...to give way at this roundabout?

[ProvisionallyAnxious]

I posted on here a month or so back about my nerves as a new driver - everyone was very helpful and I am feeling much better about it all now! I was wondering if I could ask for your thoughts on a situation I found myself in this afternoon.

So, I'm approaching a mini roundabout (purple car in the picture!) turning left. To my immediate right is a one-way street (feeding onto the roundabout) that is very rarely used. Opposite me is a big queue of cars, turning right, so aiming for the same turn-off as me. My understanding is that in this situation (where you're at 180 degrees to each other) the first car to arrive has priority, so I let the "blue" car across from me go ahead. The problem is that all of the other cars behind that car then proceed to follow it out onto the roundabout - I think a lot of drivers tend to 'ignore' the one-way street at that roundabout and therefore assume right of way over people opposite them.

Then the traffic lights for the pedestrian crossing (the red lines on the picture) turn red, so the cars that have pulled out get stuck on the roundabout - there's no space for me to pull out at all. The traffic lights turn green and as they start to move on I wait for a moment to see what the remaining car on the other side of the roundabout is going to do - it's a mini so if it were a larger roundabout I'd have pulled out as there'd be time for me to turn before they reach me but I'm wary of there not being enough space if they assume priority. They hold back to let me out and as they do, the car behind me honks really aggressively (not a "toot toot, you can go", but a "MOVE!" kind of honk if that makes sense) and as I look in the mirror the driver behind me is waving his hands really angrily.

As I pull out I toot back (not as loudly) and stick up my finger.

I think I probably WBU to get angry/upset in response, but was he BU to honk? I don't think he can have been waiting behind me for more than 30 seconds, and I didn't particularly want to bully my way onto the roundabout. What do people think (and what would you do on a roundabout where priority isn't obvious / other drivers are assuming priority)?

you are right but sometimes you have to force yourself onto the roundabout or you'd be stuck there for ages. driving is pretty aggressive these days!

strictly speaking though priority is always given to the right

If you both arrived at the roundabout at the same time, there should usually have been plenty of time for you to make your turn before the blue car reached the point on the roundabout where you were.

I'm a bit confused about this sentence The problem is that all of the other cars behind that car then proceed to follow it out onto the roundabout
Do you mean all these other cars are coming like the blue one - from the top of the piece of paper to their 3rd exit?

If so, then of course they have right of way, as they are already on the island. You can't enter until there is a gap. It doesn't matter if the car has come from the one way road, the road opposite you or if someone is circling the island for the 4th time - until there is a gap on the island, you can't pull out.
When cars have stopped, then some kind sole sometimes signals you to go out - then that's fine, but it's not your right of way, so the impatient person behind you was just that - impatient. You didn't do anything wrong if I've understood the description right.

Well, except for your behaviour afterwards - but then you know that.

Oh, and the 'sound' of a horn varies with the car - I don't think you can say it was an aggressive blast or a friendly toot just from the noise

tbh I don't think tooting back and giving the finger are the best way to go about it.

as a new, inexperienced driver I can see why you might hesitate at the roundabout but you do have to give way to traffic on the right...however someone could have attempted to let you in or you could have edged out when the crossing was at red if there was a long line of non-moving traffic. its not bullying your way onto the roundabout. I find that accidents tend to happen when drivers become impatient and/or angry so best to accept there will always be arseholes on the road but not to stoop to their level.

Nothing you did at the roundabout was unreasonable or wrong. The guy behind you was a knob and shouldn't have used his horn. Although you shouldn't have used yours back, and I also wouldn't gesture at other motorists. When people behave like this in cars (impatient, intimidating etc) I mentally call them a tosser and then forget about them and concentrate on what I'm doing. I tend to think that people like that will get het up about something or someone, so I don't waste any mental energy on them.

Cars on the roundabout always have priority. You have to wait until there's a gap in the traffic coming from the right no matter which entrance onto the roundabout you're all coming from.

Midnite

It's a pretty small mini roundabout, and the circle is just painted on - so cars turning right tend to cut the corner. There's maybe 3 or 4 car lengths from one side of the roundabout to the other. I was possibly being a little cautious!

Nothing you could do, give way to traffic from the right. No matter where it came from. Exactly as BackForGood says.

I'm just impressed that you drew a picture!

But seriously - the worst thing you can ever be accused of by being hesitant and giving way is... annoying. If you're bolshy and push your way in, you can cause accidents.

Take your time. Confidence will grow along with your ability to judge when you can nip in and when you can't, and then you won't worry about these things.

I think cars coming into the roundabout should give way to traffic that is already on the island so all of those cars coming behind the blue car have right of way over you. Having said that you would be there all day unless you push ahead sometimes but the other driver was rude and wrong to honk at you

there will be a thousand more incidents like this, dont sweat the small stuff
city driving,.probably you could have moved forward a bit and the cars opposite would interpret this as it was 'your go'
its incredibly unlikely that anyone would deliberately drive into you, or you would cause an accident, if the cars were moving slowly
but this is partly about confidence and assertiveness
if you didnt feel confident, then you did exactly the right thing
some drivers are just dicks

Oops, cross-posted. I know I was BU to react the way I did - I just felt really shaken up. I'm still getting used to driving and I think the thing I find hardest is not letting drivers behind me 'pressure' me out of my comfort zone, so it hit a nerve. (And I'm not a slow or massively hesitant driver generally).

Back

Hah, I know what you mean about horn sounds. My horn's voice is very gentle. It was more the duration of the blast that I felt was aggressive - he really leaned on it!

I get that it's a confidence thing but if you'd been waiting for cars on the roundabout to pass (they did have the right of way to keep coming on if nothing was coming round the roundabout from their right), and then you waited to see if the mini was going to move when the way was open for you to get on the roundabout, I can understand why the driver behind you was getting impatient.

People behind you just have to wait! It's tough luck if they would have gone for a gap and you don't. The only vehicles behind you that you need to worry about are emergency vehicles.

You sound like a very kind driver, I wish there were more of you. But as someone has pointed out sometimes you do have to nudge your way in a bit, I probably would have edged forward when the traffic was waiting for the lights to change, someone may have let you in although you wouldn't actually have right of way and anyway you would then be poised to take your gap ahead of the blue car. Miniroundabouts are funny though, there's one near me where regularly three of us arrive at the same time and all stop.

The honking sounds rude. When people do that to me I come over all PA and go REALLY slowly and yawn in the rearview mirror. Culture is much more mature than me, I recommend her attitude.

But also I remember my instructor saying 'do what is safe for you.' You may well find you get a bit more assertive in your driving style as time goes on but don't let yourself be bullied by other, rude drivers into taking risks you aren't comfortable with. You sound like you are doing great!

Thanks everyone, you all deserve !

I do take stuff on the road too personally. I'm always really anxious about causing other people inconvenience, perhaps too much.

The priority is always clear, you were correct to give way. If it'sa steady stream of traffic, eventually someone will let you out. In this case I think the driver behind you was hassling you to force your way out a bit, but if in doubt absolutely don't do this.

It is normal and fine to wait for slightly bigger gaps as a new driver, and it is fine to be a less aggressive driver than the bloke behind you. You have nothing to apologise for or defend. In my earliest driving days I tried to drive as predictably as possible. Stick to following the rules for now, it's enough for one brain to cope with. Don't let him stress you out.

That said I would prob just raise my left hand in kind of acknowledgement to the bolshy driver ("I've heard you mate") and try to stay calm rather than sounding my horn back etc. The other drivers on the rbt might have thought you were honking at them.

I'm not going to comment on whether you had enough time to turn before the other car, and of course, yes priority right.

But the car behind you had no right to use the horn, the horn should be used to indicate the other driver is pissed off with you!

www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q406.htm

However, you should also not use your horn, or your finger, to indicate that you are pissed off with the other driver! WHY? Because it is not an appropriate action and because road rage could easily escalate from stupid situations like the one you describe (stupidity on the part of the other driver initially!) You may think oh no worries I will be long gone in a second only to find yourself stuck in a massive row of traffic with the other (now very angry) driver behind you.

And I agree with drivingmissspotty that sometimes you need to edge out a bit and also I remember my instructor saying 'do what is safe for you. You need to gauge the situation. I once went to go on a roundabout when on my motorbike, stopped because a moped was coming and the guy behind me rammed into me. Of course it was his fault (he should still have been able to stop even though I was hesitant). So just look out for you, be polite, keep your horn and finger under control and ignore the numpties!

the horn should NOT be used to indicate the other driver is pissed off with you!

I too, am very impressed at your ability to upload a diagram of all of this - I may be an experienced driver, but I wouldn't have a clue where to start with that

Yanbu but I wouldn't have bothered tooting him back. It's best just to ignore. You mustn't worry about being cautious.

When I was first driving, my mum (a very confident and safe driver) was driving across town with our ill cat in a carrier on her front seat. She was being that little bit extra careful, trying not to brake suddenly and not pulling out until there was plenty of room as she didn't want to have to turn sharply or accelerate too quickly to meet the speed of the traffic. She said it was like being a learner driver, except she wasn't worried what anyone thought because she knew she 'could' squeeze into the gaps, she was just choosing not to because of the cat. Similarly, when she thought someone behind her might have been getting impatient, she just thought 'well, they don't know I've got a poorly cat in the car so they are judging the situation based on only half the facts' and didn't give it a second thought!
I often thought about that when I was starting off on my own - people don't know that you are new to driving, they don't know if you've got a cat in the car, and they have no idea why you might be hesitating, so don't let their interpretation of the situation affect your actions as it's your comfort and confidence that's important.

Am I right in thinking that the car opposite you wasn't on the roundabout as you reached it? If so I would have thought you could have gone as you only have to give way to traffic to the right - unless the other car was approaching so quickly that you could not do so safely.

Do you have a P plate on the car. I know they are not a UK thing, but personally I will give L plate drivers all the time and space in the world, P plate drivers some, but expect all other drivers to know what they are doing, particularly at rush hour and do get frustrated by incompetence/nervous drivers.

The man behind you was being an impatient knob - the cars coming across had the right of way and sometimes you just have to wait. You always give way to traffic coming from the right at a roundabout regardless of which road they've come out of or how many times they've gone round the roundabout.

It was great that the car opposite let you go and maybe you could have been less hesitant in pulling out then but apart from that, you did everything right.