To not want my brother in law to move closer to us?

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Up until recently, myself, my partner and his brother were very close and got on great. He has no interest in getting a girlfriend or settling down so spends a lot of time with us. He adores my kids and they love him to bits. So a year ago, we decided to all buy a house together, this is not something he would have done alone (he's not much of a go getter) my DP did all the house hunting, negotiating, etc. The mortgage is in DP brother's name but we went halves on deposit and DP and I pay all the mortgage. When we eventually sell it, we will own just less than halves. At the time, it seemed a good investment for everyone. He was moving away and in with a friend paying cheap rent, but will end up owning more than half a 3 bed house. It turns out, it was the worst decision ever. All boundaries have been shifted. He lets himself in with his key, he rummages through the food cupboards, wanders around upstairs, even got changed in my bedroom the other day! The list goes on. If that isn't irritating enough, he has started treating the kids as if they are his own, telling them off, making decisions about what food they can eat, when they can watch telly, etc. It's a nightmare! He has admitted to me, he really misses them, hence why he is moving back! The other day, he let himself in and didn't even say hi to me, just went straight to the kids. Generally he is lovely, but at the moment I just feel so frustrated. The main reason, I find it so hard to have it out with him as I think he is pretty lonely and I don't want to upset him. I am absolutely dreading him moving back though. AIBU?

"but he has to realise our home isn't his"

Sorry but this is wrong. Legally it's his home, not yours. It doesn't matter how lovely he is and how much you trust him, he has already changed since this arrangement was started.

Where is he planning to live on coming back to where you are? He could suddenly announce he is moving in the house he legally owns and there is nothing you can do about it.

The Will is nothing. You need something in writing, now. Are you tenants in common or joint tenants or anything like that? The whole family knowing the arrangement means sod all. You could have lost your entire deposit with this.

You really are being incredibly naive. Why can't think you sit him down and say that this is supposed to be your home and he cannot come and go as he pleases, let alone tell your children what they can and cannot do. If you really are that close then this should be no issue at all. What does your DH think about this?

And if he overcomes his issues and meets a woman who wants to take him for every thing he's got settle down?

For all your benefits this should be agreed legally in a written contract.

So what if you trust BIL completely? So what if he trusts you completely and loves your dcs? That is totally irrelevant.

Sorry to be morbid, but:
What if BIL died in a car crash. Do you think the mortgage company will agree you part own the house? Not a hope.
What if you and your dh died in a car crash. Do you think your dcs would stand to inherit anything at all? Nope.
What if BIL marries and/or has a dc. Do you think his partner or children would agree that you own 'almost half' of their inheritance? Probably not.
What if you and your dh need to sell up and move but BIL doesn't?
What if you reach an amicable but totally non negotiable difference of opinion about building an extension or solar panels or something. Who actually owns the house? BIL. You have no say.
What if you and dh split up. The divorce courts wont be able to count the value of your family home as you are actually just renting. You would lose everything.
Or what if BIL overstepped the boundaries and started letting himself into your home because it's actually HIS house?

Getting it sorted legally is the best way to make sure your dh's family don't fall out

Excellent post from Invizicat - OP you would do well to read at least twice.

You're making this up as you go and making some very bizarre decisions. Why put it in a will when there are established legal documents for this kind of set-up? You need to see a solicitor and get the right paperwork sorted straightaway. Saying it'll all be fine because you care about each other... Christ, it's like you're walking around with your eyes closed. People fuck each other over all the time. Parents, husbands and wives, never mind brothers in law! Wake up and sort it out, please. Otherwise you're getting the worst of all worlds - a landlord who doesn't have to follow any rules!

"I feel bad for him, but he has to realise our home isn't his"

But it is his home: he owns it! That's why he comes and goes as he pleases.

Good luck with making him realise. This whole situation has "disaster" written all over it.

Ok I'll get some legal documents written up as soon as possible. Hopefully it will help with the psychology behind it all and boundaries will be put back into place.

Can you do that though? What if BIL says no?

It's your bils home not yours. He can do as he pleases as you've not been smart about this. Not sure what you can do now

I can't see that there is really a way of sorting this legally. You have no legal interest in the property and attempting to establish some sort of beneficial interest is going to be difficult. I'm guessing the mortgage company were unaware of the arrangement or you would have had to sign deeds of postponement etc.... on purchasing the property.

BIL must also have lied to the mortgage company about the source of the deposit. If the mortgagor was aware that half the deposit was coming from a source other than the mortgagee's own funds, they would not have lent.

There isn't really any way of sorting this out easily save for eventually selling the house and hoping BIL doesn't stiff you any of the proceeds. I'd do this sooner rather than later while the amount you stand to possibly lose is minimal.

There are women who are married for decades with dc whose husbands walk out.

Things have already changed. You and your dh thought that this was a good plan but it's turned out to be the 'worst decision ever'.

Surely it's more likely than not that the brother is going to meet someone and want to settle down with them. In his house.

Have you posted about this before? I have a sense of deja vu.

BIL could agree to register your interest but with the bank taking priority until mortgage repaid I suppose. I don't think in those circumstances that the bank need to be notified.

Its really messy though!

I'm not sure what legal documents can be drawn up though? As you won't be allowed on to mortgage with bad credit history. And as far as I am aware you can't be on deeds if you're not on the mortgage. But someone more knowledgable on the subject might have an idea.
The telling off children thing wouldn't really bother me though, my brother and sister tell my kids off all the time, and I think it does my DCs good!

It seems to me that he has possibly committed mortgage fraud.

He can quite easily revoke a will and refuse to sign anything you ask him to. You don't appear to have a tenancy agreement and relying on family members to back one brother over another is risky, no one will want to get involved or take sides by being witnesses to what your arrangement is/was.

You shouldn't bank on him being a man of his word.

What legal document do you have? Are either you or your dp on the mortgage with bil?

It sounds v v precarious.

Sorry this will be long-When I moved in with my dp this was similar to the situation I found myself in-dp owned the house In law lived in (different town quite a drive away) In law owned the house we lived in. They assured me everything was fine it would all be sorted out properly before I moved in....it wasn't but I didn't find this out until it was too late as Inwould becer have gone through with moving in had I have known. The month I moved in in law decided to rent out the other home because he had live in accommodation with his job-reality was it meant him turning up to stay whenever he wanted for as long as he wanted-almost weekly and for days at a time, bringing guests with him, eating the food we were buying, using the electricity we were paying for, our water, wash powder (you get the picture). He never contributed a penny to us. On top of this he brought his furniture and personal belongings to store in our home. There was no room for mine and my dd's things. We'd tidy his stuff out the way into boxes/cupboards etc, he'd decide he needed one particular dvd or similar empty everything out and leave it for us to retidy away-repeat at least twice a month. After 8 months of living hell dp finally had enough and told In law his stuff had to go into storage-guess who had to pay for it? Amazingly in law 'couldn't' afford storage (despite being able to afford holidays-as well as regular nights out). On top of this he presented us with a bill for property maintainance that we had to stump up half for (the other house-legally dps responsibility) so we had to find £££'s for that. We were brasic, living hand to mouth-he was leading the life of Riley.

He overstepped the boundaries with the children massively-to the point he expected more of a say in decisions to do with them than what I had. Decisions to do with the house he rode roughshod over everything dp and I decided. Then came the other financial liberties-He applied for credit in dp's name because he couldn't get it in his and because 'we're so close and you know ill pay it'. Then came the debt-he ran up ££,£££'s of unsecured debt in his own name-living the high life, he went on sick from work-at one point the doc thougt he may need a few months off-guess where he was planning to stay had that of happened...oh then he lost his job....the stress for the month it took him to find another was unbearable...not for him, because by this point the tenants had moved out so he had his house to go to, when he missed that months payment on the house it didn't affect his credit score because it wasn't in his name....I was distraught knowing that if he didn't get himself sorted it would be us who would a. Have to find the money for two mortgages and b. End up homeless if the house was repossessed due to his money troubles...
Throughout all this dp maintained it was fine, we'd be okay blah blah blah. He got a new job but his debt carried on spiralling. Eventually dp had to help him with his debt by taking out credit and him repaying us, I pushed for them to sort out the legal side of the houses but dp said there was no need.

Fast forward several years-in law decided he wants to move; dp insists that other house goes up for sale, as he just wants rid now and for it to be sorted out properly (he's finally seeing the situation from my view) In law doesn't like having to wait for sale as he seen somewhere he wants and needs deposit....he takes out the equity of the home we live in behind dps back (the one we pay morgage on).....

Happy to say the other house sold and dp did get the equity from that and our home is now in dp's name (with a will to protect me and dc if anything happens) but the stress of the whole situation over the last few years has been immense-not for the in-law and to a lesser extent for dp-but mainly for me because all the while ive been worrying about loosing the roof over our head-if anything happened to dp-I had no rights. If dp and I broke up-i had no rights. I would be the one facing homelessness with two children and being in a situation of no savings and not working. Dp's eyes were opened during this period as to how much trust he put in someone who's priorities wasn't to our family unit but to himself and he has openly said he regrets how gullible he was and would never do that again.

You've put yourself and your family in such an unstable position, even with the best intentions your bils priorities will be to himself and to any partner and children he ends up having....there is a good reason they say never mix business and pleasure-even more so when you have not taken steps to protect your investment.

I think you need proper legal advice.

Whose names are on the deeds?
If your BIL doesn't live in the house did he take out the mortgage fraudulently ?
How is your credit rating now? Are you taking action to ensure its improving?
Might your BIL be liable to capital gains if the house gets sold?

Thanks for your post marbulous, what a stressful few years you've had, I'm glad it is sorted for you now.
I have a friend who is a solicitor, I will ask her for some advice on all this.

You are stupidly naive if you think there is no chance of this going wrong. See a solicitor ASAP.

Bloody hell, didn't you consult a solicitor before agreeing to this mad arrangement? Your dh & bil should have bought the house as a tenants in common that way both of their names would have been on the deeds and equally protected by law. Consult a solicitor on Tuesday but don't tell your bil and don't miss him off as it could get nasty.

How are you paying the rent OP
Is there ant housing benefit involved?
I am not accusing you of anything but I think this all could get very messy. People are lovely but can change massively when money or power are involved, as you have seen

Op, I think from your posts you have no intention of seeing a solicitor but, as a property lawyer, I urge you to see one as soon as possible. This type of arrangement makes me want to bang my head of a wall. You have paid, what, half a deposit? And are currently paying a mortgage on a property you do not own and have no legal right to??! A will doesnt mean anything unless your bil dies.
I also suspect mortgage fraud has been committed.
Yes, I know you trust your bil, I also hope you trust your husband but if I had a quid for every time I heard that...and then got a phone call 6, 12, 18 months later when I can't help someone getting done out of thousands!

It's already gone wrong, which was unexpected. How much worse is it going to get?

I can't believe you haven't got contracts, tenancy agreements and so on in place! Please be careful.

I know from the outside it appears very messy but we are in no worse position than if we had been renting. This was just a way of getting back some of the money which would usually go down the drain. We are not on housing benefit. BIL couldn't afford the deposit alone so we chipped in on the condition we could have a stake in the house. I am aware that we should have had a legal document drawn up stating all this. In all honesty, I am not bothered about the stake in the house. I am bothered about the deposit money obviously but I cannot see him refusing to pay us that back. He has a very well paid job and no dependents. It is purely his attitude towards the children that bothers me. And how much he makes himself at home when he is here!