to be horrified at the behaviour in bohunt school

[SEsofty]

Just watched the programme about Chinese teachers in uk. Whilst I appreciate that it is reality tv and thus exaggeration for effect I was still horrified with the apparent number of children who were talking in class.

I'm not that accident and went to a very normal school but talking whilst teacher did simply didn't happen. I don't agree with the Chinese methods but talking whilst someone is trying to teach you is simply rude.

(My younger children are well behaved and work hard, but wouldn't be the high flyers that B. Is looking for).

The 101 who get A\A in maths- the 47 who get A\A in English literature........

'Its a COMP - which bit of that do you find hard to comprehend?'

As mentioned, this particular comprehensive has boundaries that are in effect selective by income. Rougher areas of the county fall outside the catchment.

Or are you trying to say that there is something intrinsic to comprehensives that dooms then to fall short of other types of school?

With regard to what Chinese kids who aren't high achievers do... (I'm a generation above those who are at school now).

My family in the UK - working class, high educational expectations, myself and my siblings went to university and are all doing well in our chosen careers. Oxford and Cambridge were the expectation in our family. My dad is from a peasant family, had he stayed in China he would probably still be farming in his village, as are two of his siblings.

When I think of my Chinese friends growing up (not those whom I met at university), most of our parents aspired that we would make it to university and many of us did - a variety of universities and polytechnics. We now work across a variety of jobs, including teaching, accountancy, dentistry, marketing, project management, IT, engineering, sciences, HR, music. Some have gone back to HK or China to work. I don't think any of us have made it to doctor or lawyer status .

One friend runs his own business helping customers to set up catering businesses. I don't think many of us went back into catering, but I can imagine that this is an option for children who don't do well academically - to be part of the family business.

One friend got in with a bad crowd at school - his family sent him to Ireland to live with his uncle and worked in his restaurant for several years, then came back to work at the family takeaway. He now works in IT.

One friend, who was so brainy, was not able to realise his full potential due to family circumstances. He still lives in the house that he grew up in, with his wife and family. He drives a taxi. My mum, who taught him, always felt it was such a shame that he couldn't achieve what he was possible of.

My family in China (dad's side) - the generation above me (who are now "the elderly") were peasant farmers. Of my cousins, one has emigrated (eldest son, filial piety, just like my dad), one works in a bank, one in an office, one in a factory and one (the successful one!) owns a number of businesses. I don't think any of them have been to university. A similar story on my mum's side, although they left for Hong Kong during the Cultural Revolution (my grandmother was a great advocate of education and made sure that all of her daughters as well as her sons were educated), and I think they have mostly been through tertiary education. They are mostly working in administrative/management roles.

math
As mentioned, this particular comprehensive has boundaries that are in effect selective by income.
How much of that catchment have you driven around? - as I drive through it most weeks.
Only somebody who has never been there thinks the whole area is a middle class bubble.
Bohunt has its cohort of carrot crunchers and poor whites - same as ANY non selective school with an intake several miles across.

Yeah, Bordon is not in the catchment, but the arse end bits of some of the villages and towns are
but the naice people moving down from London don't look at houses there.

Who sweeps the streets, cares for the elderly, works in shops, delivers letters, cleans hospitals, washes cars, does manicures, cuts hair, dry cleans clothes, clears drains, washes windows, drives buses, cooks food, washes up in restaurants, looks after children? Who does all the jobs that makes it possible for the lawyers, doctors, accountants and teachers to do theirs?

The 84 students out of 145 who managed a C, D or E in Additional Science...

The 54/186 who got a C or lower in Eng Lit...

All those saying 'great results -- for a comp' yet are castigating an alleged general opinion that comps are looked down upon need to examine what they are implying.

I am going by FSM stats for the school, which were provided upthread, as well as average house prices, again provided upthread.

'Who does all the jobs that makes it possible for the lawyers, doctors, accountants and teachers to do theirs?'

Why is it preordained that these people should be the graduates of comprehensive schools?

I live here and I think it pretty much is a middle class bubble! We are one of the poorer families....for a while my eldest wouldn't bring friends home as our house was too small/tatty. My impression (lived in catchment for 20 years) is that the catchment is now very selective by income. We couldn't afford to move here now not by any means.

TalkinPeace- I know the catchment area of Bohunt well. The area IS a middle class bubble. As I said earlier the cheapest 3 bedroom property in the catchment is £315,000. How is that anything but Middle class?

Mathanxiety
The 84 students out of 145 who managed a C, D or E in Additional Science...
Hmmm, you don't have much real life experience of comps do you?

You know that Add Sci is taken by sets 2 and 3 in a comp - the top students won't be taking that paper

Comps take EVERYBODY - including those who will never be functionally literate.

And if you think that average house prices are a true guide to the diversity of an area your stats needs a bit of work.
The minimum value of a house is nil.
the maximum is many, many millions
therefore there will be many more cheap nasty houses
than naice houses

(mean, median, mode, skewed distributions etc)

""'Who does all the jobs that makes it possible for the lawyers, doctors, accountants and teachers to do theirs?'

Why is it preordained that these people should be the graduates of comprehensive schools?"

I meant- as I thought was obvious- in China.

Have just watched the second programme and as a teacher am infuriated by the Bohunt management. If they really want to see whether the chinese system gets better results they would ensure that the kids behaved themselves. Yes the teaching methods are crap and very dull, but do they work? This experiment won'y show that because the SMT have allowed the kids to run wild. In the main school, there will be sanctions and back up from SMT and other dept heads. The chinese teachers are operating without this support and are of course bound to fail. They have absolutely no experience of even basic behaviour management. Some of the things the children were doing would have meant instant exit from class to exclusion rooms in most comprehensive schools. The kid with the kettle would have been out instantly. The reason the kids are going further and further is the lack of sanctions. The head of school's lecture followed by no back up support was utterly pathetic.

Not average priced house, but the CHEAPEST 3 bedroom house for sale in Bohunt catchment:

www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-50632141.html

Who sweeps the streets, cares for the elderly, works in shops, delivers letters, cleans hospitals, washes cars, does manicures, cuts hair, dry cleans clothes, clears drains, washes windows, drives buses, cooks food, washes up in restaurants, looks after children? Who does all the jobs that makes it possible for the lawyers, doctors, accountants and teachers to do theirs?

You mean here or in Chinese society?

Caring for elderly and children is often seen as a family duty. When my nan was ill here, we cared for her and she also had a Chinese lady who came to help her on a daily basis. Grandparents care for children a lot, if they are close.

Cooking food and washing up in restaurants - family business, in some cases. Chefs are pretty well respected and paid accordingly.

Of the other jobs, some would be done by older generation. My aunt is a cook, uncle is a security guard. Another aunt is a seamstress, another is a nurse. You could ask the hairdressers and beauty therapists in the salons in Chinatown, I suppose. Or my "successful" cousin in China runs a beauty salon, she employs people to cut hair and do manicures.

85 kids took 3 sciences. Of those, 36 got A*/A in chemistry, 40 in Biology and 46 in Physics.

zhx3- I meant in China. What sort of people does your successful cousin employ in her beauty salon? And will all the girls zooming along doing so well in those high achieving schools be expected to give up work to care for their elderly relatives and grandchildren?

"Of the other jobs, some would be done by older generation. "
So who will do them in the next generation?

I very much doubt Bohunt School takes in many functionally illiterate students. You keep on ignoring SomethingFunny, who has provided a figure for cheapest 3 bed house in the catchment, and trying to convince people that this particular area (which I am familiar with as I have an old school friend who lives there) is in some way disadvantaged.

I do know who does Add Sci, generally speaking, and that is why I included that figure. My guess is there are many disruptive students in the Add Sci classrooms. My own personal experience of school days in a state school in Ireland leads me to strongly suspect that results were affected by 'low level disruption' that makes it impossible to concentrate for more than a few minutes at a stretch.

I remarked earlier wrt the results: 'The majority of students achieved a B or lower in every subject except in Art and Design: Photography, Chinese, Global Perspectives, Physics, Polish, and Stats. So we are looking at niche interests, languages spoken by immigrant families, and subjects that only students committed to studying hard might choose.' Self selected groups of motivated students in an overwhelmingly MC area were the only ones who achieved excellent results. This reflects poorly on Bohunt.

BR, who does all those jobs in the UK and is there any preordained natural order when it comes to filling jobs?

BR, those 3-science students would generally not be either disruptive or in classrooms subjected to constant disruption by others. I am basing this remark on a hunch and many years of observation including my own school experience.

Well, I haven't seen my cousin for several years, but I would assume that she employs local people or migrants to the cities (although I think there are some restrictions as to who can and can't work in the cities).

Her brother works on the counter in a bank, her cousins work in an office and a factory. We are "next generation", and there will be those of us who will fill those roles that you've mentioned above. What happens after that will be a good question, as it's the generation below us who are "one-child policy" children - so I have no clue really how that's going to work. The children will be in their teens now, going through school. I don't know what their plans are upon leaving school.

None of my cousins went to high-achieving schools (they are not in Shanghai or Beijing). I think in my generation the concept of filial piety is still quite strong. Because there are numerous children in families in that generation, my experience is that care of elderly is often shared between siblings. When it is one grandchild and four grandparents, I haven't a clue how that is going to work.

Sorry, that should be one child and two parents.

'SomethingFunny Thu 13-Aug-15 11:02:27
Bohunt catchment area: cheapest three bedroom property: £315k for a terrace house.
Most expensive 3 bed - £750k bungalow.'

So there are probably not many cheap, nasty houses there. Most likely the majority would fall somewhere in between £315K and £750K. Perhaps most would be closer to the lower end, but who knows? It is very MC.

There are a lot of assumptions being made here. Not everyone lives in a house, not everyone owns their own property, not everyone at the school lives in the catchment area.