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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To ask for time off for egg donation?

73 replies

phoenixrose314 · 03/06/2015 05:52

I decided to become an altruistic egg donor back in December. Hubby and I decided we weren't going to have any more children, but I was once told I couldn't have children and then got lucky, so I wanted to "pass on the karma" or something and give another couple a chance at having their family. I got matched to a couple through an agency, it took a long time to go through all the testing, I went on the pill to match me up to a couple, fast forward six months and we're finally at the point where I am ready to donate and the recipient is ready to receive.

I am a teacher, and I told the agency from the start that it would have to fit around work as I don't believe in taking time off when not needed, the children I teach need consistency and need me to be there. All was going well and we were scheduled for half term for egg collection... all my appointments for the many, many blood tests and ultrasounds were late after school or on weekends and then into the half term. Then it came to light that I wasn't having enough FSH and my eggs weren't developing quickly enough, so I had to up my dose and the date for egg collection was pushed back... INTO term time.

Now the doctors asked me to do it yesterday, but I said no because it was the kids' first day back after half term, so I arranged it for today during my release time (I have from 11.30 onwards today free for planning and assessment time). I figured that way, nobody needs to make any arrangements, I can just get it done. Only I forgot that we have a staff meeting after school, which usually I would need to be back for if I am off site during that time.

So I put in a request to my Head to have the time off (just for the staff meeting). I knew it was very last minute, but as she didn't need to bring in anybody to cover me as I was supposed to be out anyway, I didn't think it would matter.

I got pulled into her office at the end of the day yesterday and read the riot act about taking time off for personal reasons, that my release time is not to do whatever I like with (directly contradicting what she said to me last year which was that I can do what I like in my release time as long as the work gets done), that she has no inclination or grounds to grant me the time off, that staff meetings are not optional (er, I do know that, that's why I asked for time off). She then asked me if I was "done" after the appointment and I said yes, and she asked if it was for me, and I said no. She pulled a face that clearly said she wasn't impressed with that answer. She granted me the time, but said quite clearly that I am not to ask for anything like this again.

I do realise it was last minute, but I chose a time that I thought wouldn't have been a problem, I have been to so many appointments around work to try to not let it affect my work life at all, the original egg collection was supposed to happen in the holidays so it would never have affected it at all, and I just feel like she was ripping me apart, almost making me feel SELFISH for doing it!

I was in tears most of the evening yesterday. I am aware that with all the hormones I've been having to inject, I am probably more sensitive than usual, but I just can't believe how horrible she was. I could understand if she'd said "Look, given that you're doing this for someone else and not yourself, there's no real grounds for me to grant you this request", but she honestly just laid into me like I was doing it for fun, or to get out of work. It's not actually been very fun feeling bloated and injecting myself twice a day and being hormonal and being exhausted from travelling to and from London every other day.

So... am I being unreasonable, or was she?

OP posts:

fiveacres · 03/06/2015 08:23

I can assure you I was never disciplined for going to Sainsburys, or for any other reason actually!

Blu · 03/06/2015 08:25

As an employer I want to know if my staff are entering into any arrangements that would lead to an arrangement taking precedence over work.

On a human level she was unpleasant and unsympathetic, but it is not the school's mission to assist with altruistic conception initiatives and your contract takes precedence in working hours.

I have had staff talk to me about flxi arrangements around outside concerns, and if consulted in advance I have a chance to be supportive if possible, make flexible arrangements if easy enough, or say 'sorry not possible'. You sprung it on her.

However, I hope all goes well.

Mistigri · 03/06/2015 08:26

It sounds like a complete overreaction on the part of the head - it is actually possible for two grown adults to disagree without one of them finding it necessary to "read the riot act". (It doesn't entirely surprise me though as my many teacher friends in the UK almost all seem to have come across incompetent/ bullying heads with no people management skills).

Technically, your head does of course have right to dictate, within reason, what you do with your paid time. But that's not how good managers work - good managers know that treating professionals like responsible adults is a far more effective way of getting the best out of them, and that sometimes this requires a bit of flexibility and empathy. I have never, in nearly 30 years of private sector employment, been treated as a naughty school kid by a manager and I'm amazed at how teachers put up with it!

Spadequeen · 03/06/2015 08:28

I was going to say yabu as that is what annual leave is for but having read your post I think your head wbu and reacted very badly.

Hope you feel ok today and that all goes well for the couple you've tried to help

prepperpig · 03/06/2015 08:36

I didn't say you were fiveacres, I was just saying that it would potentially be grounds for disciplinary action and so others shouldn't be tempted to follow your example.

Custardcream14 · 03/06/2015 08:38

She sounds like the sort of person that would be angry at you leaving work early because your house was burning down!

I understand it was an important meeting etc, but really, it's not like you didn't try to avoid this!

Where I work people have appointments in work, no questions asked, but of course we don't have the holidays, but still!

eurochick · 03/06/2015 08:38

The bit I think was most unreasonable was declining to go for egg collection yesterday when the clinic wanted you to. Over mature eggs can't be fertilised. Hopefully in this case a day won't make a difference.

TwinkieTwinkle · 03/06/2015 09:03

So torn over this. What you're doing is an amazing thing (seriously well done) but people can't start having time off for any good deed they want to do. The head's reaction was unpleasant, she could have talked to you in a better manner. However, I can understand why she might be annoyed at being put in a position where she felt she had to say yes.

Blu · 03/06/2015 09:04

She does sound unpleasant, but in contractual and employment terms I think you put her in a difficult position.

Perhaps you should have just said 'urgent hospital appointment' rather than expecting her to agree to an un-consulted on, un-arranged in advance, altruistic personal mission.

sparechange · 03/06/2015 09:12

I really doubt you'll be in a fit state for work for 48 hours to be honest.
I had my egg collection at 4pm and was back at work the next day. If you recover well from sedation, there is no reason you won't be in a 'fit state'

Fauxlivia · 03/06/2015 09:47

The people saying that ppa time shouldn't be used for personal appts, what about all the personal time that teachers give up in order to do school work? If schools want that commitment from staff, then they should be prepared to offer some flexibility where possible.

The OP wasn't asking for supply teachers to be brought in, or for anything that would cost the school extra money - she would have done the ppa work in her own time.

prepperpig · 03/06/2015 10:13

Thats' a different thread entirely faux but with the vast majority of salaried jobs people are expected to do work outside of working hours ( and without the extensive annual leave too ), it doesn't mean you can do your own stuff during working hours

This will completely derail the OPs thread though so should perhaps be started elsewhere.

Fauxlivia · 03/06/2015 10:35

To be fair to the OP she did try to do this during the holidays. Maybe she was naive to think it would all go smoothly but not having donated before, she can be forgiven for failing to anticipate all potential issues.

She is doing something that will be utterly life changing for the other couple and it is not an easy thing to do. I just think her head could have been kinder and more understanding about a one off request, especially as schools do routinely expect out of hours commitment from staff.

Not like she was asking for a regular day off to something trivial.

DamnBamboo · 03/06/2015 10:37

I can assure you I was never disciplined for going to Sainsburys, or for any other reason actually!

And this why teachers get given a hard time!

None of the teachers I know do this! None.

DamnBamboo · 03/06/2015 10:39

Not like she was asking for a regular day off to something trivial

The reasons for the time off is irrelevant. What's trivial to you may not be to others. Some people may think doing this is no big deal! I know I would never do this and would never expect my employer to have to cover any costs (however small) associated with this in any shape of form.

DamnBamboo · 03/06/2015 10:41

All salaried jobs have a clause that says that sometimes you are epxected to work outside your normal hours. This is not strictly reserved for teachers and other civil servants.

fiveacres · 03/06/2015 10:42

Damn, the point is that you have a certain amount of non contact time and if I choose to nip to sainsburys in that non contact time and do my marking at home rather than vice versa, it doesn't make me a terrible teacher.

One of the reasons I used to go (it was next to the school) was to get snacks for the kids who came to me at lunch for revision, so quit it with insinuating that I was a lackadaisical and lazy teacher for daring to go to a supermarket between the hours of 8 and 4

The point was that I could and certainly my belief was always that this was fine: you have certain tasks to do as a teacher but there is always SOME flexibility as to when you do them.

DamnBamboo · 03/06/2015 10:47

I am not insinuating you are a lazy teacher! Where have I done that?
I'm saying making statements like that is why teachers get a shitty reputation that's all. You aren't helping yourself.

Nice bit of drip-feeding though, so you do feel as though you have to justify it.

MidniteScribbler · 03/06/2015 10:51

I'm so glad I work for a head who is a human being and understands we are professionals and able to occasionally attend an appointment in working hours whilst not letting work suffer.

BlackTrivet · 03/06/2015 10:53

I am a teacher (part-time) and have donated eggs altruistically.

Like you I planned it during holiday time (summer holidays), and had no time off school at all for appointments. Thankfully it all worked out and school knew nothing about it.

I think you head is being very unreasonable - you have tried everything reasonably possible to do this entirely in your own time. I would be really shocked if my head behaved like this towards me in this situation (and they are pretty tough when it comes to time off!).

Sorry - I have to rush off now and haven't had chance to read anything other than the OP.

fiveacres · 03/06/2015 10:54

When you announced that 'none of the teachers you knew went to the supermarket' - yes, I did feel I had to justify myself.

My point was that when you are teaching you should be there. Of course. When you are not - it's your business what you do with your time.

I am an adult and I do not have to 'do myself any favours' if I decided it was a better use of my time to get some things from Sainsburys in a PPA period and take year 10 books home with me than do it the other way around and I'm surprised anyone would have an issue with this to be honest.

At any rate - that's for another thread!

DamnBamboo · 03/06/2015 10:57

Of course. When you are not - it's your business what you do with your time

Really? Is this how teacher's contracts are nowadays? So you can go where you like during PPA time with no expectation of needing to be in your place of employment! As a governor, this surprises me greatly!

StupidBloodyKindle · 03/06/2015 10:57

Bloody hell. It just makes me want to jump into a and go back and kiss my old head. She let me take an afternoon once to see my DD in her first nativity play. That was not remotely altruistic.
Anyway... to you OP. What you are doing is AMAZING. I know because I looked into it once, would have gone through with it, but still admit to being a bit relieved when would-be recipient friend chose not to.

fiveacres · 03/06/2015 11:01

In the schools I've worked in Damn - yes. Thankfully. I got my hair done once in a PPA period that was either side of lunch. Sorry if that causes horror but really it just comes down to time management - which was ironically always one of my strong points.

I haven't taught for four years now so no idea if thats changed but certainly in the glory days of 2009 that was what I did!

prepperpig · 03/06/2015 11:07

fiveacres clearly people do have an issue with it. Because its wrong. When you are supposed to be working you are supposed to be working whether that's contact time or not. It is grounds for disciplinary action and nobody should be following your bad example.

You might have been lucky but others might not be.

In this case the OP could have taken the time off as sickness absence and so it's completely different anyway but your statement that its ok to "do my sainsbury's shop" is incorrect and could get people into serious trouble if they did the same.

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