you should be brave enough to tell her to her face that what she's doing is wrong and that you'll report her if she doesn't stop.

You kind of lose the moral high ground when you'll only do something if you know you won't get caught out.

[dodobookends]

This is fraud. The longer it goes on the worse the end result will be. Someone will report her in the end, even if it isn't you, and she will get into all sorts of trouble. A good few years ago I know somebody who got a huge fine and was sent to prison for 3 months for doing this sort of thing.

[milliemanzi]

Just bloody talk to her! Say please stop doing this or I'll report you as I feel it is wrong. She is your family member although you seem to have little regard for her and the "boohoo shop" comment just sounded snobby.

[Branleuse]

it is doubleplus ungood