to not trust this 'helpful' stranger in the mountains?

[SummerOfLadybirds]

I've fallen out with a close friend and want to know who was BU.
We went camping in Lake District recently. We're experienced hikers so had all correct gear, provisions, torches, map, compass etc. We planned to stay in proper campsites as my friend hates wild camping. On 2nd day decided to leave marked routes as felt confident we could navigate. (The paths are too busy in good weather, we both wanted to hike in wilderness). At first it was fine, we went high up and didn't see anyone for hours. To cut a long story short we then lost the compass, got disorientated and got lost!! My friend started freaking out and worrying we'd have to camp in mountains if we couldn't find way down. I said that was fine, we had tent, food, clothes etc, we could set up camp and find way down in morning but she said she wanted a shower and a proper loo (and was scared of 'ghosts'!) I said its too dangerous to try and descend once its dark, she got in a massive strop.

Meanwhile for a couple of hours, despite seeing nobody all day, we'd both noticed a man in camouflage gear popping up in different places nearby. Once he was in front of us, once he was chilling by a rock, another time he was behind us. He didn't acknowledge us but he wasn't that close. We assumed he was just enjoying nature, going in same direction as us.

When the light began to fade, my friend got really scared and insisted we keep walking and suddenly we almost bumped into this man as we came around a boulder!! He said hi and asked where we were going, my friend started to blurt out we were lost, but I didn't want to seem vulnerable so I cut in and said 'we're not really lost' and made out she was joking. He was friendly but something didn't feel quite right and I felt we WERE vulnerable, 2 petite women and this guy (he was very tall and muscular, had a big army-style rucksack and just seemed a bit 'odd'). He offered to guide us down but I was worried he might lead us somewhere even more remote, so I told him thanks but we didn't need his help and was very assertive in not wanting to walk with him.
We carried on, I was freaked out now because of the man, and my friend was petrified of being on mountain in night and not speaking to me because i'd refused his help.
Anyway we did make it off the mountain (in the dark) and finally got to a campsite at 2am.

My friend is still furious that I wouldn't let this man help us. I still think he could have done anything to us, like leading us further off-route in the dark and raping us.

[MrsMook]

The culture of the hills is a trusting one. There are risks, so people help eachother. The group I've hiked with have helped others and recieved help too. The chances of a stranger doing you harm are considerably lower than walking off in the dark when you are already struggling.

I've spent the night in a shelter, and it was not fun. (We'd taken a parallel route to the one intended, in very poor weather and ran out of daylight to safely correct ourselves). It was still safer than walking on in the dark. (Oh how my heart sank when we got back to the campsite and found our tent destroyed, along with many others by the storm that hadn't been predicted.)

[26Point2Miles]

Which mountain was this op?

[GriefLeavesItsMark]

Whoawhoawh camouflage
things are never quite the way they seem
Whoawhoaw that was an awfully strange marine.

Does anyone else remember the song?

[comfortblanketty]

"we both wanted to hike in wilderness"

Um, why did you want to do this when it obviously scared you both shitless

[UnsolvedMystery]

You both sound pitiful and this story is pathetic.

You LOST your compass, but you claim to know why you are doing?
If this man wanted to do you harm, he had plenty of opportunity as you wandered round in circles.
Just stick to footpaths next time.

[SaggyAndLucy]

TBH Im finding it hard to work out how they could be lost in the first place! For a start they were in a part of the country with some of the most identifiable features in the UK! The mountains are all fairly unique, and you know, there's all those big lakes...
Then there's the little matter of them having an actual map! They were only on foot!

[BackOnPlanetEarth]

The OP is an experienced hiker and had clothing, a tent and food with her - it was a bit daft to loose the compass but it still sounds like she was better prepared than a lot of hikers.

[AgentProvocateur]

In the words of Still Game 'cupla fannies"

[HirplesWithHaggis]

She may have been better prepared than "a lot of hikers" but there's little point in "having all the gear" if you don't know what to do with it - and more importantly, what to do if you lose a vital component, eg, a compass.

[MillionToOneChances]

Men murder women all the fricken time.

Men murdering women happens way more often than women falling off mountains or being eaten by wild animals.

Woman who are up mountains in the middle of the night with no compass and no idea where they are are far more likely to fall than get murdered. Fact. And as a previous poster said, he hardly needed to get them further off the beaten track if he wanted to attack, did he?!

[StupidBloodyKindle]

Grief Stan Ridgway 1986

[StupidBloodyKindle]

I got to Lakeland Bogeyman and thought of a mad axe murderer in a shopping centre. Turns out I was thi king of Lakeside

This thread is excellent though. Turns out two posters kind of recognise him as Lonerboy/Poacherman.
The visual of going round in circles, ooh it's him again, he's following us
Plus it is serving as a useful public information/ warning broadcast. Well done OP.
Wonder where that London shortcut is...I sprinted from a station once, in the time before mobile phones, didn't know the exits/areas that well but it was the right thing to do as platform completely empty and no cctv. Single carriage, bloke trying to chat to me getting off at same time, all hilarity aside there are times when your spidey senses tingle for a good reason. My sister's boyfriend was late meeting me, I veered round the corner and pretty much fell into him having been running like the clappers. A few seconds later bloke off train came round corner. He must have been going some to have caught me up....

[StupidBloodyKindle]

....this is usually the bit in the movies where he would then proceed to say: Miss, you forgot your...
But that didn't happen 'cos he was a bad 'un.

[SoupDragon]

The OP is an experienced hiker and had clothing, a tent and food with her - it was a bit daft to loose the compass but it still sounds like she was better prepared than a lot of hikers.

Surely an experienced hiker would have more than one compass or a compass plus GPS and spare batteries.

I only go walking in the safe and well signposted Surrey countryside but I always have spare batteries for my GPS and a battery pack to charge my phone.


And as a previous poster said, he hardly needed to get them further off the beaten track if he wanted to attack, did he?!

This! The fear was no more rational than being spooked by the eeriness of wilderness at night. He had already had ample opportunity to attack them.

[Doyouthinktheysaurus]

What I can't quite get my head around is why you thought camping would be a good idea op if your instincts were telling you this was a dodgy bloke! How the hell is a layer of tent fabric going to prevent him from attacking you

Anyway, don't all camouflage wearing survivalist types look a bit dodgy Ray Mears, Bear Grylls........

I could get lost in the Lakeland Fells very easily, but then I can get lost anywhere. That's why we stick to clearly marked paths. When we went in the height of summer we still didn't encounter that many people so heaven only knows where you were that it was so busy in April!

[lk26]

Strange question but did this man have lots of keys on his belt ?
I live in a small town in the Lake District and we have a nab who dresses in full army fatigues and wonders about a lot. With bunches of keys !
I think I would have more likely been reading about your rescues than getting attacked. But I imagine it would have been quite scary.

[nooka]

Thing is that if this chap had been the raping and murdering kind he would likely have raped and murdered the OP and friend regardless of her assertive refusal of help, he didn't need to walk them off somewhere more remote as they were obviously pretty isolated already, and likely became more isolated as they continued to wander around in the dark.

I think that I'd put the whole thing down to you both making some really poor decisions (going off the marked route on a whim, losing the only compass, not stopping and camping when it started to get dark, freaking out about ghosts and scary men alike etc) and stop blaming each other.

[Runningupthathill82]

Exactly, 26.2. I asked that question up thread but didn't get an answer.
As someone who knows the Lakes well, and lived there for a while, i'm very curious to see where this experinced hiker managed to get lost.
As an aside, I've been up there walking three times in the last month, and the mountains have been busier than Manchester Piccadilly railway station on matchdays.

[HairyMcMary]

Presumably you had not lost your map, you could have just asked him for a map reading and a compass bearing: you would' have had to follow him 'somewhere more remote'. And you were remote anyway.
Is this the plot of an Outward Bound adventure novel?

The high fells are full of army guys camping wild, I always see them speeding along with massive packs.

Which range of fells were you in?

There are some places in the areas of passes where you can get disorientated but generally the shapes of the fells are recognisable from studying the map, to anyone who knows how to read contour lines etc.

At least the Mountain Rescue were spared this debacle.

[SummerOfLadybirds]

The mountain was Old Man of Coniston, approached from Dow Crag side.

I don't think I explained myself very well in original post. We've both hiked for years (including winter camping) but have rarely needed to navigate, we normally hike with people who are good at this.
I accept it was a massive mistake not to bring a spare compass. We thought we'd be ok without one but its easy to get disorientated especially in cloud. LOL at the poster who thinks you can't get lost in the LD because it has 'big lakes' and the mountains have distinctive features! We knew which mountain we were on (!) just couldn't find the route we wanted.

It was a joint decision to go off the path in the first place, because we wanted to get away from the tourists and other walkers. We had a 4-season expedition tent and subzero sleeping-bags (plus provisions, warm clothes, first-aid kit etc) so could have camped anywhere with no risk of hypothermia.

The compass was clipped onto my belt, we noticed it was missing halfway through the morning.

I didn't notice the man carrying keys, but he was smoking rollies so maybe the poacher theory is correct! I presume he had tent in his rucksack. He had pots and pans tied onto outside of rucksack so obviously planned to sleep out. I don't know what he was doing or if he planned to descend for night, he didn't seem in a hurry and seemed very at ease in environment.

I agree the man was probably harmless, but at the time I just felt something was not right, can't put my finger on it, just seemed like it was bad idea to trust him. It wasn't his clothes, rucksack, size or even anything he said, it was just a strange feeling about him. Maybe it was because I felt he'd been watching us for a few hours. Yes he could have been keeping an eye out in case we needed help, but it made me uneasy, I guess its how prey feels when being stalked! I don't understand why he didn't say hello earlier, in daylight, and ask if we wanted help, instead of waiting till light faded.

He could have just been going in same direction but he seemed to stop when we did and it unnerved me the way he kept popping up unexpectedly as if he knew which way we'd pass and was lying in wait. BTW we weren't going in a circle, we knew the vague direction. I agree he could have attacked us had he wanted to, but I hoped by being assertive and confident it might put him off if he had any ideas. Most rapists look for easy targets. By admitting we were lost, trusting him and helplessly following him we would have been more vulnerable. I was worried he might lead us somewhere even more remote, or that he might have friends camping nearby. When he appeared we were on a sheep-trail (that eventually led to main path though we weren't sure at time) so it seemed riskier to leave this and follow him.

[HairyMcMary]

I have been lost in mist, in the endless featureless spongy grass slopes of the outlying fells, it can happen.

Posters need to know that having a mobile / GPS is no guarantee of help: loads and loads of places in the fells have no signal. This is a cause of much false security amongst the less experienced.

[RedToothBrush]

RE: Getting lost in the Lakes / Peaks etc

DH is a Scout Leader. In order to take children walking he has to do training courses to ensure their safety. They do air on the side of cautious but its still within the realms of possibility. The main thing being that the weather can change suddenly and unpredictably and hide landmarks and there are some places where compasses don't work due to magnetic conditions. He is taught how to navigate in the dark without a compass. They are not allowed to rely on GPS or mobiles because they have the potential to fail. He's done several lengthy courses in order to get his skills up to speed.

There are places that are 'no more than an hour from the pub' and there are places more remote. In bad weather, even 'an hour from the pub' is potentially dangerous.

Having such a blasé and ignorant attitude is when things start to go wrong. You have to respect the area.

Some of the reasons we don't have more incidents is in part down to better understanding and awareness of this, paths being marked so less people seek out the wilderness and because the culture is to help others who look like they are in trouble, before they do get into trouble.

I can't help but feel, that the OP's unease is down to the fact that seeing a man in combats is a little bit frightening in its own right if you are lost as it draws attention to the fact you are probably out of your depth and about to look a bit of a twat. A touch of embarrassment or pride rather than the guy being creepy...?

[OccamsLadyshave]

OP I think YWNBU to not trust a stranger when you were in a vulnerable situation. I think your friend was being ridiculous not to have set up camp during daylight, had your tea and had a perfectly reasonable night's sleep.

I think she endangered your life by refusing to camp because of ghosts (WTF?) and probably added to your sense of anxiety. I would seriously reconsider walking with her again.

Yes it was unfortunate that you lost your compass, and yes you should have had one each. Lesson learned. And to those who can't understand how you can get lost in the Lakes - that's bloody ridiculous. It's easily done with no compass, and I have very experienced mountain leader friends who have done it. The difference is they make use of the gear they are carrying, make themselves safe and don't take unnecessary risks.

The only way YWBU was to let your friend's hysteria affect your judgement, and not overrule her worries about toilets, showers and ghosts!

[Runningupthathill82]

It was me who said most places aren't more than an hour from the pub. And I am certainly not blase and ignorant when it comes to the fells.
I was merely expressing surprise at the OP managing to be so lost when she is, apparently, an experienced walker. Truly experienced walkers, with the right kit and preparation, would have no trouble getting themselves down off a mountain in the Lakes.
It's people like the OP and her friend that put a strain on the mountain rescue services. I hope they have made a donation.