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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to be horrified at the behaviour in bohunt school

999 replies

SEsofty · 04/08/2015 22:13

Just watched the programme about Chinese teachers in uk. Whilst I appreciate that it is reality tv and thus exaggeration for effect I was still horrified with the apparent number of children who were talking in class.

I'm not that accident and went to a very normal school but talking whilst teacher did simply didn't happen. I don't agree with the Chinese methods but talking whilst someone is trying to teach you is simply rude.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 13/08/2015 13:46

"BertrandRussell: at just turned 6 and being able to read fluently and understand Roald Dahl books, know all her times table and divisions at 5 and being told by the teacher makes me feel somewhat proud of her achievements."

And you should be proud. But that's not objectively 4-5 years ahead of the national average. You need actual levels to say that - not a teacher's say-so.

mrsnewfie · 13/08/2015 13:50

Levels are being removed by the way.

Blossom8 · 13/08/2015 14:07

I respect your opinion BR. At this age, I'm not overly fussed about her ability but more proud that she is a good, kind girl.

BertrandRussell · 13/08/2015 14:15

Absolutely fine, blossom. But surely you can see that dropping "my privately educated child is 4-5 years ahead of the national average" into a thread like this has more significance than it would on a general chat about our children?

TalkinPeace · 13/08/2015 14:22

I reckon the whole programme was a set up by the head of Bohunt to stop Londoners moving into the area and ramping up the house prices and putting pressure on the catchment boundaries.
Excellent.
It means that the farther afield locals will get a look in at the school again

Their catchment is no stranger than other Secondaries in Hampshire after all
www3.hants.gov.uk/schooldetails?dfes=5407#catchment

SomethingFunny · 13/08/2015 14:28

TalkinPeace: carefully drawn as I said to exclude Borden, Whitehill and Headley Down, which are the less desirable areas.

I would be very surprised if the HTs aim was to make people stop wanting to send their children to his school.

Blossom8 · 13/08/2015 14:31

BR, mate, I put that because I am Chinese and there are earlier threads talking about how far ahead academically the Chinese and other Asians perform compared to their peers and I thought I'd put my example as support of that view and nothing to do with boasting or that she is the privately educated but more the fact that she is well behaved and want to learn.

TalkinPeace · 13/08/2015 14:32

Something
That was the Army's doing not the school.
And if you look at the maps for lots of the Hampshire schools, bubble catchments are not that unusual
www3.hants.gov.uk/schooldetails?dfes=4015#catchment
www3.hants.gov.uk/schooldetails?dfes=4310#catchment

NarrativeArc · 13/08/2015 14:51

blossom the high achievement of pupils with Asian heritage in the UK system is well documented.

SomethingFunny · 13/08/2015 15:06

Whatever the history, it remains the case that children from the poorer Bordon, just outside the catchment, go to an ofsted 'inadequate' school- Mill Chase Acadamy, and only 51% got a-c grades (which to be fair is a huge improvement on 2013 and 2012 results).

BlackBetty · 13/08/2015 15:10

Gosh I help in a year 6 class and this RARELY happens. Perhaps they are terrified of my Trunchball like demeanour Grin

BertrandRussell · 13/08/2015 15:23

"Gosh I help in a year 6 class and this RARELY happens. Perhaps they are terrified of my Trunchball like demeanour grin"

What really happens? 12 hours of note taking in a mixed ability class of 50? I should bloody well hope not!

YouGetNOTHING · 13/08/2015 15:27

The Bohunt teachers were worse almost than the parents. Their glee at critising the Chinese school this episode was palpable. It made me really cross. The parents were almost as bad. I don't think I can tolerate watching the next episode.

YetAnotherUserName · 13/08/2015 15:52

My 12 year olds and I watched these programmes and they say they can't understand why those kids are so badly behaved - because they agreed to participate in this experiment, so why not just suck it up and see it through? Without the rudeness. Ok the reality is obviously different to how they thought it would be beforehand, but it's a short term commitment only! Not for the rest of their education.

And yy to the poster who said that for primary aged kids education should be engaging / entertaining, but as kids get older, there's no reason why they shouldn't move towards a "chalk and talk" style. Have things changed so drastically since I was at uni, that that's not the teaching style any more? Assuming some of those kids in the programme will eventually end up in tertiary education, are they expecting to be entertained during a lecture? (Hint, "lecture" kind of gives it away and I think that chalk and talk method can be both educational and entertaining at times.)

But obviously it's a TV show for entertainment and I'm sure that in the last episode there'll be some "reveal" with a pre-conceived conclusion. It's just unpleasant to see the Head's attitude in these programmes. What a shame for all involved.

YouGetNOTHING · 13/08/2015 16:09

I commented to DH that the kids will be stuffed at university in lectures. I went 20 years ago and already the lecturers were livid that some students were getting up and leaving mid lecture, reading a broadsheet in the lecture and expecting to be given the answers rather than working it out for themselves. Part of that is taking copious notes while the lecturer is talking and working out the answer from the information given.

Lasttoknow · 13/08/2015 16:15

I think that Bertand Russell does not approve of private schools so don't be personally offended. It's fairly common.

BertrandRussell · 13/08/2015 16:34

I think that Bertand Russell does not approve of private schools so don't be personally offended. It's fairly common."

Nothingnto donwith whether or not I approve of private schools, and I apologise if I offended. I was trying to discover whether blossom's dd being 4-5 years ahead of the national average is to do with her being very clever, being Chinese or being at private school. Or just being the product of a supportive home, regardless of ethnicity or sector. It is relevant in the context of this thread. And I still don't know, actually. I was also interested in how this 3 years ahead figure so confidently bandied about is calculated. Which is why I asked how blossom's dd's 4/5 years ahead was measured. Surely questions one would expect if one make statements like that?

Maryboo · 13/08/2015 16:39

This is a really long thread and I'm not here to defend the indefensible, however I feel there are some misconceptions. The OU were responsible for carrying out the experiment - they came up with the idea and the criteria by which the whole project was set up and run. The school itself were only to provide the 50 pupils and the premises. The experiment was to test whether a Chinese type school would work in the UK, therefore the Chinese teachers were wholly responsible for the running of it which included behaviour management. It wasn't the case that the teachers at Bohunt purposely left them to fail, rather it was the OU who asked that there be no interference. However, having observed the deteriorating behaviour of otherwise well behaved pupils, the school intervened. If anyone feels the experiment was flawed, the school and pupils badly prepared or that the whole process was biased then it's the OU who should be getting the bashing.

Secondly the footage shown thus far has been carefully selected to tell a particular story. Clearly the footage itself isn't a fabrication however it's easy to edit clips together to make things seem quite different from reality, particularly when you have hours of footage to choose from. Just Google 'reality TV editing' to see how easy it is. My daughter has 4 good friends who took part who have barely featured to the extent that you'd blink and miss them. They, along with many others, have not had much footage included of them. Why? Because they were well behaved, studious, polite and just kept their heads down and got on with things. Obviously not good tv though...

BertrandRussell · 13/08/2015 16:40

And I don't know what you expect to prove by having no faith that your DC wouldn't have behaved.

Are we meant to all agree? That if your terribly ace DC couldn't do it, then no one could?
Nope. I just said I don't know whether mine could. Not that they couldn't. Just that I think we are offering hostages to fortune if we say we are certain ours could. Except we're not -because we are unlikely ever to be called on it!
Because lots of DC could have managed it. There are bloody loads of them in Asia for a start wink.
Yep. I bet ours all could too if they had started bing trained up for it at 5!

And all this stuff about a shock when they get to University- that's daft. There'll be lots of things they can't do at 13 they will be able to at 18. Any anyway- since when has university education involved 12 hours of note taking??

Lasttoknow · 13/08/2015 16:55

Apologies Bertand.

TalkinPeace · 13/08/2015 16:56

Maryboo
Nice to hear the input of a Bohunt parent on this.

And I utterly agree with you that the way TV is edited is all about the pre planned story and bugger all to do with what actually happens at the time.

For every minute shown, 20 will end up deleted as kids getting on with work does not get ratings.

BarbarianMum · 13/08/2015 17:05

However the TV footage was edited to add 'drama' (and I'm sure it was) there was still a shocking amount of widespread misbehavior in those classrooms, as evidenced by the Head feeling the need to intervene.

NarrativeArc · 13/08/2015 17:26

Of course the footage would show what the production company wanted to show.

However, it is undeniable that behaviour was dire. The school have admitted it, just laid the blame at the 'lazy' Chinese teachingHmm.

Maryboo · 13/08/2015 17:39

Like I said, I'm not defending the indefensible. Just know that the behaviour has been vastly condensed and edited together to make it appear that the type of behaviour shown was happening throughout and by the majority of students which was far from the reality.

Tryingtokeepalidonit · 13/08/2015 17:53

It is very naive to think that the teaching style has nothing to do with the behaviour. These pupils have been taught in a system which gives weight to independent learning for their entire education, and that is something private schools excel at. Suddenly to have to copy and listen will disengage and once disengaged pupils will play up. They can be engaged by having to write an essay for a whole lesson, it doesn't have to be entertaining, but they do have to have a level of understanding and purpose.

I work in an inner city comp, surrounded by urban deprivation and we get similar results to Bohunt. However I don't think many of our pupils would behave the way Bohunt pupils did because so many are EAL and come from cultures that value education highly. As a teacher of English this creates difficulties because they are passive learners and will not challenge ideas and interpretations.

I thought it was clear from their response to the Bohunt teachers discipline is usually strong but the parents did not seem to be regarding the experiment as important. I was surprised at the parents reaction to being told their children were misbehaving. I would have been mortified however every school has parents like this.