To be shocked and not a little afraid of the Tory plans for trade unions announced today

[thinkingmakesitso]

Sorry if there is already a thread on this, but I couldn't find one.

These plans go way too far and amount to a blatant attack on the Labour party - an attempt to destroy it once and for all.

No rights for workers at all - what would be the point of striking if your employer gets two weeks to organise agency staff to fulfil your role? What would it ever achieve?

Can anyone who voted Tory really say this is what they wanted? That this is any way fair? I feel utterly wretched about this. What right do these people have to do this?

Tyr this one, Carol

www.theguardian.com/society/2014/jun/19/poverty-hits-twice-as-many-british-households

I'd agree, flash. Do unions have a place in protecting workers in a world where an increasing percentage of companies are being eaten up by monopolies?

Why do people vote Tory again?

Because for every worthwhile thing Labour does, it manages to come up with a piece of fuckwittery (e.g. the "mansion tax") that scares the living daylighss out of the electorate at large who then turn to the Tories as the safer option.

Because for every worthwhile thing Labour does, it manages to come up with a piece of fuckwittery (e.g. the "mansion tax") that scares the living daylighss out of the electorate at large who then turn to the Tories as the safer option.

This is the sort of nonsense you'd expect from Republican voters over state side. I thought we were better than this.

I am not a tory, but I worry about the current labour party.

I agree with the funding changes.

Disagree strongly with agency workers.

Think something needed to be done on voting thresholds, but this hurdle is far too high. It is ridiculous to potentially have 5% of members voting for a strike and having it approved (if turnout was v low)

"eek isn't it a bit soon in the thread for Godwin's"

Not if actually, it would appear there could be real parallels between what the Tories are doing and what happened in pre-War Germany. Then Godwin's law doesn't apply.

Iggly, upthread, is certainly not the first to notice similarities. Here are comments on 3 separate issues.

Tory Tax credits policy is like Nazi-style social policy of eugenics, says Stephen Kinnock MP

Also

‘Orwellian’: Tory move to criminalize dissent strategic & unjust, say union chiefs ... "The Nazis banned unions and strikes in 1933, and that is what the Tories are trying to do now"

Even the Mail has commented:

This is not wartime Nazi Germany and Cameron's attacks on the vulnerable and needy must be stopped

This is the sort of nonsense you'd expect from Republican voters over state side. I thought we were better than this.

How else do you explain the Labour melt down at the last election?

Why do (23% of) people vote Tory?

Because roughly 65% of britain's net worth is now equity in property, and if there is one thing you can be certain of, you can rely on the conservatives to keep feeding the property bubble, to keep property taxes low and to keep ensuring we are the go-to destination for capital flight into property from, say, china.

The minute ed milliband started talking about regulating private tenancies - with outrageous suggestions like three year tenancies - he was stuffed.

How else do you explain the Labour melt down at the last election?

The evil that men do lives after them; The good is oft interrèd with their bones.
So let it be with Labour. The noble Conservatives hath told you Labour was incompetent. If it were so, it was a grievous fault, And grievously hath Labour answered it. Here, under leave of the Conservatives and the rest—
For the Conservatives are honorable men (and women);
So are they all, all honorable men (and women)

It certainly is not "godwins".

Fascism is basically where instead of a democratically elected government, you are ruled by corporatists - usually in the name of economic growth and the greater good. In a fascist state, you can trust the government because it "knows best what is in your best interests".

Sajid javed, I'm afraid to say, sounded closest to a fascist - (in an edward and mrs Simpson/ lord rothermere sense!) this morning on the radio, when he was talking about how the Tories are One Nation, and that they are on the side of the employers AND the workers, against the unions. The phrase "One Nation" is starting to give me the creeps, especially when you realise that the practical implications for political funding after this bill will be continuous Tory government and no effective opposition.

Martin Pugh wrote a good book - "hurrah for the fascists - British fascism between the wars", which is worth a read.

Or to put it another way.......

The Tories were able to engage with the non-committed and floating voters and get them to vote for a Conservative candidate so leading to a Conservative govt. whereas Labour, speaking only to its core vote, failed.

Eek I got the title wrong - sorry - it was "hurrah for the blackshirts - ...." - a daily mail headline, in fact. Plus ca change.

But NHS funding has been slashed - by the back door via efficiency savings. Imagine being paid and then being told you have to make 50% savings on your outgoings next month - that is what the NHS is faced with. Coupled with the encouragement of a competitive culture where foundation trusts bid for each other's contracts and it all becomes about the bottom line, then yes, care does suffer and the public should care about who employs their health professionals. The NHS is on its knees and extra funding isn't the whole solution, nor is wholesale restructuring as is commonly suggested. As for getting rid of swathes of admin and managerial staff, I now spend a large proportion of my clinical time doing admin. Which is not a good use of precious NHS money when my profession are relatively expensive to pay.

I don't have magic solutions, that is what I hope I could trust government and NHS management to figure out. But the NHS funding is being cut.

The Tories were able to engage with the non-committed and floating voters and get them to vote for a Conservative candidate so leading to a Conservative govt. whereas Labour, speaking only to its core vote, failed.

Ye gods no, don't you know your Shakespeare?

And social care, the Cinderella service, even more so.

Labour failed because it had no vision. The conservatives succeeded because in the privacy of the polling booth, less than a quarter of the population held their noses and thought (largely) of how there was no way they could risk the value of their house going down....

And social care, the Cinderella service, even more so.

There's method to their madness here. They expect voluntary organisations to take over some of the work formerly carried out by trained and paid social workers. What could go wrong?!

*they being the Conservatives

They've destroyed the welfare system, now this, and next its going to be the NHS. Mark my words.

wand, don't spoil their fun with facts

Respected labour historians eg selina Todd, author of last year's "rise and fall of the working classes", have written that the Labour Party has reached the end of its natural life.

I wonder what the age 1945 - 2007 will be called in our grandchildren's history textbooks. "The age of social progress" maybe. We shall see.

no way they could risk the value of their house going down..... I voted Tory at the election... The value of my house was not a factor in how I voted. I don't care too much about the value of my house - it's my ability to pay the mortgage that's the key factor, as I guess it is for most people under 50 (I.e those that don't tend to own outright)

They've destroyed the welfare system, now this, and next its going to be the NHS. Mark my words.

They've not destroyed the welfare system, they've trimmed it and tightened it, but it still exists and supports millions and millions of people. It may have been cut too far in some places, and many may be adversely affected (I personally feel older age benefits for the wealthy should have been targeted more than working age benefits) but exaggeration like this weakens the Lefts position.

Respected labour historians eg selina Todd, author of last year's "rise and fall of the working classes", have written that the Labour Party has reached the end of its natural life.

Maybe, but I seem to recall similar things being said about the Conservatives back in the 90's, and we all know how that turned out.