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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder is she is really oblivious or just downright cruel?

63 replies

ApignamedJasper · 27/04/2015 09:52

I have a friend whose husband left her for another woman around November last year - he immediately moved in with said OW and introduced her to their 2 young daughters (4&2).

When he has contact with his girls he wants to spend time with them and new gf so she is usually around when he sees them.

2 yr old is a bit young to understand but recently 4 yr old has been asking a lot of questions recently about 'when is daddy coming home', 'why doesn't daddy live here anymore' etc. Preseumably she has been asking these question when at her dad's too because she's recently been coming home from the contact time in tears, very distressed because OW has been telling 4yr old that 'daddy doesn't love mummy anymore, daddy loves me' and 'daddy doesn't live there anymore because he love me now and not mummy' and so on.

Aibu to wonder if she is just being deliberately cruel and nasty just to stick the boot in a it more or she is just woefully ignorant of how much saying stuff like that hurts a 4yr old child and her mother? Said OW is 17, it wouldn't be relevant except for the fact I think her possible ignorance may be due to her age, although I don't personally think its an excuse for behaving so appaullingly but maybe Aibu!

DF is obviously very unhappy at this woman spending any time at all with her daughters, especially since she has made it clear that she 'hates kids' but when she raised this with ExH he didn't care and said what they do in his contact time is his business.

OP posts:
Original poster
ApignamedJasper · 27/04/2015 10:49

Dojo, as far as I know she has had a perfectly normal, happy upbringing - she still lives with her parents and grandmother (my DP used to be friends with her as they all worked at the same place). But she doesn't study, doesn't work, doesn't reslly do much of anything so I think you are right in that she probably does have some weird distorted sense of 'success' in stealing someone else's husband because she has nothing else going on in her life.

Trouble is with him talking to OW is that he is 'so in love' (his words) that he genuinely believes the sun shines out of her arse and she can do no wrong that I doubt he will believe df if she tells him what's been going on. And yes Dojo, I reslly do think he is just that selfish that as long as he is happy he doesn't much care what else is going on.

By the way, I agree with everything people have said about not allowing contact until this is sorted but I have a funny feeling she won't do it because she doesn't want to deprive the girls of seeing their dad and she feels that if she does anything to upset him it will kill the thin thread of hope she has that he will come back.

OP posts:
TheMagnificientFour · 27/04/2015 10:50

Unfortunately, this man isn't going to change (and nor is the OW gf).
The only thing your DF can do is to explain in age appropriate ways about the split.
She needs to talk to her 4yo to explain this is NOT her responsibility to bring them back together, nor is it her responsibility if they split.

One of the reason all that started is because the 4yo must have mentioned daddy coming back home and when is he living at home with us again. This child really needs to have it explained to her clearly that it will not happen.
I'm wondering if your DF is trsuggling to give such a clear message to her dc because at the end of the day, she could have him back, she still would, despite all his previosu behaviours.

Reginafalangie · 27/04/2015 10:52

www.nfm.org.uk/index.php/family-mediation/about-family-mediation

You DF can with hold if she feels her children are at risk of emotional abuse however I would not recommend this as things could get nasty. The mediation road would probably be better but the ex would have to agree to it. Your DF sounds like she is fighting a losing battle with the ex and even explaining the damaging effects of the new "childs" words/actions may not persuade him to speak to the OW about it.

Your poor friend and those poor children.

Original poster
ApignamedJasper · 27/04/2015 10:54

Ballet, I don't think he knows OW is saying these things, it's all said out of earshot.

OP posts:
balletnotlacrosse · 27/04/2015 10:59

Oh right. Then she needs to let him know what is happening. The fact that it's being said out of ear shot would indicate that the GF knows quite well that what she's saying is unacceptable.

The whole situation sounds bizarre though. What kind of parents does this teenager have, that they are facilitating this situation?

Charlotte3333 · 27/04/2015 11:06

I think if I was faced with a situation like this I'd tell the Ex he has two choices; solo visits short-term to ensure the children aren't exposed to the OW who clearly has little sense or consideration for the DC's, and if he refused, I'd take it further and ensure supervised visits. It's harsh but when it comes to very young children, their security and protection must come before everything.

Your friends ex is an utter prick. The OW is an imbecile child with no self-esteem and even less brains (crowing that she "stole" someone's husband. Congratulations, love, you're both clearly dicks, any relationship beginning that way is doomed to end that way, and I'd love to be there when it does) and your poor friend can't do anything to protect her children from the sheer lunacy of this situation.

Original poster
ApignamedJasper · 27/04/2015 11:08

I know! If I'd got home at 17 and said 'hey mum, you know that guy I work with who's wedding I went to 6 months ago? Well I've decided I fancy him and now he's left his wife and 2 daughters for me, is it ok if he moves in? It's ok, we're soooo in love', she would have given me a slap and a few harsh words! But then I never would have done that at 17 anyway.

I'm very surprised they let him move in, especially so soon and when he has his 2 young daughters over every weekend.

OP posts:
Original poster
ApignamedJasper · 27/04/2015 11:12

Yes Charlotte, he is indeed an utter prick.

I scarely have the words to describe just how despicable he is.

Mind you, his OW may be kidding herself that their relationship is as perfect and wonderful as she thinks, a few weeks ago he was messaging me asking if I fancied meeting up for sex before work. When I called him out on it he said it was only a joke and he was winding me up and he would never cheat on OW. Yeah right.

OP posts:
MammaTJ · 27/04/2015 11:17

What a mess, and what a car crash for the future.

These poor little ones having to deal with a messed up 17 year old!

She definitely has teen attitude going on!

I just think your DF can only tell her DD the truth! But do it in a nicer way 'Sometimes Mummies and Daddies don't love each other any more, then they have to not be together, but they ALWAYS love their children, forever and ever'. 'No, Daddy won't come back and live with Mummy, but he loves you so much, he sees you every weekend'

This will take the sting out of the 17 year olds tale.

balletnotlacrosse · 27/04/2015 11:18

He sounds like an absolute creep. I would seriously wonder if his dds would be better off without him in their lives.

roslyndee · 27/04/2015 11:18

Apig I guarantee in a few months or years the OW will find herself in the same position as your poor friend.

I won't pretend I don't feel sorry for her because I do, a bit - I know her behaviour is despicable and I really, really feel bad for your friend - but 17 is a child. She has no idea what she's doing. She is going to look back and kick herself.

And, I can't believe he messaged you!!!

ICanTotallyDance · 27/04/2015 11:23

Utterly bizarre behaviour from the ex-partner, the 17 year old 'OW' and her family.

I think Charlotte and Regina and ballet have given some good advice.

Mrsjayy · 27/04/2015 11:45

She sounds clumsy awkward and immature probably loves having an older boyfriend and thinks she is relating fine to the children your friend doesnt need to agree to the children being there with her ,the dad is a twat and needs to spend time with his dds. My 17yr old is at school today i cant imagine her having a boyfriend with 2 young children

Justusemyname · 27/04/2015 11:47

I would be tempted to refuse access. Why send toddlers to a place they are going to be upset to the point of tears? Sad

Mrsjayy · 27/04/2015 11:48

I suspect this girl will be pregnant soon and he will move on to the next 17yr old

CrapBag · 27/04/2015 11:54

Wow so he's been messaging you as well! Well at least little miss 'I stole, your husband' will get what's coming got her at some point.

The ex is a prick. Your friend needs to tell him what the 17 year old child has been saying to his daughter. Could she do it in front of the 4 year old so he cant say your friend is lying? Doing it when she is handing the children over, like "btw, our dd was in tears last week because of what your skank ow has been saying to her about you not coming back. It's not her place to say and I am not happy about her upsetting our daughter, you need to deal with it more tactfully"

Icimoi · 27/04/2015 11:58

So he lives with this girl and her parents and grandmother? That is one weird set-up.

I suspect the 17 year old is actually feeling insecure herself and she is proclaiming that the boyfriend loves her and not Mummy as much to convince herself as anything else. And she's quite right to feel insecure, it definitely won't last.

I think your friend has every right to say that access visits cannot happen at the girlfriend's parents' house and that the girlfriend can't see the children, or at least not on her own.

Mrsjayy · 27/04/2015 12:03

I think your friend is doing her children harm sending them i know its a recent seperationbut sending them into that enviroment is only harming the girls she needs to stand up to him

Reginafalangie · 27/04/2015 12:09

I think your friend is doing her children harm sending them

What Shock The DF is not harming the children at all it is their father who is putting them in a situation that is emotionally damaging.

Also given what DF has been through she may not have the strength to stand up to him. I think your blame of the mother is out of line MrsJ and any blame lies at the door of the feckless father.

balletnotlacrosse · 27/04/2015 12:14

I actually feel sorry for the 17 year old as well. She is in out of her depth, is being used by an older man who will probably dump her as soon as he gets bored, and instead of her parents trying to protect her and reason with her and put their foot down when necessary, they are just going along with the situation.
Apart from your friend, none of the adults in this scenario are coming out well.

LayMeDown · 27/04/2015 13:03

This is a very upsetting situation for her friend and the children. It is difficult to know how to manage it but her focu must be on reducing damage and upset for the children as much as possible. in her situation I would do three things
1 The words have been said now by the OW so they cannot be unsaid. The best thing to do is to minimise their effect by showing that she doesnt find them upsetting and presenting things slightly differently. 'Yes OW is right DD Mummy and Daddy didn't love each other anymore so we decided it would be better to live apart. Now you have two places you can stay. Daddy was lucky and met someone who he loves and this makes him happy. And I get to live with you and your sister so I am even luckier than Daddy. We both still love you very very much.
I know this will be hard for your DF, but pretending she is fine and delighted Daddy is happy and that she is happy living just with her kids will help put her daughters mind at rest.
2 I would pull ex aside and in a totally non accusatory manner just highlight to him that maybe OW should be a bit more careful about what she says.
'I know OW doesnt have much experience with kids, and I am sure she was only trying to help but she was a little insensitive in some of the answers she gave DD and DD was very upset after. I am sure we both agree that it is better that DD enjoys her time here and is not upset so maybe it would be better is she directs DD to you if she has any questions about the split or the family. Obviously you know DD better and will be better at handling it. We dont want any resentment developing in DD, or bad and traumatic memories'
3 Finally I would do as little as possible to encourage contact. If his head has been turned by the young carefree lifestyle I'd say he'd happily reduce or drop contact if it wasn't pushed. So I'd suggest maybe he doesnt need to see them every weekend if hes too much on or wants to go out. I wouldn't arrange times or dates, Id leave that totally up to him. So at pcik up I'd say well let me know when next suits you to have them. You can text me. I'd allow him to pull back if he was trying to.

AdoraBell · 27/04/2015 13:06

OP has your DF had any legal advice yet? If not I think she really needs to.

Is the EXH paying any maintainable for his DCs, and how exactly does he have money for a social life if he jacked his job in?

DF needs to protect herself and her DCs because this arsehole will never change even if he goes running back when he gets bored with the 17yr old GF. I sincerely hope DF will tell him where to go if he does.

And yes, the GF is quite likely using the whole "your daddy loves me now" as an ego boost and cannot imagine the impact it has the DCs, because she is still a child herself.

Mrsjayy · 27/04/2015 13:08

Of course its the dads fault but the mum needs to find the strength to stand up for her 4yr old the little girl is confused and crying it just sounds horrible for the children

Uhplistrailer · 27/04/2015 13:16

I don't actually see much wrong with what she said Confused

It's true. And you don't know how it was said to the 4 year old, perhaps nastily, or perhaps she sat her down and explained to her when she was upset and asking about it.

I also think you should probably not be plastering your friends business all over the Internet. This sounds like a very complicated situation that needs to be resolved by them, possibly with the help of a mediation service.

DonVitoCorleone · 27/04/2015 13:17

There's some fucking horrible people in this world Angry

My blood is boiling on behalf of your friend!