Why are there so few posts on the feminism board? (Part 2)

[Jackieharris]

Since the last one filled up I though I'd start a new one as the conversation seemed to be mid flow.

I think most of us do, lying?

But some people hide the board, and it seems a bit rude to launch into constant feminist threads elsewhere when those posters probably have their reasons.

There have been threads that involved Feminism in Chat etc. I just hide them. I did get embroiled in one a few weeks ago and was just left a bit and .

What Ginger said. I read some of the topics and it's often things I can't be arsed to get worked up about. I'm nobodies fool but I'm quite happy to be a)married b) be a Mrs and c) change my name to me husbands.

Apparently I should be burnt at the stake for all 3, and shouldn't call myself a woman.

I can't argue with that mindset and don't want to really!

things I can't be arsed to get worked up about That's how I feel tillie. I get the impression that that is vv wrong and I must be absolutely up in arms about whatever it is. 'Meh' is not an option for FWR is how it feels.

But Tillie I lurk on the feminist boards a lot and some of the most prolific posters have done all three of those things.

Maybe some people hold those views but seemsa bit extreme to tar everyone with the same brush.

I've been on mumsnet 11 years now and in that time the feminism boards were started and have evolved. I find them quite interesting and welcoming now.

But like many long time posters I'm still quite guarded. The reason is that at one time any comments not deemed feminist enough were greeted with 'what about the Menz' and. 'Ooooh not my Nigel' responses. Humiliating a poster is a good way of stopping any challenge to the agreed orthodoxy.
I remember some suggestions that posters should have read certain books before they contributed. which makes you wonder who exactly is this strand of feminism for?

But I've gone back occasionally and found the debates on gender identity really interesting (although fir me feminism is more about equality than some sort of hierarchy of privilege)
I enjoy the writing of some posters (Buffy, Jeanne) abd I hope they continue.

Jeanne... I expect they do, possibly on boards that I don't post on, but it's on from the FWR board that there seems to be a motivation to 'get out there and bring them in!'.

It's happening often and I don't, for example, see 'doghouse' posters posting to drum up business. I do see them posting on a thread to suggest that a poster re-posts for advice on a specific thing in 'relationships' or 'education' or 'step-parents' but not actively soliciting.

Feminism touches everything in a woman's life, completely omnipresent, so why, why, WHY does it need to be restricted to a board on MN when women across the board(s) are talking about it all day long pretty much? Does it not count unless you're actually using the 'F' word?

Oh, I follow you.

But no, not sure I agree - I've seen people post in Chat about wanting a dog, and people will regularly post links to the Doghouse. And, although I don't have a dog and don't really care, I have seen enough threads to notice that if you post something like 'I'm thinking of buying a cockerpoo from this nice lady who breeds them as a hobby, she's asking for 20 quid, what do you think?' you will probably get people who have a certain outlook posting in response!

But then, I think the same people would argue that this isn't just about an individual thread, but about animals' lives and what's right and fair for them. To me, as a not very pet-oriented person, the level of emotion can seem hard to relate to, but I'm glad there are people out there taking the time to explain it all.

I guess feminism is similar? It doesn't need to be hived off into a separate section for its own sake, but you can tell when people who are regulars in that section know that they're making a familiar argument when they come out of it and post in Chat/AIBU/whereever.

(And thank you, ubik.)

There's the difference, people will posting in Chat about wanting a dog and somebody will post a link to 'The Doghouse' and/or give a view from a perspective of being an animal-lover, which many people are whether they post in the doghouse or not.

I've never seen posters from other boards come onto AIBU or Chat and post a deliberately provocative thread to generate discussion as to 'why people don't post on FWR?'.

I know of a few people who post there - and here and elsewhere - and they've nice to post alongside, whether I agree with their posts or not. It sounds a bit rude but I mean it genuinely - they're not 'one-trick-ponies'. I want to post about myriad things and feminism as a subject isn't one of them, albeit that it's tentacles will colour my responses because I'm very much in favour of women's rights.

I explain very badly, I know that, so apologies, but hopefully you can sift through that and understand what I mean!

"My experience is that people who complain about FWR have usually given it a go, been deleted, and feel bitter about it."

Of course that's what it is.

many of us have said how the FWR makes us feel, how the aggressiveness and belittling and what I can only describe as shouting down from what seems to be a group think makes us feel. FWR posters keep telling us that our feelings and reactions we have described are wrong - that it's not like that. You don't have to agree with what we say but don't tell us we are wrong about how we feel about it and how we find it and the impression the board and some off hen ostensibly leave on us.

Oh, I see. Yes, that's true.

I was under the impression it was quite busy?

I go through phases of interacting with the Feminism Board.

Sometimes there'll be a thread that really touches something in my life and I'll contribute to it, and I'll feel like saying 'Yes, sisters! Thank God we can talk about this here' and I feel great and really empowered and connected.

Sometimes I just read threads and dont comment, as I feel out of my depth among the very academic and/or serious activist feminists, although I am still interested and want to learn more about issues raised. The threads on intersectionality and feminism are like this for me. I find them fascinating but dont know what I have to add, really.

But sometimes it becomes really far too nit picky, snipey and focused on semantics and definitions and feminist in-fights that can seem obscure and off putting if youre not deep into the activism side of things. I suppose for the average woman who identifies as a feminist but isnt an activist or academic, the really nitty gritty debates about transgender people (for example) can feel really laboured and not relevant to my life.

I hope that doesnt offend anyone. Thats an honest response to why I dont always contribute.

I think in general, though, a LOT of women still dont identify as feminist and so think the boards are just a load of mad lesbian woman-haters droning on. Ridiculous but...we live in a patriarchy and lots of women still believe that feminism is a dirty word!

*man haters!

Tillie, i'm a married mrs DHname and former sahm. I post on fwr and have never had anyone judge me personally for those things.

I understand the annoyance with the expectation of certain things being done by women in general but it has never come across to me as personal.

Feminism has never come across to me as being against individual choices, and i dont recognise the idea that it is, put across by many on this thread (and thread 1). All is says to me, is to recognise that my choices are not made in a vacuum, which I do.

I read some of the threads if they appear in 'Active' and imo they seem to be there regularly so it must be a fairly active board.

I must say though, that the impression I am left with is that some regulars won't be happy until men are reduced to nothing more than pets and anyone who doesn't hold that view has been brainwashed by the patriarchy. And that is not something I want to engage with.

Yes I know NAFALT but it seems OK to tar all men with the same brush because some are arseholes, but it's not OK to tar all feminists in the same way.

I'm not a MRA or rape apologist before anyone starts.

Apparently I should be burnt at the stake for all 3, and shouldn't call myself a woman

No one has ever said that on here, have they? Be honest!

I think one of key difficulties was that when 'men' were spoken of critically many women will think ' well my DP/son isn't like that, he wouldn't do that' and feel offended on their behalf.

Because we are partners and daughters and mothers of men. Men are important when it comes to feminism. I think men can be feminists.

I know burning women at the stake isn't remotely funny, but ... well, it is funny. Aren't feminists the last people who'd go in for the Joan of Arc treatment for their detractors?

Ubik - I think that's very true.

I have a son and I get really angry when all men are described as potential rapists. Surely by that logic all women are potential murderers because some women have murdered!

Avocado toast pretty much summed up my views. I lurk and occasionally post, but I tend to go elsewhere for feminist discussion.

Well, all women are potential murderers aren't they?

That's the point of it - it's saying that rapists aren't some kind of monsters you can easily recognise - they look just like the nice guys mostly.

I do get the desire to say 'no, not my man' though. I do it myself.

Doesn't the "all men are potential rapists" thing mean that women are unable to tell by looking whether a man is a rapist or not, and therefore doesn't know whether she's aafe or not in a given situation? And also that rapists are usually ordinary men who we know, not hiding in bushes with masks on?
I have a son too, fwiw, and i don't find that offensive

Well no, the point I m trying to make is that the FWR threads that I read give the impression that all men should be feared and we must assume (to protect ourselves) that they are rapists, but women are fine to be with. And that if you don't hold that view you are a rape apologist, MRA or brainwashed.

YY, cow, and it's a message men need to hear too. There are a lot of stereotypes about male rape that depend on the idea that a rapist is a certain kind of person, and recognisable.