Farmer fired shots over my head, what if anything can I do?

[unexpectedplaces]

Can I ask if anyone knows if this is illegal or not in relation to a right of way across a farmers' land?

To explain what happened and give context. I was walking my dog through a field full of sheep and lambs, dog was at my heel the whole time (no issue whatsoever with the livestock) and we were then away from the sheep and heading for a kissing gate which is where the right of way footpath leads. It crosses a small field and ends up in a village, you can also veer to the left of the kissing gate and continue through the same field ending up at the same point near the village.

I elected to take the left hand path which is about 2 feet away from the official path but divided by a hedge because the small field with the footpath was full of sheep and lambs resting by the gate - I didn't want to disturb them.

I was walking into the sunlight so couldn't see properly but could just about make out a figure a short distance away, a shot was fired into the air followed by 3 more as I walked the length of the hedge. I was really quite worried and hurried through the gate at the end whereupon the shots stopped.

I believe that the gun was either a rifle or a shotgun as the report was pretty loud.

I appreciate that I was off the official footpath strictly speaking but was doing so for purely altruistic reasons (of course he didn't know that).

Should I take this further or was the farmer within his rights? I wish he had just approached me and I could have explained what I was doing and why. The whole incident was pretty unnerving if I'm honest.

Have spoken to a couple of locals who say that the farmer is well known for getting irate about people walking off the right of way.

Any advice please gratefully received

Sonceydog , I don't think there's much comparison between someone trespassing in my garden (they'd be by definition about five metres away from my glass doors) and someone straying from a footpath on land miles away from my house (were I lucky enough to own land miles away from my house!) There is no invasion of privacy in the latter.
In fact, when numerous villagers DID trespass into our garden (when we were having building work done a couple of summers ago - they wanted to have a nose at the work) dh generally offered them a cup of tea, rather than discharging shots.
And in my experience, not ALL farmers mind people straying from the footpaths. I frequently walk the dog off piste around the fields here, as do many other people - have been seen by numerous farmers, who have simply waved a cheery hello!
The savage advocacy of ownership rights above rules of common courtesy/kindness on here I find surprising, and little like my experience of people I have met in RL.

We have a bird scarer to keep away crows. The pick the eyes out of lambs and kill the chicks our chickens have.

As I said earlier - if he had been firing a warning shot you would likely have got a mouthful too. I think it is a case of you misinterpreting something that is normal for country life. Guns are part and parcel of country life.

The OP has been walking successive generations of dogs through these fields her whole life - she might just know if there was a crow scarer, or have an inkling that people use guns to shoot rabbits ducks or whatever, in the country.

Thank you Blu.

AuntieDee do you really in your heart of hearts think it's acceptable to fire warning shots (if that's what it was) over the issue of a 100 yard stretch of grass the wrong side of a hedge? A mouthful of abuse, yup that's fine but warning shots? As someone said up thread we don't live in Texas when I last looked. If that's what it was then it is totally OTT. I doubt it was a crow scarer, I've had horses all my life too and have had to ride past plenty of them, it didn't sound the same and there was a guy just standing there who has a massive issue with protecting rights of way.

I did say unless he has previous form. I come from a family of farmers, most walkers are respectful and stick to paths. The odd one things they are within their rights to just walk wherever they see a path. Frightening for both them and the guns if there happens to be a shoot on that day. Also op I presume if you had been sure he had been firing towards you you would have been straight on the phone to the police not asking people's opinion on here. I would talk to more locals/dog walkers see if they have had any bother. If he's already been reported to police I would also report my incident. One of our local farmers is notorious for blowing his top at people who stray off the footpath, police have been involved several times. He still has his shotgun tho...
Well done for having such a well trained dog

UP why on earth do you think they were warning shots? It sounds like a huge misunderstanding and you are getting your knickers in a twist over nothing and people on MN are increasing this.

There is one guy round here who used to fire warning shots at riders on the public road past his farm during the last foot and mouth outbreak. I am no longer surprised.

If they were warning shots then I don't think it's acceptable, but do you 'in your heart of hearts' think that someone would fire warning shots without giving you a mouthful to ensure you knew that was what they were?

Yes if I had been sure of his intent I would have phoned the police immediately.

There is another bit of land that he owns but some other people have access over it, heaven help any runner or dog walker who goes on that strip of road if they aren't visiting the people who have the access. I didn't really want to ask around too much in case he hasn't done anything wrong, that's why I just wanted to ask anonymous opinion on here and hopefully have a quiet word with the local community police person.

He is quite eccentric, in his late '70's, always been on his own, lives in a dilapidated but could be beautiful house and just seems to have too much time on his hands.

AuntieDee he probably didn't feel that he needed to shout as well tbh! I'm not getting my knickers in a twist at all btw . I'm perfectly calm and trying to see all points of view. I've not actually done anything yet.

and wow I would never have guessed that so many people cared about 100 yards of prohibited field!

I don't care about that, I'm more interested in why you thought you were being shot at, despite there being no evidence.

I suspect a guilty conscience helped you decide this was all about you rather than someone legitimately going about their business on their land.

But do let us know the outcome, I'm interested in how the police will tell you to bugger off phrase their reply...

Guilty conscience for what? Trying not to disturb a resting flock of sheep? I don't think so somehow .

IKnowIAm I don't care about that, I'm more interested in why you thought you were being shot at, despite there being no evidence.

Why on earth would a person have to provide evidence that they "think" they were being shot at, because they heard signs of shots being fired near them? Its the job of the police to gather evidence. If it gets to that stage. Its also a very useful function of the police that if, having a set of circumstances reported to them that could potentially be a crime, can investigate it if they think it warrants it, and have a quiet word with the owner of the gun.

Guns are licensed because the owners are expected to use them in a certain way. Frightening people and making them think they are being shot at by deviating from a path is not a normal use of a firearm in this country. The OP doesn't have to carry out an expert analysis on whether she was mistaken over whether she thought she was being shot at (and certainly not whether she has a "guilty conscience") - it simply sounds like an inappropriate use of a firearm which should be investigated the police. For the common sense reason that the next time it happens, it might not be a warning shot.

I suspect a guilty conscience helped you decide this was all about you rather than someone legitimately going about their business on their land.

Its hardly legitimate if they are discharging a firearm close to where someone is walking!

I think it would be a good idea to have a chat with the police OP. As you have said, you don't know if he was shooting because of you, or something unconnected, it would be nice to have that looked into. All you can do is give the police the information you have, and let them decide what to do with it. Its not a big deal, and doesn't need anyone to get hysterical about it, but it could be part of a pattern of concerning behaviour.

Its hardly legitimate if they are discharging a firearm close to where someone is walking

It is perfectly legal to shoot a firearm across a footpath as long as the person isn't hindered and forced to detour their route (and it is legal to pass when you are walking and someone is shooting as long as you don't interrupt their shoot ie if you can see the gun is being aimed, then pause until it is discharged). If you stretch this to 50 yards, which is the legal distance from a public highway, then the OP has taken themselves twice the distance from the 'safety' of the public footpath and put themselves at risk.

Also have you heard how loud a shotgun is? It's nothing like what you hear on the TV - it's bloody loud. Someone could be shooting two fields away and not even know you were there and it still sound close. OP has said they don't know if the figure they saw was the one shooting, or even if it was even the farmer.

Guns are part and parcel of farm life and if you walk in the countryside you are going to come across them from time to time. The simple act of a gun being fired does not automatically mean it is a gun wielding psychopath.

Frightening people and making them think they are being shot at by deviating from a path is not a normal use of a firearm in this country.

There is no actual evidence of this - the OP admits they didn't even see who fired the gun...

Isn't hindered dear god. I suppose if he had a shaky hand then my day may have turned out a bit differently!

I was only a few feet from the legal footpath anyhow, it stretched 100 yards in length but at no time was I more than a few feet from the actual path (small hedge divided my route from the legal path).

Of course I've heard a shotgun numerous times before, I've lived out here for 30 years and have friends who are vets, own smallholdings, farms etc. I know what they sound like and I know what one pretty close up sounds like.

Well that's a new piece of information, not only did you stray from the path, you strayed into another field if it was separated from the hedge.

OP - if you stick to the footpaths then the farmer can see you and refrain from shooting until you have passed (as is advised, not mandated). If you stray from the footpath, how can someone going about their legitimate business that can be a necessary part of their livelihood be expected predict this - you have now just admitted you were being a hedge in a field you had no business being in as the footpath was in the next field.

Footpaths are there to protect both you and land owners. Sticking to them stops misunderstandings where people are shooting on their own land completely legitimately.

You didn't see the gun - perhaps if you had been on the footpath you might have, and this whole incident need not have happened.

AuntieDee Guns are part and parcel of farm life and if you walk in the countryside you are going to come across them from time to time. The simple act of a gun being fired does not automatically mean it is a gun wielding psychopath.

I've lived in the countryside most of my life, and I've never had the feeling I'm being shot at, probably because most farmers have the sense to check that there are no people likely to be hit or frightened by their shooting. You must live in a very strange part of the world where the reckless discharge of a firearm happens "from time to time".

There is no actual evidence of this - the OP admits they didn't even see who fired the gun...

Sounds even worse...might have been some unknown person discharging the firearm. All the more reason to go to the police so they can investigate whether there was shooting, and by whom. Often by asking a simple question of the farmer in question.

How ridiculous to suggest that the OP has to verify the identify of a person she believes to be shooting at her!

A firearms license is a privilege, and one which can be lost through misuse. Any idiot should know that shooting in the vicinity of someone near a public footpath is reckless. Doesn't matter what the OP was doing, we are not allowed to shoot at people in this country to warn them off.

Again shooting 'pretty close up' is not illegal if the person is doing so on their own land. How on earth have you lasted 30 years in the countryside if you assume a gun going off is a personal warning to you? When you have no actual proof of this?

most farmers have the sense to check that there are no people likely to be hit or frightened by their shooting

The farmer may well have done, but as the person was off the footpath and behind a hedge in a field they had no business being in, maybe they simply didn't see them?

It is all easily avoidable - stick to the footpaths.

Disclaimer - apart from the idiot old farmer next door who used to "shoot rabbits" right next to my bedroom window, although he had 120 acres to shoot in. He was annoyed that someone had bought the house next to his land - he had expected the old man that owned it to leave it him in his will and he didn't.

As I say, I know the type.

AuntieDee you sound really confused, as if you think people have a duty to avoid being shot, so that farmers can go around wilfully discharging shotguns near to footpaths and so on.

I don't think I'd follow your advice in a million years! You really do seem to inhabit quite an odd world. Fair enough if you're genuinely worried about security, but that's not the case here.

Do you have any evidence at all, by way of case law, to support your views?

AuntieDee you obviously haven't read the whole thread have you.

Let me try and explain the lay out of the field (s). If you imagine a piece of A4 paper divided into quarters. The top hand right corner is a little field and the the other 3/4 is one big field. The footpath enters the bottom middle of the paper, you walk across half the paper into the the middle and then the footpath enters the little top right quarter and exits at the top middle of the paper. The sheep were all bunched up together by the gate in the middle where I would have entered, to avoid disturbing them all I just stayed in the original 3/4 field but followed the hedge along the 'wrong' side, I then exited at the top middle which rejoined the correct path.

The farmer or whoever he was, was standing in the top left hand quarter of the piece of paper and so would/could have watched me the whole way across to the middle. The shots started the moment I deviated off the designated path which was a tiny distance and ceased the minute I rejoined the path and left the fields all together.

So I was not behind the hedge I was actually in the same field albeit a bit away from him so he must have seen me as the sun was behind him and would have flooded over me.

Does that make sense? I would put up a google map but would rather give my location away.

Case law? No one was actually shot.

See attached image - the most that the farmer could be 'done' for is 'common law nuisance' for firing over a right of way assuming that they were firing over the right of way and not 180 degrees in the other direction but as the OP wasn't on the footpath, this wouldn't actually apply.

Not confused no...

OP you just sound paranoid... The farmer has every business to be where he was shooting not at you, whereas, by your own admission, did not. The fact that the two coincided may well have been just that - a coincidence.

As I stated about - the law states that he can be prosecuted for 'common law nuisance' but as you strayed from the footpath, it really doesn't apply.