Contemplating training as a Primary School Teacher

[Nicky898]

A relative is at this stage after working in the hospitality industry for a number of years since graduating in Biomedical Science from a south coast university. She earns good money but works very long hours including week-ends and late nights. Her family think she would make a superb teacher. She loves maths and has A level and Higher/Further maths qualification.
Reading round posts here, now several years old, I am wondering if it is still the case that entry to permanent primary teaching posts is extremely competative and that very high numbers of applications are chasing very few vacancies? It was suggested that schools (for budgetary reasons) tend to manage with NQTs and tempoary posts, and that changes to pensions arrangements and the rise of Academy status are depressing the sence of reward individuals perceive. Is this still the case, or is there reason for optimism?

Why do her family think she would be a good teacher? The qualities that Joe Public see as desirable not not neccessairly translate into a good teacher. Does she want to be a teacher? Teaching is amazing and awful all at the same time. There are lots of similar conversations in staffroom.

The average primary school teacher works 60 hours a week and it is reduced to 55 for secondary teacher. With a starting salary of £21,000 this is less them minimum wage.

Primary schools are very competitive. If she wants to teach she needs to spend some time observat lessons to see if teaching is what she wants. I am in my early 30s and lessons and therefore the planning of lessons is very different than when I was a student at school.

wrong Mona.

Teachers do not get paid for that 13 weeks 'holiday'. As I said, the pay is salaried for ease over the year.

Op she will walk into maths secondary jobs.

I teach 20 periods a week (im part time). 9 different classes. books to be marked once a fortnight. 3 hours per set. Plus two lunch duties at 45 mins each, one bus duty at 15 mins, one break duty at 20 mins. Then planning. Say, 30 mins for planning and creating resourses for each lesson each week (30 mins x 20 lessons) Obviously if an observation or ofsted more like four hours per lesson. One meeting / development session after school each week for two hours. 1 hour of briefings a week. Then theres all the walking around from room to room as you dont have your own room so need to vacate and move everything when you have a free, which eats into your marking time.

The extras (on top of the normal work needed that week) are 7 parents evenings a year at 3 hours each. Two open evenings (for years 6 and 11) at 4hours each. 7 sets of reports to write once a year. I can do them In about 3 hours per set. Then there are data collections. For every class once a term. If youre organised maybe 30- 45 minutes per class.

Also easter school (3 days this year) and spring bank holiday extra classes (2 days) are now the norm. Obviously no extra pay. And saturday morning revision too. Again no extra pay but mot exactly voluntary.

7 year groups of reports to write sorry.

Also, if i hand my notice in today, i can leave on the 31st of december

Half an hour to plan every lesson? Don't you use previous plans and resources?

I was averaging 50 hours a week and I was part time. Full time colleagues are about 60-70 per week. It's not just about the hours either, it's the mental and physical strain of looking after and controlling a class full of children for 6 hours per day. Worrying about them not only in school but when they get home.

The paperwork isn't just a get on and do it task either. It requires constant creativity and unique solutions to problems in pretty much an hourly basis all while you are so tired you want to hit your head on the table until you knock yourself out.

Teaching can be amazing in the right school but horrific in the wrong one. FYI Ofsted ratings are no indicator.

Teachers are not paid for holidays. Due to a European Court ruling statutory holiday entitlement had to be included in teacher pay and conditions so they highlighted a random number of weeks and said their you go. No change in holiday entitlement, no change in pay.

Twas a paper exercise only.

I would consider secondary maths or science as these are shortage subjects and there are financial incentives to do that.

I have worked at several high level careers and honestly the hours are very long, and the pressure and stress is astronomical and far greater in comparison to my other careers.
However it's great, no day is the same, I genuinely wouldn't swap it for anything else.
But do not consider it an easier option. It's anything but , and the pay isn't great however I bloody love it. :)

It all depends what type of teacher she wants to be...I know a few who skate through using the resources of others and doing the bare minimum and as such don't have quite such the workload that most do. On the whole, there is no work life balance during term time, and as graduate professions go average starting pay is pretty poor.

I would suggest maybe a STEM subject at secondary might be better, they are desperate for them. I qualified in English which is the heaviest marking load you can imagine!

43 hours a week here, full time.

Which I think is very reasonable for the pay.

I've been a primary teacher for the last 6 years after 2 decades in industry. I have no regrets about retraining because it is THE most rewarding job ever! However, it is also the most demanding and challenging thing I have ever done (including when I did a degree while working and bringing up my children). Yes, in the first 3 years it will be eat, sleep and breathe teaching. I still find it demanding but now, with experience, have a better balance. Having said that, I'm going part time from September because I'm shattered!

Who thinks MonaLottie failed to get into a teaching course?!

The irony is I have Primary QTS Became a SAHM for a while and am now working as a pre-school teacher until DD goes to secondary when I might return to the coalface and spend 24/7 planning and marking and getting no paid holidays

So you'd recommend that the OP's relative became a teacher?
Have you been out of primary teaching for a number of years, and have you experienced working as a FT class teacher?
I think the OP should look at the TES forums and The Staffroom threads on MN to give her a taste of why some might not think it's necessarily the right choice.
Although we have no idea if the poor woman actually wants to be a teacher, or if it's just her relatives pressurising her to do something they might be judging as a step up from hospitality that uses her degree.

The irony is I have Primary QTS Became a SAHM for a while and am now working as a pre-school teacher until DD goes to secondary when I might return to the coalface and spend 24/7 planning and marking and getting no paid holidays

...Why snigger? I'd love you to return to this thread once your DD is in secondary and tell us how your primary teaching job is going, and how many hours on top of the 1265 directed time over 195 working days that you are actually paid for you are doing, during your (unpaid) evenings, weekends and holidays. You DO understand the concept of 'salaried', don't you?

Your friends who don't spend much time working away from the classroom are not like ANY decent teacher I know.

OP, in my area NQT Primary are ten a penny and chasing the same jobs. You would be snapped up as a secondary Maths teacher. Really, teens don't change. They have the same issues, problems, worries, reactions, hormones, hopes and dreams as us as teens. Once you've got the measure of this, they are really not scary!

Despite the endless whining on MN teaching is a very good career to get into. It's flexible, works well with kids and the pay and prospects are decent.

If it wasn't, primary jobs wouldn't be like hens teeth.

Yet we have advertised THREE times and not found a teacher yet! primary teaches are now an endangered species around here

90 on average going for every advertised job round here...

Send some my way! The first time we advertised ,we had 2 applicants who pulled out before interview as they had found posts in between applying and the interview, second time we had one applicant who simply didnt turn up and the last time we had one applicant whose application was SO bad it wasn't worth interviewing him! The time before when we recruited we had one applicant who, thankfully, was brilliant!

I am a primary teacher and I love my job. It's hard work and there's a lot more to it than just the classroom bit but it's great fun most of the time! I'm very lucky to work in a great (though challenging) school with an excellent team of staff who support each other.

gobbin - I was returning 32percent's

I would recommend teaching as a career if that's what someone wanted to do. It's been good to me as a FT class teacher and allowed me to work (in pre-school) very flexibly to fit round DD who has additional needs. I also do some supply so I know the current situation in primary schools.

I would echo undoubtedly's post at 19:29

I'm confused about the 'unpaid holidays' thing. See below (Scotland).

"A teacher’s total working year is 195 days including five days for in-service
training and every year you’ll get 40 days holiday at full pay."

www.educationscotland.gov.uk/Images/Teach%20in%20Scotland_Handbook_tcm4-843266.pdf

The holidays are a red herring and are ultimately unimportant.

You get a salary. Who cares what it exactly covers? If you aren't happy with the pay them do something else.

I'd love to do a PGDE, but would struggle with the hours for that year. I may have to wait (but will be late 40s by the time DD is through PS).