We are not a nation of animal loveras. More a nation of pet lovers

[fortyfide]

We kill animals by the million every year for meat But we do love our pet dogs , cats and other cute pets.

I am not a veggie. But would never call us Brits a nation of animal lovers

I like all animals.

It's unfortunate that some are made out of Bacon & Beef though

But seriously, being a meat eater doesn't mean you don't care about animals, it means that you accept that, in the natural order of things, they're lower down the food chain & there's no harm in eating them,

Interestingly, if we all went Vegan tomorrow the only place you'd find most farmyard animals would be in rare breed farms or zoos as there'd be no point in anyone keeping & feeding them, all our lovely pastures could be used as solar farms instead!!

If people really wanted to make a difference, they'd go meatless and potentially dairyless too.

Why though? Just to please people like you?

I'm quite happy eating meat and will continue to do so. If you want to live on nuts and grass, fine - don't force your bizarre beliefs on me though!!

We have evolved to eat meat. Our guts are designed to eat meat

I have a PhD in gut physiology and nutrient absorption migas!

Just saying!

I'll leave it there shall I

Why though? Just to please people like you?

No! Where I have said that. I don't really give a crap what other people eat and would never expect someone to change their diet to suit me. But don't pretend it's not cruel and that you love animals if you do eat meat/consumed dairy because it's cruel. There is no two ways about it.

Nuts and grass! Yes becuase everything that is not meat or dairy is nuts and grass! Love it

in the natural order of things, they're lower down the food chain & there's no harm in eating them

This properly fucked up thinking. No harm to who?
No harm to them?
No harm to the environment?
No harm to your health when shitty cheap animal by products are consumed?

Really!

And yes of course if everybody went vegan, there wouldn't be as many animals. What of it?

Are you going to go down an existentialist route now?

This properly fucked up thinking. No harm to who?

Well, obviously there's harm to the animals in that they're killed. .

I won't shed a tear for them...

As long as they have some quality of life before the axe falls, I'm honestly not bothered whether a cow or sheep has to die to feed humans.

Environment wise - not particularly bothered about animal impact - sorry!

Health wise - I'm fine thanks, lots of activities & hobbies on the go cheers - made all the better for the odd sausage sarnie along the way.

I've only got one life & I intend to cram it full of as many fun things (that are probably bad for me) as I can.

If you choose to spend yours licking lima beans & clumping around in plastic brogues with a scowl on your face - that's your choice!

This properly fucked up thinking. No harm to who?

Well, obviously there's harm to the animals in that they're killed. .

I won't shed a tear for them...

As long as they have some quality of life before the axe falls, I'm honestly not bothered whether a cow or sheep has to die to feed humans.

Environment wise - not particularly bothered about animal impact - sorry!

Health wise - I'm fine thanks, lots of activities & hobbies on the go cheers - made all the better for the odd sausage sarnie along the way.

I've only got one life & I intend to cram it full of as many fun things (that are probably bad for me) as I can.

If you choose to spend yours licking lima beans & clumping around in plastic brogues with a scowl on your face - that's your choice!

I'm honestly not bothered whether a cow or sheep has to die to feed humans

you also completely ignore the fact that no animal has to die to feed humans! But let's just overlook that so we can eat our cheap Richmond sausages shall we

A nation of hypocrites would probably be more apt. It makes me sick when people cry when they see dogs going to slaughter in the far east or when a domestic animals are living in poor conditions there are cries of 'prison, hang the bastard etc'. Or when people can't possibly eat cute bambii or thumper (venison or rabbit) but have no problem chowing down on the 'ugly' animals. I find it hard to belive these people have no idea of the barbaric conditions the animals they eat suffered.

I am a vegan who would not class myself as an animal lover, but I cannot justify tortuing an animal it's entire life for my eating pleasure. I actually don't have a problem with eating meat and if I could run my own story book style farm (the kind of farm most people actually think their meat and dairy comes from) where the animals had great lives outdoors, properly tended to, I would be not be vegan. As it is I can't eat animal products knowing the horrible suffering these poor creatures endure their entire lives.

Heres an eye opening article I was reading earlier today.
www.peta.org.uk/blog/photos-despair-pigs-uk-farm/

Bamboo if you have a PhD in gut physiology and nutrient uptake then you will be well aware that unlike true vegetarians, our body does not produce the cellulase enzyme which is crucial for the breakdown of the cell walls of plants and the extraction of nutrients from a solely plant diet.

Now of course, we get around that by cooking and don't need the cellulase enzyme. We are perfectly able to live vegetarian lives quite healthily. Many do and if they choose to do so then more power to them.

However, our natural state, if you were to put us in the wild as it were, would be omnivorous.

'Don't force your bizarre beliefs on me'

Yeah vegans, utterly bizarre with their plant eating fucked up diets.

Eating the cooked flesh of other sentient beings, the periods of various birds, and slurping the breast milk of an entirely different species from yourself, utterly, utterly normal.

Fyrefly what on earth are you talking about?
If we relied on cellulose (a indigestible carbon-based plant fibre) for energy, then we'd be in the shit.

But there is plenty of available carbs (starches and simply sugars) in plant foods,which once you've mechanically disrupted it down via mastication or cooking, or any other number of methods, is perfectly ready for your body to utilise and catabolise.

You are talking utter shite.

Actually laughing at fyrefly now.
Do you really think this.

I shall send you some Nutrition 101 powerpoint slides to clear things up for you.

Me, I'm good with my amylase sucrase and several other enzymes thanks!
Would love to read the paper in which cellulase has been found naturally in the human gut.

Send it my way won't you!

Anybody who thinks that fox hunting no longer takes place is being very naive. It is an unenforceable law.
I'm a vegan weekdays. Any animal products I buy are organic and free range. People want cheap affordable animal products and they want to eat them everyday. If we all cut them out one day a week the conditions for animals should improve. Sadly it seems many no longer associate meat products with animals. I have a friend who can't go into our local butchers because they have dead animals hanging up in there. My mil can't cook a whole chicken because you can see what it was when it was alive.
I can't abide cruelty to people or animals but anybody who eats factory farmed meat then derides fox hunting? I don't see the logic

It seems strange to me that anyone would expect anyone to love all animals. I don't know anyone who even loves all humans. Does it make me a people-hater that I only love specific humans that I have around me, and while I generally would want all people to live the best life possible I'm not out wailing in the streets for every person who died while I wrote this sentence?

So why is it strange to love animals the way we love people, as individuals?

I am generally pro animal welfare, but animals die. Its part of nature. I fail to see why an animal dying so a human can eat them is worse than an animal dying for another animal to eat.

I hope the holier than thou vegans on this thread don't ever swat a fly or moquito away in irritation.

iknowiam and if you can't take it, don't dish it out! You'll notice you started the insults first like I said, a bit thick

I fail to see why an animal dying so a human can eat them is worse than an animal dying for another animal to eat

Becausee one animal doesn't make the other animal spend their lives in torturous conditions. Only humans do that.

iknowiam Aah diddums!
If you can't take it, don't dish it out!
You'll notice you started the insults first, clearly this fact evades you like I said, a bit thick and you continue to do so.

I haven't told anybody what they should eat. But own it for what it is. A cruel, barbaric practice in the main.

And yes, a fish eating a fish is exactly the same as factory farming isn't it!

This thread is actually making me laugh now!
Comparing swatting a mosquito and not loving all humans to the the shitty practices that lead to awful lives for animals reared for meat.

Can I ask you whatever if you torture and inhumanely kill, then waste at least 50% of the humans you don't love?

Didn't think so.

Nobody is required to pursue your alternative diet to avoid being cruel to animals, and not all farmers are on some mission to hurt and be cruel to animals - let's not be ridiculous and absolutist.

As for "not killing animals" as the way to be kind to animals in the modern world, this is simplistic, naive and not really practical as it would create far more suffering in the long run than it averted - largely thanks to the number of problems we, human beings, have caused through our conviction that we know better than nature and evolution.

Nobody is required to pursue your alternative diet to avoid being cruel to animals, and not all farmers are on some mission to hurt and be cruel to animals - let's not be ridiculous and absolutist

Of course they're not. But the fact remains is the killing of animals is inhumane and under modern conditions in the pursuit of reaching quota's a lot of it is cruel and painful.

If we reverted back to the practices even 50 years ago, things would be so much better.

I also fail to see how not using modern farming practices will cause more suffering. Please elaborate as I am genuinely interested to hear your views on this.

not all farmers are on some mission to hurt and be cruel to animals - let's not be ridiculous and absolutist

I don't think the majority of farms deliberately deisgn them to be as cruel and painful as possible. The design them to be as productive as possible in a business sense. If the most econmically productive way to run the farm means the animals live terrible lives - thats just a by product that is not their concern. And therein lies the problem.

not all farmers are on some mission to hurt and be cruel to animals - let's not be ridiculous and absolutist

I don't think the majority of farmers don't go out of their way to make the animals lives as cruel and painful as possible. They design the farms to be as economically productive as possible. And if that design means the animals spend their lives in terrible conditions, that is not their concern. And therein lies the problem.

But the fact remains is the killing of animals is inhumane

Where did you get your PhD from again? Is that from the Gillian McKeith school of nutrition and biologicial understanding?

I am not sure what you are referring to as "inhumane". Humans have always killed animals so that is very definitely "humane". While animals aren't humans at all, so by very definition are "inhumane"

Animals aren't people you know! Let's try and give them as dignified life as possible and then eat them with the joy and respect that they deserve!