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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Mother-Daughter Relationships

45 replies

tiggerkid · 20/04/2015 10:55

Hi everyone,

I am not sure if this is the right place for this post but I didn't know where else to post it, so thought would try here.

The post isn't about me being a parent but more about me being an adult daughter, who doesn't get on with her mother and doesn't know what to do about it.

For as long as I remember myself being in the company of my mother has never been an easy thing. My mother is a very overbearing, extremely bossy and critical individual, who is never happy with anything you or anyone else around her does. She has always been criticising me, my sister and my dad for literally everything we do. If you are in my mother's house, you can't put your foot right. Nobody can. There isn't a person in the world that she is happy with.

She has always been like that and she is one of those people, who even manage to criticise random people in the shops, TV personalities, people they meey for the first time etc.

When I eventually moved out of her house, I think it was the best thing that ever happened to me because I could finally be my own person.

So here is my dilemma: 2 years ago, my dad passed away and my mother immediately stated her intention to move in with me and my family. You can imagine how I feel about this but because I am the oldest of only 2 children and my sister doesn't get on with her at all, there kind of always has been this expectation that she will eventually live with me and I will look after her. However, this "eventually", to me, meant when she is old and helpless and basically in need of looking after rather than when she feels like it.

Before anyone judges me for being a horrible daughter, I would like to make it clear that at present my mother doesn't require any care. She is 67 years old but is of sound mind and is, thankfully, in good health. The issue we have is that she has no friends at all, so she is desperately lonely and isolated.

Just before Christmas 2013, I invited her to stay over for few weeks and those few weeks were a total nightmare for me, which reminded me exactly why I don't want to share the same house with her again. In the first few days, my mother practically took over my entire house. She gave me no privacy with DH up until the moment we went to bed. She'd literally hang out with us from the moment we wake up until the moment we go to bed. As soon as my DH would step through the door after work, she would literally sit with us until it's time to sleep again.

Every time we wanted to go shopping or anywhere else, she would absolutely expect to come with us. I never said anything although I did try to drop a hint once by setting up TV in her bedroom in hope that she would get the message and at least for a couple of hours per day give us some space. Nothing of the kind happened. She ignored the TV in her bedroom and continued to hang out with us.

Eventually, we had a massive argument (I don't want to go into details here to keep this saga shorter!) and she called me a horrible daughter, packed her bags and demanded that we take her home.

Things have been pretty strained ever since but, nonetheless, I continued to call her on a regular basis. At one point, I told her though that this living under the same roof idea isn't going to happen and the best option for us is to sell her house and buy one near me, so we could see her regularly without living together. She wasn't happy with that! In fact, she was absolutely mad. She told me I betrayed her by setting the expectation she'd live with me in her old age and now trying to put her in a separate house in a place she isn't familiar with! We didn't talk for a while after that because I stood my ground but, in August 14, I sent her a birthday present. Naturally, she wasn't happy with it and told me it would probably be easier for everyone if I just gave her some money. Christmas 14, I didn't bother buying anything and sent her some money instead. Guess what? She managed to start an argument with me even then. She said I should've consulted her before I transferred the money, so she could schedule her time to go to the bank! I couldn't listen to her nonsense, so the argument ended in tears for me again, and I've not called her since.

I did, however, write her an email shortly after where I tried to tell her how she makes me feel. She immediately replied and her reply was that I was a horrible and obnoxious daughter, who is disrespectful and rude. In that email, she told me that she isn't going to forget the way I treated her, the fact that I refuse to live in the same house with her and my betrayal until her dying day.

I've not called her or wrote to her ever since. In January this year, she went to visit my sister. Despite not getting on with her, my sister invited her to stay over for few weeks to make sure she wasn't lonely. The relative peace only lasted for about a week before they also had a massive argument. The argument started, once again, because of my mother's constant complaints about me, our relatives and just about everything else in the world. My sister can't stand that and she is a lot more outspoken than me, so she told my mother everything she thinks about her.

My mother is a bit more scared of my sister's temper, so she bit her lip and stayed there until almost end of February. However they continued to argue. Whenever my sister would offer to take her somewhere for dinner, my mother would start whining that she doesn't like going out all the time. Once my sister wanted to take her out for some facials etc, my mother said no. When my sister would cook, my mother would say she isn't hungry only to ask for food half an hour later, when everyone else has eaten and my sister tidied the kitchen. Whatever my sister would suggest to her to occupy her free time, my mother would say no. My sister lives in the US, so I would like to make it clear that there is a lot my mother hasn't seen there, so in my mind it's not reasonable to behave this way when it was also the first time she visited my sister in the US since she got married there.

Eventually, they also had a massive falling out and my mother parted with my sister on bad terms telling her we are both ungrateful and she'll always remember how I betrayed her and how my sister is so nasty to her.

I would like to mention here that my sister paid for my mother's entire visit to the US (flights, food, shopping, all entertainment etc). My mother never had to spend a penny there. It was the same when she stayed with me. Neither of us received a word of gratitude. Only vile criticism and nastiness.

Before I end my story, I would like to say that my mother quite often makes references to her challenging relationship with my dad (they were quite different: my dad liked people and liked hanging out with them, doing things for others etc and my mother just liked doing her own thing, so they didn't really get on) and she often says how we owe her loving care to make up for all the years of misery that she had to endure while living with my dad. What she does, however, forget and doesn't want to mention is what it was like for me and my sister to live with 2 parents, who were always at each other's throats. My mother also beat us both, especially me, until I was pretty much a teenager. When she beat me, she was merciless, but I remember hating her nagging a lot more than the beating. I often prayed that she would beat me rather than say all those vile nasty things she was so fond of saying to everyone.

My mother doesn't seem to remember any of this. She kind of erased it from her memory as if it never happened. So, during her argument with my mother, my sister told her that tender loving relationships are usually a 2-way street and if you want to have those, you need to learn to give love to others. She also told her that love is something that people earn and have to work at and you can't force it. My mother said that if we were reasonable adults, instead of childish, petulant, selfish daughters, who never grew up, we would understand her.

Well, let me tell you, maybe I am a nasty daughter but I really don't understand her. At this point, I am not really sure I want to understand her either. I am literally at the end of my tether. I've not called her for almost 4 months now because I am just not ready for another battle with her. Whenever I call her, as soon as she hears my voice, she stays silent for about 5 minutes before eventually saying, "So, you finally call? What do you expect to hear? Are you just calling to see if I am still alive. Well, I still am. What else would you like to know?".

I am sure everyone can imagine how much I feel like talking to her after that opening statement but I usually made an effort every single time. It's just these last few months I've been completely feeling drained of all energy even at the thought of talking to her. I am really not ready to face her again. However I feel so guilty about not calling her when she is on her own that I can't sleep and not a day goes by when I don't feel like I am a terrible daughter and that she is right.

However the fundamental issue is that she wants to move in with me and unless I agree, there will be no reasonable conversation about anything. And I can't agree to that because she will ruin my life, which I can't allow her to do. She holds me responsible for her happiness but trust me if you knew my mother, you would know that nobody in the world can make her happy.

I am sorry for the long post. I don't even know what I am hoping to hear or what my question is. All my friends tell me that I would be mad to allow my mother to move in with me. Maybe I am here to clear my conscience or maybe just to be heard... I don't know. I feel so truly lost but I really don't feel like calling her or writing to her. The only two things I feel are 1) my desire not to interact with her ever again and 2) feeling guilty for feeling no desire to interact with the woman who gave birth to me.

What would you do?

OP posts:
Seriouslyffs · 20/04/2015 11:04

You don't have to have her live with you you'd be mad to!
Can you have some counselling to find out how you can mange the relationship without it impinging on you so much? It may be that you can't and you'd be better off going NC or seeing her on a very 'controlled by you' basis. What does DH feel? Do you have DCs and what is their relationship with her like?

MarthasHarbour · 20/04/2015 11:05

I can assure you that not one mumsnetter is going to judge you or call you an ungrateful daughter. IMO you are a saint Flowers

I didnt want to read and run but just wanted to bob on here to give you a 'un-MN hug'. I really think you should get this thread moved to Relationships, and also have a read of (and maybe join) the Stately Homes thread, you will get a ton of support from people in similar situations.

From my unqualified perspective your mother is manipulative and controlling, she is emotionally and physically abusive. She struggles with any relationship and is driving everyone away. If this was me i would be considering NC (no contact) AT ALL. I would be cutting her out of my life for good.

Good luck and i am certain you will get lots of support on here.

Flowers Flowers

Lottapianos · 20/04/2015 11:05

You are not a horrible daughter. There are loads of us on here who have similar mothers and we usually hang out on the Relationships board, specifically the 'Stately Homes' thread.

It is absolutely not reasonable for your mother to hold your responsible for her happiness. My mother is the same. Its like they think that because they are our mothers, they have an automatic right to be treated like the queen forever more. Well no, it doesn't work that way. You are both adults, you are two separate people and you owe her nothing. She sounds like extremely hard work and there's no reason why you should have to put up with her crap. None.

And I can't agree to that because she will ruin my life, which I can't allow her to do'

Hold onto this. If its a choice between you and your mother, always choose yourself. It sounds like you have a very strong self-preservation instinct and that you have a good understanding of what she is doing. Guilt is a horrible thing but is perfectly normal - we all crave a close loving relationship with our mothers and it hurts terribly when its just not there, but we're usually brought up to be the 'fixers' and put everyone else's needs before our own. You may have heard of FOG - fear, obligation, guilt. Three legacies of having a toxic parent. They can certainly be overcome but it takes time. Trust your gut feelings. Put yourself first.

Mummyofonesofar · 20/04/2015 11:06

You say she wants to move in with you - but she hasn't asked since your big rows and she does seem to understand that she is not wanted in the house - therefore it seems there is no decision to make. I would cease contact to be honest, she sounds awful. If she can be that nasty at 67 and healthy, just imagine what it will be like when the ageing process starts and she is in pain and hates the world even more....

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 20/04/2015 11:08

I see so many parallels in your post with my relationship with my mum, OP. Will go back through and read it more slowly and reply later. Thanks

drudgetrudy · 20/04/2015 11:14

If she is a healthy 67 year old she is responsible for her own life and friendships. You are not horrible.

Her behaviour is alienating you and your sister and is likely to reduce the amount of help she gets when she does need it.
Be firm and say that you don't feel that it is a good idea for her to live with you at this stage (it would not work for you).
If she falls out with you play it cool.
She has more to loose than you do and if she has any sense she will be back with a better attitude.
You have nothing to feel guilty about at all.

openthecurtains · 20/04/2015 11:19

You're not unreasonable at all. There is absolutely no way you should live with your mother, it would be hugely destructive to your relationship and your mental health.

Feeling guilty about this is normal but you have nothing to be guilty about, this is not your fault.

I would consider removing her from your life. What would the consequences of that be?

I haven't seen my mother in 20 years. Best decision I ever made and I have no regrets on it. She was violent, controlling, manipulative and abusive. My children have never met her and I am confident it is best for them not to have met her; I know what she did to me and I would never risk her doing anything to my children.

Penfold007 · 20/04/2015 11:22

tiggerkid you have been the victim of DV & EA and have survived, you really don't have to put up with any more of her dreadful behaviour. I doubt your DH would agree to her moving in to your home.

Mummyofone mentioned the ageing process; your post could have been about me and my DSis and our mother. My mum is ten years older than yours and the narc nast behaviour is escalating everyday. DSis and I are seriously considering our options for our own sanity. Dealing with the FOG is a major issue.

GiddyOnZackHunt · 20/04/2015 11:35

Giving birth to someone doesn't mean they owe you for that.
Raising a child is something you do because you choose to and if you make a good job of it then you get back what you put in.
Your mother sounds bloody awful and I'm pleasantly surprised you and your sister sound so normal. You probably need some help to understand why this isn't your fault and how to stop feeling guilty because you shouldn't. If she's driven everyone else away then why should you be the only one to stay?

MrsMook · 20/04/2015 11:40

Sounds like a great time to go non contact as you're halfway there.

I found when my mother was blackmailing me over what she would do if I did X, that the line "that is your choice" was very useful. It empowered me to make my own choice, and put the responsibility for the reaction back on to her, not me taking the blame.

Bullies have no right to control you or make you miserable. This one has no right to invade your life. Many people with healthy, happy relationships would find living together difficult. There is no obligation or expectation for her to to ever live with you. The state offers her protection in the event of failing health, so you have no guilt to fear.

She has created a miserable life driving friends and family away. It's time for her to reap what she has sown.

ladyrosy · 20/04/2015 11:42

You are not a horrible person. You are not a horrible person.

You have spent years bending over backwards for someone who hasn't and will never be happy with your actions, or the actions of anyone else.

It is not you.

I second (third, fourth possibly - I see others have recommended it too) the Stately Homes thread.

Lottapianos mentioned FOG - fear, obligation, guilt. Again, I second you do some research into these. outofthefog.net/ is a pretty interesting website.

I think your mum has a personality disorder (ouch, harsh, I know, that's your mum I am talking about, but her actions are not those of a happy, adjusted person. Sorry.) and the out of the fog website lists a lot of personality disorders. Take a look through them and see if any ring loud bells with you.

Good luck with your future. You have no obligation to house your mother or even have contact with her. Your life is your own to do with as you want, without fear, obligation or guilt channelling you into uncomfortable actions.

You are not a bad daughter.

Gruntfuttock · 20/04/2015 11:48

OP, you only have one life. Please don't let this woman ruin any more of it. I really think that you would benefit hugely from going NC (no contact). Thank goodness previous posters are so much more eloquent than I am, but I just wanted to say that to you.

CandyLane · 20/04/2015 11:52

If you go on to the 'relationships' board there's a support thread for people who have difficult relationships with their parents - called something like 'but we took you to stately homes'.
You might find it useful over there, there's some really great support x

GoblinLittleOwl · 20/04/2015 12:02

You cannot have your mother to live with you; if you did she would wreck your health, your marriage and your life.
Of course you will feel guilty because she has programmed you to feel so; this is not the behaviour of a caring parent, rather one with mental issues. Nothing you or your sister can do will resolve this.
You are obviously concerned for her and I think you are doing the right thing by maintaining contact; you know now what to expect, so simply make a duty call regularly, to reassure yourself, not her.
I am older than your mother, and I would not expect to live with my children; there is so much out there for people to do; that she is lonely is entirely her own fault and NOT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

drudgetrudy · 20/04/2015 12:17

I agree with Goblin.
I am near to your Mum's age and would never impose myself on my kids like this.
I enjoy seeing them but they have their lives to live and I have other things to do.
If I were on my own I might ask their advice from time to time but I would take care not to impose. With personalities like your Mum's you need to have strong boundaries.
The only excuse I can think of for her is that she is afraid of being abandoned.
That being said you need to show her that her current behaviour is driving you away.
Treat her like a child-respond to appropriate behaviour and go cold on her if she tries to manipulate.
Try validating her feelings but not making any attempt to solve her problems.
A good technique is Support, Empathy, Truth

eg I understand that you feel lonely and I want to support you, however it would not work for you to live here. Are there any activities you would like to do-I could go with you the first time.
If she throws a tantrum -ignore-do not be blinded by FOG-you are not responsible for her.

TrueBlueYorkshire · 20/04/2015 12:17

Your mother is entirely responsible for her own feelings. If she wants to feel happy or bitter that is entirely up to her.

Don't be sucked in by her bitterness to the world.

pictish · 20/04/2015 12:26

Gosh such a lot to take in. You poor woman. Suffice to say you must not allow your mother to move in. She sounds absolutely awful. None of this is your fault whatsoever, your mum is a damaged and damaging person and no one expects you to sacrifice your own life and happiness to accommodate such an intolerable presence.

pictish · 20/04/2015 12:28

P.s Your sister sounds a good sort with her head screwed on. Support one another in not being bullied by your tyrannical mum.

Stubbed · 20/04/2015 12:36

My Mum (when she was alive...) was pleasant, helpful, caring, fun, etc and I still did not want her to live with us. It is not unusual to feel like this and if she is difficult to be around, then it's even more understandable.

HubertCumberdale · 20/04/2015 12:39

I would leave the silence for as long as it lasts. Enjoy it. When she finally does get in touch about moving in, just be clear and honest. You will not be living with me, because you don't deserve to, and I don't want you to. Your behaviour to my sister and I over the years has been adhorrant, so I'm sorry but your actions have resulted in my not wanting you living in my house. Deal with it.

Pyjamaschocolateandwine · 20/04/2015 12:43

You are a bloody saint op.

My sincere advice is to cut contact with this vile bully.

I was going to advice continued contact but never living with her, however after reading that she physically abused you then no.

Totally unforgivable.

Op she's a toxic bitch and you need to get her go out of your life so you can be happy.

ThingummyJigg · 20/04/2015 13:00

I could have written a lot of your OP, tiggerkid.

You sound like a kind, caring, incredibly patient, understanding, open minded, thoughtful, smart daughter and your mother does not deserve you. You have nothing to feel guilty about - you're not dumping your mother because she is too nice to you, you are currently not in contact with her because of her verbal and emotional (and in childhood, physical) abuse.

You have NOTHING to feel guilty about. You didn't ask to be her dd, she chose to have children. You owe her nothing because she has given you so little.

Listen to your friends and clear your conscience, you have done NOTHING wrong. You have made a stand and you should be proud of that.

What would I do? The exact same as you - no contact. In fact I did just that and I don't feel guilty about it at all because despite an upbringing to the contrary, I stood up for myself and put me first. And my life has improved in many ways since.

I think you're very brave.

Clutterbugsmum · 20/04/2015 13:09

I would uproot my family and move to the USA with your sister and leave you mum to stew in her own juices.

Just because she your mum doesn't mean she gets to treat you so appallingly.

guinnessgirl · 20/04/2015 13:09

OP, I cannot speak from personal experience like some PPs, but it seems clear to me that your mother is an emotionally damaged, abusive, manipulative narcissist. I am Shock at some of the things she has said to you - being your mother does not entitle her to anything.

If I were you, I'd be seriously thinking about going NC, as her being in your life does not seem to be doing you or her any good at all. Hugs and Thanks

olympicsrock · 20/04/2015 13:12

What a horrible person she is. It sounds as if she does not add anything positive to your life in fact just the opposite. Why would you let her anyway near your family? Her behaviour when you phone is vile - no wonder you dread calling.
I would be writing her a letter saying that you do not intend to have contact with her while she treats you this way. If she is prepared to change you will be prepared to listen but only if she is prepared to change and drops this ridiculous idea that she is entitled to live with you. Not in a million years OP.