Why do some nice intelligent women end up with crappy men?

[Thecowandcat]

I've been reading a few threads on here today that got me thinking, why do some women end up with such awful men?

I'm not talking about the horribly physically and emotionally abusive ones, where women get trapped and are intimidated and afraid so they end up staying.

I'm talking about the more everyday kind of awful man.

For example, a friend of mine is an amazing women. She has a great career, a great personality, is good looking, is funny, is wise and kind. She is one of the best people I know.

And yet . . .

She is married to this utter doilum. He makes creepy flirtatious comments to other women and clearly thinks the sun shines out of his arse. I avoid him when possible.

In fairness she seems fairly happy and it's possible that she doesn't know about the comments. He's pretty clever and the comments are sometimes open to interpretation, a lot of the creepiness is in the tone and they are never made in front of her, so maybe she is clueless about that side of him.

I just cannot understand how such an amazing women ended up with a man who is so far beneath her.

Anyone else observed this?

Because society still doesn't properly respect single, successful women and accept that they are good enough alone. Society too often revolves around coupledom and seems to revere it instead. It's based on insecurity and loneliness and the thought that the clock is ticking.

Women are conditioned to compromise.

Perhaps because nice people tend to give others the benefit of the doubt and assume that because they treat people how they'd like to be treated that everyone else does the same. They then get taken for a ride by the not so nice.

I'm one of those women, intelligent, well educated, a nice, kind person (I hope) - but have ended up with controlling abusive men who treat me like shit. I have talked it through with counsellors and psycholgists and as many people have said it is to do with very low self esteem a remnant from a very difficult childhood, Basically I never believed I was worth anything and considered myself unattractive unloveable and that I should be grateful for anyone taking any kind of interest in me.

Its taken me almost two years away from a long and dreadful relationship to start realising I am worthwhile and I deserve a lot better. I'm not sure I trust myself not to fall back into such a relationship, and would have a very hard job trusting anyone after the way my XH behaved, so I have decided to steer clear of relationships, and to go it alone. So far it has been a happy choice for me - not easy all the time, but definitely better than the alternative I fear falling into.

I think some women who have had a difficult or abusive background give off a vulnerable vibe, and manipulative men home in on it. I think that is the case for me anyway. Overtly charming but with a vicious manipulative undercurrent seems to be my type sadly. So now I just trust me.

low self esteem.

Low self esteem. A lot of people seem confidence but they really are not. Lack of mental strength too, a lot of women simply do not think they are worth it.

It's hard to get self esteem too, I think if you don't learn it in childhood you never will.

I agree it's not just about self esteem.

Sometimes, you see someone and think you would never accept X behaviour but someone else think it's OK for example. Let's say I really don't agree with binge drinking and coming back home completely drunk but some one else can see that as 'having fun' and accept that her DH does that.

Sometimes, women are too ready to 'make an effort' or compromise for their own good.

Sometimes, they are trying the 'help them as they've had so many problems before'.

Sometimes, they have no idea of what a good relationship is or are leaving in the 1950s still aka their idea of a 'good' relatinhsip is completely different than mine. Let's say one will think it's normal if she does all the HW 'as he works so hard' whilst I would think that its much more normal to spilt the chores 50/50. Or they think it's normal if their DH takes all the decisions etc...

A bit like when you talk about attractiveness. For some of us, being bold could be quite attractive, for others it is the worst thing in the world on a man.

Must that is exactely me! And yes it is a very hard fall whe you realise that your partner isn't putting your own interests at the same level than his (as you would with him)

Low self-esteem and lousy relationship models in childhood - I guess these pretty much always go together because a couple who have a poor relationship are likely to produce children with poor self-esteem. I remember bumping into someone I'd met when I was holiday with one particularly poisonous boyfriend, who said (after I told him we'd split up) "Good, we all wondered what such a nice woman was doing with such a dick".

Because society still doesn't properly respect single, successful women and accept that they are good enough alone. Society too often revolves around coupledom and seems to revere it instead. It's based on insecurity and loneliness and the thought that the clock is ticking.
Women are conditioned to compromise.

beaufort I completely agree with this. It still isn't seen as "normal" for a woman to go through life not actively seeking a relationship. We're either coupled up or between relationships.

Another one here who's got the t-shirt. Academic intelligence, supposedly attractive although I never saw it, I try to better myself, be kind, do the right thing etc.
I think it's partly based on low self esteem, and also the example you were set by your parents. My mum put up with shit for years from my dad, drinking, shagging around, jealously, etc. When HE eventually left HER, she went out with all sorts of dickheads, each one being 'the one' or 'better than your father'.
Between the two of them neither of them taught me self respect, I had no idea what a functional relationship looked like. I just thought that if you 'loved' somebody, 'really loved' them, despite all the fights and the mindfucks and the jealousy then you fought for it and carried on. Ridiculous.

Because they probably arent nice people themselves.
You never truly know anyone

Because society still doesn't properly respect single, successful women and accept that they are good enough alone. Society too often revolves around coupledom and seems to revere it instead. It's based on insecurity and loneliness and the thought that the clock is ticking.

Women are conditioned to compromise

Yep.

It's absolutely a vital life skill that of course no one teaches you; you learn from what you see at home. Think I read somewhere that the best thing a man can do for his children is to love his wife.
Low self esteem also leads to low expectations and feeling grateful for things which should be par for the course. This is learned behaviour.

It isn't just women. Some wonderful men end up with absolute horrors. My FIL was an absolute peach who had to endure my absolutely awful MIL. I know it ground him down, I think he only stayed with her out of a sense of responsibility & decency. It was definitely low self esteem in his case he did so much for others and had no idea how lovely and loved he was

It's based on insecurity and loneliness and the thought that the clock is ticking.

Most women do want a family though and unfortunately there really is a ticking clock.

I think Beaufortbelle has it. I had a conversation with a lesbian couple I know very well and we were catching up on various female friends in common (I live overseas so don't see them often). Of about 6 women we discussed, all are with useless partners. Think infidelity/gambling/refusal to help with babies/children/feckless with regard to employment/EA. All of these women are smart, funny, kind people. One of them is an MP, driven, successful, a champion of women etc. How the fuck did they end up with these men?

The answer seems to be 'babies'. Wanting to have the children and then keep the family together at considerable personal cost.

The couple being gay is only relevant in that these are all women in heterosexual relationships. It felt like a relevant detail. Maybe it isn't.

OP you could be describing someone I know. Really successful, utterly beautiful and seems very confident. She has the most revolting bloke, whom I actually used to fancy like mad when I had low standards.

He would flirt badly with other women (including me) and would threaten to beat up her male friends, and he is really attractive physically but intellectually seems to have lost out somehow.

I don't know why she likes him, unless it's just for sex, which I can sort of understand.
I have another friend who has a twit for a husband - she's possibly the nicest woman on the planet and really good with people, while he is a sarcastic arsehole who makes children cry.

Perhaps it takes someone really kind and patient to put up with someone like that? Or maybe there is more to him than meets the eye.

Lack of financial Independence is one reason why women struggle
to leave once they are stuck in a poor relationship. My mother said to me once that you should never leave yourself in a position where you have to rely on a man financially. This is the reason I would never go part time or become a SAHM.

A lot of men become the way they are over a period of years rather than months so it can be hard to spot. They are often seen as good dads despite being shit husbands and so the many women will just shit up and put up to keep their family together. It's a sacrifice for their children and it's what women are programmed to do.

Low self esteem is one, conforming to what is expected is another and fear of the unknown and of becoming lonely because when you are a mother, you can't simply get on. with your life if you split up and go out all of the time. Often you may get 2 nights a fortnight if you are lucky where you can go somewhere that doesn't involve running around after the kids.

It is easier for men to start again in general as they don't generally have the same parental duties that the woman has.

Shut up not shit up

My mother was a man hater, she used to tell me that Disney was to blame for women's unrealistic view of fairytail romance and Prince charming, that it was all rubbish and men like that don't exist in the real world. That if I was searching for a Prince I would never find one and be alone forever. If ever i had a fight with a partner or they had done something to hurt me She would tell me all men were selfish, inconsiderate, lazy, sexist, pigs. She said they are just raised that way and to accept it. She even told me I was wrong for expecting too much from men.
I was afraid of being alone forever, afraid of failing at another relationship. Afraid that I would never find anyone better. Also afraid of being labelled a "slag" as yet another failed relationship would mean the "magic number" would be increased in the next one. I did know deep down that there relationships were toxic and doomed, I would sit alone and cry over it, but would sit and convince myself that if I just tried harder or did better it would be fine! Never ever was.
Worst part of all... My mum was oh so very very wrong. There are truly kind and selfless men out there, who treat people with respect, are loyal and consideratr, work hard and love their family's. Waiting time on a man that simply doesn't love you only delays finding the man that does. My husband is my hero, never once has he made me cry and he holds my hand each and every time I need him to. It is a short life and the clock absolutely is ticking so don't ever waste a second of it on someone that doesn't deserve it.

The word "man-hater" is a bit of a misnomer because it usually entails a woman pointing out that good men are hard to come by.

The word "woman-hater"means something entirely different because it encompasses the worst type of torture, porn, murders, sexual abuse and a whole host of grim misogyny.

So there's that.

I think women are indeed conditioned to be with a man. My own mother pities me because my marriage has broken down and has accused me of being jealous of her because she has a partner.

I won't go into details about this partner of hers, but suffice it to say she is a professional woman earning a good wage who has sunk 10 years of her wages into his "business". She has never seen any returns on this business of his. He is a cocklodger who pays no rent. He doesn't let her buy clothes or food, so effectively prevents her from spending her own money. They live in a rubbish council house. She would have done so much more with her life without him.

And yet she pities me for being single

My mother ain't a man -hater, that's for sure. She's a man-lover. She puts men, any men, above the women in her life because she VALUES men more. She values male company and she believes any scraps a man brings to the table is worth any suffering they might put you through.

I have a well above average IQ and very poor emotional intelligence. I have been told I am attractive. I have Aspergers.

I struggle with low esteem and don't have the emotional intelligence to properly look out for my interests and tend to put others first.

Oh and nice people attract sods as we are naive, look for the good in people and put up too much shit ie the sods can get away with their shitty behaviour.

That's interesting Mummalo. Are you not able to make a logical, head over heart decision about someone who is being a dick? I have a very clear memory of doing that as a young student and weeping all the way home on the coach. The pain was terrible, and looking back I am amazed I had the sense to do it, although it was undoubtedly an excellent decision.

My daughter has also dumped someone she really cared about who was being an idiot. Maybe we are just a bit cold?