To think that all the people who say "fold your buggy" are being a bit daft?

[Pyjamaramadrama]

I regularly read threads on here about buggies on buses and they get quite heated.

The consensus seems to be that buggies should be folded.

Before anyone says anything I absolutely think that wheelchair users and other disabilities need to take priority for obvious reasons.

However the type of prams for newborns would be nearly impossible for a parent on their own to fold while holding a baby and possibly shopping etc. it's much easier with a toddler who can stand and a stroller which can be easily folded. But you simply cannot put a newborn in a stroller. I'm pregnant with #2 and I've searched for the most compact, easy to fold pram, but I still wouldn't fancy trying to board a bus with a floppy newborn while trying to fold pram and negotiate my bags.

Lucky for me I drive but I can remember being in the predicament with my firstborn of having to get the bus on older style buses and I simply couldn't do it, I had a lie flat pram where the pram needed to be removed to fold the chassis, packs of nappies and formula and newborn ds, I had no Internet access at the time so no online shopping and I ended up in tears once trying to board a bus and dropping everything and the driver and passengers just staring at me.

Also perhaps it is just where I live but all the new buses now have buggy and wheelchair zones so there is room for everyone most of the time.

As I'll say again wheelchair users do come first as ultimately a parent could probably walk if necessary, but why do some people seem to be so against anything which makes new parents lives easier? Maybe they've forgotten what it's like or haven't had to manage the bus alone with newborn.

Oh and my parents and grandparents reckon it was a nightmare with the old buses before buggy zones as they simply couldn't board the bus with a pram.

Fatlazymummy I do realise about years ago, I think I mentioned it in my op. just because people had to struggle in lots of ways 'years ago' doesn't mean it's wrong to move with the times and make life easier.

And do you realise that not everyone has a choice in where they live, or what pushchair they have?

Fatlazymummy I do realise about years ago, I think I mentioned it in my op. just because people had to struggle in lots of ways 'years ago' doesn't mean it's wrong to move with the times and make life easier.

And do you realise that not everyone has a choice in where they live, or what pushchair they have?

Thinking of the past - my dm had the carriage type pram of her generation, lots of children and no car. But she also had milk delivered every morning, a bread van that came round the houses, a fish van, a fizzy juice he (that may have been part of the bread van actually!)
So life was designed for people not driving/going on buses.

. Bit of tolerance wouldn't go amiss as long as people aren't being totally selfish

works both ways though doesn't it?

Yes people should help and be patient. but people should also make more thoughtful choices rather than just lay the responsibility onto everyone else to accommodate them and their inappropriate choices re prams

Back in the day we all used to manage, few mums had their own cars. I don't understand why it is so much harder now. Of course people in wheelchairs had no access either which wasn't a good thing.

I always wonder when reading these threads.... If you get off to make room for someone in a wheelchair, to wait for the next bus, do you have to pay again? Because that could get expensive!

I live in a very rural area with no public transport and perforce drive everywhere with DS, so I have no experience of this.

Brandysnapper that's a good point my mum had a milkman and a bread and a pop man, there was a local butchers and the green grocers, sadly they're all long since gone and places with nice local shops tend to be very pricey, or you get one local spa which sells little fresh food and is expensive, times have changed in more ways than one.

It does work both ways and pushchairs can be ridiculously oversized simply for walking around let alone buses but I don't think buggies on buses are a bad thing full stop.

There are lots of foldable buggies suitable from birth. I have a bugaboo bee, you can also get a McLaren and many others as PPs have mentioned. I bought mine on the basis I would be using London transport (tube & bus) for most of the time. Why would you buy a massive non-foldable buggy if you know that you are going to use buses often?

I have a 6 year gap between DS1 (2008) and DS2, in that time I have noticed that prams and buggies have become friggin' enormous. The Bugaboo Donkey, the Stokke thing - they really are the Porsche Cayennes of the buggy world. If you want people to be helpful to you, maybe think about how antisocial you look when you're bashing ankles up the bus aisle.

Using a bus can be great or it can be hugely painful. We should all be more considerate of each other. But mostly we should recognise that the space we park our buggies in is a wheelchair space and people with disabilities have priority. Yes, it can be horrible. But a horrible bus journey is over in less than an hour. Living with a disability is shit all the time.

Also we need to stop fighting with each other. Lobby pram manufacturers for affordable foldable buggies and lobby transport providers for dedicated buggy space.

you don't get off, starling, you fold!

if you are using an oyster it likely won't cost you anything or much to get another bus, unless you are only intending to get two buses for the whole day.

Brandysnapper, I had milk delivered in the early 70s when my eldest were born, other than that it was a bus ride to the supermarket. I would have a toddler by the hand, baby in a sling or as he got older in the buggy. Bags on the handle and under the buggy and the toddler would walk on the bus, buggy folded and buggy and bags put on the bus. Maybe the difference was people helped, I would always get some old lady holding on to the toddler and someone, male or female grabbing the buggy. We did it as we had no choice but it was, and is, doable. Nice to just walk on the bus but if there is no space then fold the buggy.

Starling - I love your use of perforce - my old drama professor's favourite word!

tondelay just wondering if you can fold your bee one handed? I've not been able to with mine but would love to as it would make life so much easier. is there a knack to it?

I drive and don't use public transport much. Last year I was in London and was amazed at how many young men were trying to help me with my luggage, they were lovely and it made my day. Don't they help young women anymore or is it just us grannies that they like to make a fuss of?

Rural bus services are shit and food stores in villages are expensive and poor quality.

But it's not because there are wheelchair spaces on buses.

I wonder if the key thing that made it work in the past was people helping. I was generally helped by old ladies, who were fab. But if it's a generational thing the number of people who do will be less now.

thing is buggies are big business now. I think people are suckered in to fancy names and ir almost being a status symbol. so they spend literally hundreds on a bugaboo or whatever expensive brand everyone is getting complete with those yummy mummy change bags etc. and little thought goes into how big it is or what they will be using it for.

People want the four wheel drive version of a buggy cos they think. It looks good

if they'd have realised it barely fits in a lift or they have no hope of getting it around John lewis they'd have probably chosen differently.

you just know by 6 months the babies going be in a snack stained maclaren borrowed from a mate while they bid on ebay for one. just like everyone else.

Sometimes the rows between multiple buggy users on buses are a sight to behold. I see that more than clashes between buggy users and non buggy users.

There might be mrsmilky but in 7 years I haven't learned yet. When I've had to fold I have a sling or give the baby to someone else. I also carry shopping in a rucksack rather than use the basket bit.

I had a Graco Citisport; it was great - really easy to fold and unfold, though not completely lie-flat for a newborn. All the muddy wheels at the bottom when folded, too.

A good public transport system should be roll-on roll-off for as many buggies and wheelchairs as can fit while having a reasonable balance of seats and space - it means fewer delays at bus stops while buggies are folded and it encourages more people to use public transport and avoid driving. It also means that floppy, fragile new babies can stay more safely in their pram or lie-flat buggy rather than being held in arms by people who aren't slinging. Not everyone's first pram has a removable car seat, especially if they don't drive.

That's not less true just because we're irritated by a few people who don't fold when we think they should, so we hoik a bit and say all parents have no right to hope for anything other than having to fold (pick your gripe - because people always used to have to before the late 90s, because they are entitled, because they oughtn't to have bought big pushchairs, whatever...).

My idea of a good public transport system is one that nearly always (so not at busy commuting times or when there are wheelchairs on a particular bus) lets a new, inexperienced mum with a three week old baby walk out of her house to a bus stop, roll on to a bus without having to fold, and roll off again at her destination. I think that's one of the things that public transport is actually for and it's one of the things I want my town to have even though I won't personally be pushing a newborn around again until I have grandchildren.

I agree with helluva and giles. Buggies can be too big etc. this time I've chosen the smallest one I could and would use a sling if I needed to get the bus.

But it isn't always entitled people lording it about with huge prams and not a care in the world.

Thanks tondelay, thought I might be missing something! The bee would be absolutely perfect if all you had to do was push one button and the whole thing collapsed. Love it for stores and lifts etc.

In my mums day she lived in a town near shops I think she walked, drove or got the bus. She had a silver cross when I was a baby but when we were older it was one of those stripey 70s buggies! She also used a sling. She did live 10 minutes walk away up hills from shops, tesco and grocer and had milk delivered. Nothing else.

I do see a few supersize buggies where I work (Wimbledon) and sometimes the twin ones are used aggressively if you're on pavement with them... Generally everyone's polite. I see them on buses and trains more than tubes and generally everyone moves down, even helps mum etc.

Can't link but did see brief article about a disabled female peer travelling by bus the other week and a dad with buggy/pram
refused to get off in London. Now that is being very unreasonable!

If I were to have kids tho I'd like to think I'd think where I lived, buggy size etc as expat etc say. It's common sense and having consideration for others.

Perhaps the answer is to have folding seats for the whole of the bus - fixed seats for the top deck of double deckers.

Then passengers could make their own seating arrangements according to those travelling at the time.

I just tried it. Not in bus conditions.
Bee - forward facing and handle in lowest position. Unclip each side. Give it a one handed tug and it collapses. Not particularly deftly or quietly and probably not how you'd want to fold all the time but ok.

Take baby out first.

Well no. or her people could also make life a bit easier. sometimes moving back or even just across a seat would help. I would always jam my buggy in the smallest space possible to ensure other people could fit one in if need be. I got off a stop early or collapsed mine to make room for a double buggy or elderly person. or helped toddlers onto seats or carried shopping fir people. I try to avoid holding the baby as I am scared holding new born but if course I will do if need be. I have also made my kids scooch up on their seat so there's space for the little kid to sit down while mum deals with the baby.

I do try and be considerate to other parents and I have had people help me which of course is nice.

but I do think parents should plan for worst case senario and where possible make decisions that allow them to be able to do it all on their own cos some people really r miserable and unhelpful