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AIBU?

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Original poster

R-word apologists on jury service. I am scared now.

118 replies

keepingmum121 · 29/03/2015 23:20

This is only in AIBU because the thread that inspired it is also here.

I have reported a 'R' against me a few months ago and the process of the investigation is very trying (to say the least).

Now I am absolutely terrified that if this goes to court, there might be people on the jury with similar opinions as some people on that other thread (I hope you know which one I mean).

Do you know, are the jury told in NO uncertain terms what the definition of R is before proceedings commence? Are there efforts made to eliminate people who excuse the man who did it for stupid reasons?

I'm scared :(

OP posts:
SabrinnaOfDystopia · 30/03/2015 00:45

OP, I was a prosecution witness on a r trial last year. My friend was the victim. It was daunting standing in court and saying those things in front of a jury of strangers , but I did it, my friend did it (brilliantly) and you can too. He was convicted on a 10-2 verdict and he got a 10yr prison sentence.

Despite the fact that I was telling the absolute truth, I had this innate fear that the jury and judge would think I was lying. I think this is really common when you come to give evidence - all you can do is tell your story honestly. A court of law really, really has ways of weeding out liars - their questions are designed to catch you out for this reason. But you're not lying, so you can weather this - thinking back, my friend and I were asked some pretty horrific questions (including that we'd cooked this whole story up ourselves because we were lovers (!!!) ) but we answered them honestly, and the truth is convincing. a whole raft of stuff was thrown at my friend, that was largely irrelevant to whether she was raped or not - but the judge and jury see this, and the judge's summing up will deal with this.

If you'd like to know the trial I gave evidence on, do pm me, I'll send you links to it. I can't put it on the thread, just in case.

SabrinnaOfDystopia · 30/03/2015 00:50

Btw OP - I was so nervous when I gave evidence, my hand was shaking so much that when I went to take a drink of water, I crunched the pathetic plastic cup they provide in my hand, and couldn't get it to my mouth!

You can say to the judge 'I'm sorry, I'm very nervous and I want to get this right' - they will understand. Take your time answering questions - the defence will try to catch you out, because that's their job - but that doesn't mean it will carry weight with the jury.

Original poster
keepingmum121 · 30/03/2015 00:54

If there are others before me, will I get to know about that? Will the previous victims attend the same trial as me or will he be tried separately for each assault with the jury unaware of the others?

OP posts:
CultureSucksDownWords · 30/03/2015 00:58

I'm not an expert but AFAIK any other cases would be dealt with separately so I'm not sure you'd know if there were others. You might find out after the verdict if he has previous convictions though.

DarthVadersTailor · 30/03/2015 01:00

They'll maybe argue that as I consented 5 days earlier, it can't be so bad. I can anticipate all the possible crap that will harm my case.

OP just as a word of warning I wouldn't say too much or comment on your case just purely in case you put it in jeopardy Flowers

minkGrundy · 30/03/2015 01:03

I believe you OP.
I am sure enough of the jury will believe you too.

If you can, say the things you have said here- you have difficulty talking about it, you have difficulty recalling the exact sequence of events because it is traumatic who would want to remember?

The fact that he bit you etc. goes against him. It is assault. Why would you have consented to that? He has to show that he had good and clear reason to believe that you consented to being bitten and strangled.

I believe you OP.

We are often the bravest when we feel most scared as it is easy to be brave when you are not scared. You are brave and strong.

And others have said, the idiots on that are thread are a minority. Others have been quick enough to put them right.

I hope you get some counselling and I hope he gets what he deserves.

SabrinnaOfDystopia · 30/03/2015 01:10

OP - the case I was on (and have just pm'd you) - they were in a relationship together. There was consensual sex, but that doesn't mean that you cannot be raped if you have had consensual sex before.

kali110 · 30/03/2015 01:16

Op i wish you all the luck in the world!
I think i remember you posting on here, i know you've nn so i wont go into detail but it made me so mad.
I hope you get the justice you deserve xx

Original poster
keepingmum121 · 30/03/2015 01:19

kali, do you know me as my previous mn name then? Can you pm me?

OP posts:
TidyDancer · 30/03/2015 01:21

You are very brave OP. I wish I had some advice or something very helpful to say but I'm afraid I don't. But I do believe you and I hope that is something. Thinking of you. x

CunningCat · 30/03/2015 01:37

Have you got a rape crisis worker? Through police or other agencies? They can offer you loads of support for the trial Flowers

Binkybix · 30/03/2015 07:30

You are brave, there's no doubt about it.

Just to say that when I was a juror on a case, the defence barrister's aggression and attempts to show that unrelated behaviour of women beforehand meant she couldn't have been raped turned me against the defence.

Binkybix · 30/03/2015 08:13

Sorry, 'aggression' is the wrong word. He wasn't agressive. I more meant his attempts to paint actions to mean something that they didn't.

Original poster
keepingmum121 · 30/03/2015 08:57

So, as a jury member, does you final decision boil down to which person seems the most believable? I mean, it really is one persons word against another.
Scarily, this guy is a very very good liar.

OP posts:
Binkybix · 30/03/2015 09:07

In all honesty different people will make their decisions in different ways. For me it was a mixture of the evidence (mainly) and a tiny bit how people came across, although I tried as hard as I could to ignore that.

You're telling the truth, which should be more convincing that even a great liar.

Original poster
keepingmum121 · 30/03/2015 09:13

Thank you. There so SO much I'm desperate to ask about evidence but I know that this forum is not the place.
Anyway, if my case is not strong enough to get justice, the CPS will say so before it even gets to court. That is something I dread! I don't want to go through all this pain and then find I can't proceed!

OP posts:
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 30/03/2015 11:29

So sorry you've had such an awful experience.
Must be hair raising waiting for the CPS to make their decision...

I feel y9lou could really do withwith some professional support. Please ask your GP.. Also it sounds like all the understandable worry about this is really interfering with your life. I think your GP should expredite you to access help... Ask for a counsellor /psych with specialist interest in sexual trauma.

I think once CPS decided to proceed, there should be someone who can answer your qs about evidence.

Also if general qs why don't you post on legal thread?

Original poster
keepingmum121 · 30/03/2015 12:48

I've made an appointment to see crisis worker in a couple of weeks. Feeling a little calmer this morning. Thank you all for sharing your court experiences, for encouraging me and generally being kind enough to post. I still can't feel at all brave, but it is heartening that some of you think I am.

OP posts:
Pyjamasandwine · 30/03/2015 14:29

I think you need to be very careful posting this on the internet. Please don't do anything to jepodise your case.

As for the jury you can only trust strangers judgment. I have been on a jury and it's hard to be honest but the judge does help.

You are brave and all you can do is tell the truth. But do get the help you need xxx

Original poster
keepingmum121 · 30/03/2015 14:34

Thank you. I am trying to be careful but do you think there is any particular post I should get deleted?

OP posts:
sparkysparkysparky · 30/03/2015 14:47

Just remember, you are not trying to convince the other barrister. It is their job to be unconvinced. That's what they are paid to do. Your testimony is for the jury and judge. And please access help from your GP and/or Rape Crisis. Take care.

MonstrousRatbag · 30/03/2015 16:24

I've been cross-examined. For ages. Very different circs though. I got through it by just focussing intently. Didn't look at anyone except the barrister questioning me, and the judge. Didn't think about anyone or anything else. It was very tiring, but my mother helped by saying 'Oh, they're only people, not superhumans. Just imagine the barrister naked and sitting on the loo.' I laughed it off when she said it, but I remembered it when I was in court. It helped that when the barrister stood up to start cross-examination, I noticed his flies were undone. Small psychological advantage to me.

It's all about taking your time, and not caring what ANYONE in that courtroom thinks of you, unless it is to remember that everyone on that jury is thinking 'Christ, rather her than me, I'd be terrified'.

Don't think about what any one answer will mean for your case, just give the answer. For me it was all about getting through until lunchtime, then after lunch all about getting through it until the end of the court session, and the same the next day and the day after that. I never thought further than max 3 hours ahead.

Provided you are doing your best to tell the truth (keeping your temper, taking your time, concentrating, being clear, including about whether or not you can remember stuff), and the judge will know if you are, then no one can do anything to you. I told myself that all the time-'the truth will set you free' etc.

I knew win or lose I could hold my head up, and so can you.

MirandaGoshawk · 30/03/2015 16:50

I was involved as a witness for the prosecution in a court case. It was connected with fraud by a customer at my place of work. There was no doubt about the guy's guilt and it was all over very quickly. I told my side of the story and answered the questions that the judge put to me. But - and this is something that I have always regretted - I left out a detail simply because it all rattled along so quickly. He would still have been found guilty, I'm sure, but I didn't tell the whole story. I'm telling you this just to reinforce that you should not let them rush you. There might be details that you need to get across but due to interruptions etc you might be diverted. Maybe make some notes? Tick each point off as it's made? There is all the time in the world so make sure you get to say everything you need to.

Well done, OP. Good luck. We all believe you, and when the jury hear you, they will too.

Original poster
keepingmum121 · 30/03/2015 17:25

Oh, thank you so much for those messages. I will take your comments on board. I had not realized that the cross examination would take so long. I thought it would be perhaps an hour on the first day and that would be it. Oh dear!

OP posts:
allthesundays · 30/03/2015 17:45

Definitely get support from Rape crisis, they have a good advice service. I reported a rape a good few years ago and I had a tough time in court, but I felt the jury and judge listened carefully. The cross examination were pretty awful however, I won't lie Sad. It was a difficult case as it was date rape and there was a delay between the incident and reporting, and the verdict was not guilty. But - I'm still glad I went through it. He was convicted of an almost identical crime a couple of years ago so I feel relieved that he's finally been recognised for who he is. And I'm grateful for the victim in that case for coming forward and reporting, because at least it means he has been put away.

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