to think dual person 'full time' worker family households should never have become the norm?

[workingdilemma]

Was thinking about the other thread talking about tax credits etc.

Around 40 years ago, as a society we'd reached a point where one person working in a household was enough to support a young family.

Now we've ended up where it's pretty much required to have both working full time to be able to afford the same lifestyle - mainly due to the insane 'cost' of housing.

It would have been far better to have had both people in a couple working perhaps part time to allow engagement with the world of work, and also a healthier work/life balance.

Why did we end up like this? Was it all an orchestrated plan to keep the debt cycle going - after all, you can lend on two incomes now for a mortgage. Lovely jubbly for the debt pushers. Is that why the banks and governments encourage this?

I dunno, but I do yearn for a better way to deal with the problems we're having now then everyone demonising each other.

namechange

I suppose some women may feel they were conned into giving up work if it wasn't their decision or what they wanted. You can't be conned into a decision you make yourself.
The point I was making is no matter whether you work or not in the case of a divorce you are still required to take a hit financially.
In some cases the fact that you work doesn't mean you'll be better off than somebody who hasn't worked. It depends on your financial set up, who owns what and what is left when all is split up.

Maintaining a career puts you in a better position to be financially independent following a divorce.

Most people don't want to rely on an ex partner for money.

merrymouse

There again, I think it depends on the person and their financial set up tbh.
It certainly wouldn't have been/ would be the case for us.
Most of one of our incomes would have gone to provide childcare, which would have had to have been a nanny. We have saved this and other costs associated with dual income earning. This in turn has given us more money to invest in our home and other assets. If they had to be divided we would both do very well out of it and I wouldn't have to rely on dh for anything, although we still have one dependant child he would want to support as he does now.

The 3 women I knew had given up very good careers at their husbands behest ,the proviso being they would be supported until they decided to go back to work.
They felt shafted as they stayed at home but once their DC were teenagers their husbands dropped them like a hot stone.
They were not in a great position.

morethan if you didn't earn it in the first place as a WOHP how do you then save it? you didn't earn ,so you didn't spend it on CC.
DH and I both WOH and we didn't use CC, therefore we saved the money on CC and had it available to spend !

Not sure what the "costs" of dual income are apart from CC, we cycle, pack our lunches and wear scrubs !

It should have little to do with gender.

except it does. how many one earner families have a SAHD? obviously it's more common now, but still likely very rare.

Keep, so? If it's a choice it doesn't matter if 100% of women choose to stay home or 100% choose a career. This thread is talking about SAHP not women

morethan If you are saying you have enough wealth that following a divorce you could live off your share of the assets (having housed yourself) and not have to work, that is a fairly unusual situation.

Most people still need an income. If you have to rely on somebody else's earnings/pension, and you aren't married to them or even on speaking terms, that is not a pleasant position to be in.

Most people find that splitting a household into two dwellings is very expensive.

I wonder what percentage of working people actually enjoy their jobs? And what percentage feel they would enjoy their job more if they didn't have to spend so much time doing it?

Until somebody finds a way to earn a comfortable income without working the answer is probably rather moot.

I love my job - Im a midwife.
Its damn hard work but I will go to my grave knowing I brought up lovely DC ,had an amazing career and made a difference to many peoples lives.
LOVE it !

I cant imagine saying I SAH ... oh ok then ????

Some comments on this thread (who on earth would work if they didn't have to?) are kind of sad - people can't even imagine that some jobs could be interesting? I enjoy my job, so does DH and neither of us wants to give them up, even though we could also manage on just one salary. And no, baby yoga or toddler singing would not be quite the same.

I don't care whether it's moot or not. I would just find it interesting, given the unusually high proportion of people on this thread who appear to be enamoured of their careers. And why the obsession with not working at all? Would most people rather not work at all? What counts as "work," if we'd all rather not do it?

Seems to me some people are seriously bad at imagining themselves in someone else's position if they can't imagine anything worthwhile about being a SAHM, or can't imagine enjoying any work. We're all different, but some of us are more judgemental than others.

I totally agree !
I feel lucky to do my job and I get paid for it !
sorry if that offends you boohoo

Lots of us have had time off with our DC and I don't really think for me being a SAHM would have given me the same, utterly wonderful experience of helping and supporting another woman to give birth,
When I was at home I only had my own experience and a very narrow world.

And its worth remebering the op mentioned remaining in the world of work - both partners. Just not all the flipping time.

Instead of fostering a discussion on why technical advancements etc have failed to lead us to a more balanced life - mainly due to financialisation of everything we naturally, and not entirely unexpectedly find the militant anti sahm element hijacked it, twisted it and its devolved thusly.

namechangefortoday543 - it sounds as though you had an extremely limited and limiting experience of being a SAHM, though. Why did you stay at home the whole time? Not every SAHP actually "stays at home" - they could just as well find unpaid community work to keep themselves busy and give them a sense of purpose beyond childcare and their own home; or spend time requalifying as something else for a later return to a different workplace, if their old career didn't suit their view of ideal family life. Why so black and white about what life with and without paid work is like? Just because that's the way it was for you?

Erm I didn't" stay at home" the whole time !
Do people really think stay at home mum means you stay in the house all day ?! Bwahahahaha!
I love to hear how you had such amazing experiences caring for others whilst caring for 2 plus young children.

Name you seem very against SAHP for some reason

Nope- I was one FOR A WHILE but I would be kidding myself if I thought I would have the same experiences as a SAHM as Ive had as a midwife, delivering babies and caring for women .
There is just no comparison.
[SMILE]

ACK ROGUE CAPITALS !

Well, namechange, you did say you only had your own experience and a very narrow world! When you left home, did you have your eyes closed, then? The way you described it, I assumed you were at home the whole time (or possibly very dull and unimaginative).

Of course your experiences would be different! That doesn't mean everyone would find them limiting or less meaningful than their actual alternatives.

There is no need to be nasty rabbit
No idea why you are being so unpleasant??
I enjoyed being a sahm and then a midwife.
Its been a great career for me
As a sahm I did lots of lovely things but being a midwife has given me a whole new perspective on life.
Is that ok or would you like to bash me a bit more ??

it's good that we all gain satisfaction from doing different things and leading different lifestyles.
I think your career sounds great namechange and I can see how you'd get a lot of satisfaction out of it, but for me I'd rather chew my own foot off than have to do that. i hate blood and guts would probably faint.

I enjoyed my career too and made a good living and then the dc came along. for reasons I don't wish to go into the minute I held ds1 I knew I wouldn't be returning to work. This may seem uninspiring to some I don't care, its how i felt. I don't regret it for one minute and also know I'm lucky enough to return to working in the same industry whenever I want to, even 24 years later.
There has never been the appeal although September may see me starting again

We are all different and have different life experiences and reasons for making the choices we do. You don't have to agree with other people's choices, but also you don't have to judge them.

merrymouse

Yes, I would have to work to pay bills but so would every other divorced person. I would have a nice 3 bed house and mortgage free. I know this is unusual but I'm sure I'm not the only sahm who would be in this position.