A decent budget for low paid workers.

[Sickoffrozen]

Aibu to think that overall the budget was good news for the low paid with a big increase in minimum wages announced?

Seems like a decent idea to me.

But I stand to be corrected.....

vvega
Doesn't even need to be ATOS - mine was stopped prior to that.
My Consultant wrote that I was not even suitable for a 'light sendentary duty of work' and my WRAG was stopped anyway, even after appeal.
Because my H works, I cannot claim WRAG OR JSA.
My income dropped by 450/month.
Previously I had been on DLA, without limit of time.
I've waited 18m for my first set of 3 Operations and will wait goodness knows how long for the other set.

My brother worked for a welfare to work company. He referred to ATOS as Lourdes said it was because of the amount of miracle recoveries he was handed from them....

Chuffin, just to give you an idea of how nonsensical the system is I am currently in receipt of the higher rate of ESA. This means that the DWP accept that my condition has such an impact that I am not able to work or study/retrain. However, they have decided that I am not entitled to PIP as (according to the ATOS report) I am not unwell. They had the exact same information given in each application.

I have a tribunal for my PIP appeal soon, but it will have taken 16 months to get to that point.

Am disturbed how the media and government have moved the goalposts and changed the language around tax credits and benefits. Benefits are no longer that but are now 'welfare' and tax credits, which are paid through HM Revenues and used to be seen as a neutral non emotive top up for those on lower incomes, are now seen as 'subsidising' people who aren't working hard enough or long enough. It really sucks. Even child benefit, also seen as a non emotive universal benefit is now classed as welfare. WTF?!

That is because it is welfare. The government, any government of any persuasion, has no option but to cut the welfare system. And it will continue to be cut next year, and the year after that, and the year after that. You can rant and rave all you like, and blame this muppet or that muppet, but it will never put more money in your pocket. Only work will do that, and only learning to work for yourself will guarantee you an income. The welfare system is vastly over prescribed. Everyone and their dog lives on welfare of one sort or another. Long gone are the days when state aid was for the needy and the vulnerable. The only way to fix the system is either to remove people from welfare, or remove welfare from people. If we can't do the former, through growth in the economy, then the later is the only option. We can bury our heads in the sand and pay out whatever anyone believes they should be entitled to, but you won't find anyone willing to pay for it. We are not Greeks, we will not buy into the welfare meme to that level of depravity. At least people are not facing the austerity Greek style socialism has meted out. We only have to deal with the austerity measures needed to balance the system.

The welfare system is so important. One slip down some steps, a dose of flu, anything really could put any of the people in good positions into one where they need that cushion. Right now I may be all right jack, but I'll share that good fortune in any way I can because I may need the same one day. I feel so strongly for those of you ill and scared of what might happen. It's like watching someone be ganged up on at school.

Jesus, you've got to be KH!

The budget stinks for some of the most vulnerable. I'm fortunate and don't need any assistance. For now. I've said on here before, we would happily pay a little more tax than see society turn on itself and tear the weakest apart.

Society will only do that if they choose to. People thinks as they are told to think by their media. The masses are very predictable and easy to manipulate. If we tell them them over and over again, that the poor are lazy greed scum, and that the rich are selfish greedy tax cheats, we will be able to keep them focused on each other, arguing pointlessly about whatever side they choose to fight on. That way they will both support the status quo. They will both vote for the same system of governance, and they will affect no change in their lives. It works rather well.

EllieFAnt - I am not ranting or raving.
Just curious as to why a person who has never met me knows better than my Consultant whether I am capable of work or not?
What about those who have been deemed medically not capable of work (long or short term).
do they rise, Lazarus like, to fit the Govt's proposals?

I hate the holier-than-thou tone of some people's posts. Just sayin'.

Nice Ellie, are you aware that some disabled people and their carers are losing money in this budget?

There was a just sayin'
I'm out. time

Notasinglefuckwasgiven One has to wonder why people in. Britain have been bred not to save a portion of their labours for those times when they are unable to work? I cannot in any way pretend that the Chinese or Indian populations have a finer welfare system or greater access to wages that we do, but on average, Chinese people save 40% of their income and Indian people save 26%. We save less than 5%. Could it be that if people did feed their consumerist obsessions they may be able to enjoy the safety blanket aspare year or twos salary in savings brings?

DopeyDawg I don't contest the principle, nor the ethic. Indeed, said French firm received an absolute monopoly position, which in no way can be said to be 'free market capitalism' or 'fare market value'. It is crony capitalism at its finest. Welfare systems are inherently corrupt. They cannot be run honestly or transparently, and there can be no competition, so the can be no way of running it economically. You have thousands of corporations who's very existence depends upon the welfare handed out by governments, those who supply the NHS, those who maintain the buildings, those who deliver the food, those who act as 'consultants'. There are just as many corrupt individuals working within the system and for the system, as there are leaching off the underbelly. No country has ever managed to run a welfare system that has not been found to be corrupt, and no country that has introduced a welfare system has ever discovered how to prevent it growing and snowballing in size. Because when you give people things for nothing, and you discover that giving people stuff for nothing wins votes, more and more people want stuff for nothing, and fewer and fewer people want to pay for it.

One has to wonder why people in. Britain have been bred not to save a portion of their labours for those times when they are unable to work
Your problem is Ellie, a distinct lack of comprehension of the circumstances of others. You make assuptions based on heaven knows what. Some of did save, some of us tried to ensure (and insure) against various possibilities. Doesn't always work, money runs out fast, insurances don't always pay out. It's not like being retired, money goes far more quickly when disability is involved. So, bearing in mind that some folk have made some sort of effort and have still being scuppered, I'd appreciate a less patronising (and Benthamite) view. Doubt that I'll get it, but I'm certainly not an exception.

Just realised nmw has only gone up £1.45 in 10 years

For all of my working life there has never, ever been anything left to save.

Dawndonnaagain Yep. But neither you nor I can do anything about it. All we can do is work hard, save our money, and help those around us. You cannot prevent a contraction of the welfare system by voting or complaining about it. The Greeks, Venezuelans, Argentinians, all know where an over indebted economy goes. MN was awash with people lambasting the lazy corrupt thieving Greeks and their welfare dependants. It is so easy to see the flaws in someone else's economy, and ignore the presence of those same flaws in ones own.

If you can work, and have work, save for when you can't, or when those around you can't. A TV un bought pays for a few months food, reduces your exposure to propaganda, increases your children's intelligence level and language skills, and saves you buying a TV license, and spending £20 a month in electricity. There are a 101 things we can all do to reduce our expenditure and 101 ways we can help those in our neighbourhood who need a little help. Some people don't even know who their neighbours are, but they'll be able to tell you who's through to the X-factor final, or what Kim Kardashian did last week.

Ellie, how can people save for (potential) illness if they are born disabled or get ill at a relatively early stage in their working life? Was I supposed to have 35 years worth of living costs in the bank to take me through to retirement age? And should I save/pay into a pension out of that?

Just realised nmw has only gone up £1.45 in 10 years
Our family income has only gone down. Ten years ago our joint income was almost £60K. Three redundancies and three children later, it's under £20K.

For all of my working life there has never, ever been anything left to save.
At the moment we only manage to save £20 a month. When we can save more, we do. But that's still a new £20 note to our emergency fund, or a new 1oz silver coin to our SHTF fund.

gobbynorthernbird

No. But you are using yourself as an example of someone who the welfare system was designed for from its inseption, and ignoring that the majority of the money spent on welfare does not go to the intended recipient. If you have an issue, it is not with the government of the day, but those who take your welfare for their own benefit, be that the lazy and the feckless, or the greedy businesses and their extortionate fees.

You clearly cannot argue that the system works. If it does not work, you cannot also just say, 'well we don't know how to fix it, and we don't know who is deserving and who is not, so just keep paying everyone anyway.

Personally I have no issue just writing blank cheques to all welfare recipients. Make them all millionaires. It would be a wonderful system. This long drawn out train wreck would be over by the end of next year, and we can start anew.

vvege Sorry. Can't agree with you these. I know how little money I can live on. I know how little food. I personally need, and I know I can go 14 days without consuming food at all. I didn't find these things out for fun. I found them out because I had to. But when we do have money, we save it instead of paying a mobile phone bill or running a television. Out electricity bill dropped by £26 a month when we sold our telly, and we no longer needed a license. If you didn't pay that £35 a month, that's half a days wages that you don't need to go and work for at some time in the future.

It’s a good thing for a couple of reasons. If you have a low paid job and a family then you are probably eligible for working tax credits. Working tax credits is essentially a subsidy for for companies who pay poorly. By raising the minimum wage and effectively abolishing the minimum wage then it removes the subsidy. It will affect small companies but it also makes large corporations pay proper wages.

£9 an hour isn’t a huge wage but if you work 37 hrs a week then you’ll earn approximately £17.5k. The government has removed a large drain on the tax payer and it gets a double whammy because it can tax the £7.5k that isn’t covered by tax relief.

I’m not a natural tory but this one policy I do like. The cut in the level of benefits doesn’t sound great to me but let’s face it, with a higher living wage it may encourage those long term unemployed who have been coasting try a bit harder.

The majority of the welfare budget does go to people who are entitled and deserving. Like pensioners, sick, and the working poor.

The only problem I have with the system is that it should be better funded by big business and tax avoiders.

I wasn't thrilled about wealthy pensioners getting off Scott free again. That £400 fuel allowance should be abolished for anyone with an income above a certain level. They have had a really good deal in recent budgets with tax free savings, pensioner bonds and increased personal allowances. Not really sharing the pain.