to post a friendly reminder about school residential trips?

[ErmNoNoNo]

Seems as good a time as any: lots of school posts (as always in AIBU), the wine is flowing (Friday) and the summer term is coming up (come on weather please)...

It seems every year that there are many parents that are genuinely shocked to find out that teacher and TAs who accompany the class on residential school visits do not get paid a single penny more than their normal wage.

Yes, we volunteer. Yes, we deal with all the tears. Yes, we are on duty 24 hours and sometimes get VERY little sleep. Yes, we deal with the vomit. Yes, we encourage and make sure they get the absolute best out of their time there. Yes, we deal with all medical issues even though, surprisingly we are not qualified. Yes, when its mid-week, we also have to go back into work the next day.

Yes... we would really, really appreciate it if you just say 'thank you', when you pick your child up at he end of it.

(all you REASONABLE parents, I know you do - but honestly, the amount of parents who think we get paid for this would shock you)

Most of us know teachers don't get paid any extra for going away on trips and residentials and most of us are grateful that you do it. But imo posts like this don't put those of you who feel the need to post them in a good light

I agree with this....

Lots of us do know teachers do not get paid extra for residentials, lots of us think it is ordinary good manners and politeness - part of life in general to thank someone.

I don't need reminding, and every time someone feels they need to do this, something makes me feel "oh for goodness sake".

Dd is not yet school age, but I will of course thank her teachers when she does go on trips.

This thread has just highlighted how miserable and ungrateful worraliberty some posters are.

Exactly what Somewhere said. I would of course politely thank a teacher for taking my child away on a residential.

However, threads like this do make me think "oh for goodness' sake, stop whinging."

OP, you repeatedly claim that this thread was started as some sort of public information service, not a whinge. But it reads like a whinge.

There are much harder jobs out there than being a teacher. And much easier ones. Nobody is forcing anyone to be a teacher - it's a well paid profession that people choose to go into. This sort of whinging doesn't reflect well.

Worra was trying to point out another angle. At no time did she say she wasn't grateful to teachers.

Thank you for the reminder. My DS is going on 2 residential trips this year. I am enormously grateful to the staff and always say thank you but it may be slightly rushed as I am so pleased to have child back in one piece! This year I am going to buy them some pressies too. I have been on youth club residentials so I feel your pain!

WorraLiberty, maybe the lifeboat volunteer doesn't need to come on here and explain that they don't get paid more and no one suggests they should be grateful for the free ride on the boat? By the way I am not a teacher but have run trips for cubs/beavers. Going on a trip with a group of kids isn't a holiday and if I could ask for one thing it is please be on time to pick your kids up. After a long journey standing waiting for the late parent is a smack in the face.

I found this thread enlightening and would like to say thank you to all you lovely teachers who go above and beyond the normal duty.

I know the year my son went on a residential to France was the last one in the school....ever . I know his behaviour on it was also part of the reason the trips were stopped.

I know if I had taken my son to Boulogne I would have had him hand cuffed to me 24/7 and not left loose in a strange environment on his own, well he and his 13 year old mates where fireworks were freely available.

I was shocked when they got home and found they were left to their own devices for several hours during the day. I thought they would have been in a church or museum.

This thread has just highlighted how miserable and ungrateful worraliberty some posters are.

And that ^^ post has highlighted your inability to read my posts properly.

You know the ones where I have repeatedly said anyone should be thanked for looking after someone's child?

The OP wanted to point out to the minority of people who think teachers are paid extra for trips, that they aren't. As quite a few posters have said, this does come across as a bit patronising, particularly when coupled with the fact she's reminding the minority of bad mannered parents to say thank you.

She has now got many pats on the back and many thank yous from random internet strangers. However, I suspect these are the people would would say thank you in real life anyway.

I've just read a FB post from someone whose child was on the same trip as mine slagging the teachers off for not checking all the kids bags. Her child has lost his washbag and a "very expensive" hoodie. She is definately of the opinion that the teachers were "on holiday paid by for the taxpayer"

Silly cow. I've pointed out that as her child was one of the pukers she should be grateful they took good care of him, not slagging them off over FB.

A couple of her friends are sticking up for her, but none of them see to realise that overtime isn't paid for these trips. So it looks like it's a popular misconception.

I think this was started because, despite lots of other posters saying they do know staff aren't paid for the extra time and that they'd always say thank you for offering the time, most teachers and TAs know that the reality is that very very few people in real life actually do at thank you to the teachers after a residential.

I can't remember a parent every saying thank you after I'd taken their children away. I can't remember hearing very many other parents saying thank you after our children have been away. This is the same for most teachers and TAs I know.

So it's fine that people on here say they do know and that they do offer thanks.

But it is surprising how very few really do outside of Mumsnet.

I said they are taken into consideration (amongst other things) when deciding whether a teacher should be moved up the pay scale.

Until recently I was a school parent governor. I was on the finance committee and one of the things we did was to approve requests to move staff up the pay scale, as this would impact the budget.

Trips didn't form part of the assessment for moving up the scales at all. We had a criteria and evidence was presented to show whether or not this criteria had been met. And trips did not form part of that.

To be fair Dowser, it is normal for secondary school children to be allowed some free time on a school residential and to not always need accompanying. It sounds likely that the school had run the trip beforehand and had no issues. And I know my dd and her friends the same age wouldn't think it was okay to go and buy fireworks in that time.

They do on other GBs Fry (though clearly not all), when looking at how much extra work a member of staff is putting in.

I have NEVER known a teachers ability or willingness to volunteer for trips to be taken into account of anything where schools are concerned. Not sure where the poster early on thought it might be.

Even under the new pay stuff I think it's pretty much just academic results that count. Seems that's what the government are only interested in.

I know several teachers who won't run residential trips at all any more. This comes after previous trips they've been on.

And that's ok Hulababy (that you've never known it) but that's not to say it doesn't happen because it does. I've had more than one conversation on a pay committee where this (amongst other things) is discussed.

Either way, unlike someone who volunteers in a sector that has absolutely nothing to do with their career, a teacher going on residential school trips is likely to go down quite well with their superiors don't you think?

re costs. Our school runs the pgl trip over a weekend Fri to Mon to keep costs down for parents. One night less but the cost is less than half (about 170 last year). Kids loved it but goodness hard work for staff teaching Mon to thurs then away with not much sleep Fri to Mon then teaching tues to Fri! Think how tired you are after birthday parties!

I've known staff have to pay towards their accommodation on school trips.

Can I just add, after a trip to New York last year with older students, which yes, was amazing, fun and an experience for the teachers too, that I jumped at the chance of, that although we get something out of it, we still have a lot more to do than just going along for the ride.. on our trip we had days of 20 hours with no sleep, meltdowns from students and major 'catastrophes' to deal with at airports when kids had no clue about the process for security etc, ( had brought expensive large bottles etcin hand baggage) constant counting in and out of students when travelling anywhere, when they won't stay bloody still, messing about and arguments when students decided that the meeting point wasn't where they wanted to be... Basically, stress, every day! Loved going, glad of the chance to, but at 20 week's pregnant and with a dd at hone who I didn't see for 5 days, it's hard, even with older ones.
Guess how many parents thanked us when we stood in the rain, next to the coach, on a Saturday when we were expected to be back at school the following Monday? Out of over 50 students? 2. A few of the students did thank us, we got one email a week or so later thanking us, which was lovely. Oh, and one of them wasn't the one who was 30 mins late picking up, or the one that moaned at us because their daughter was having a teary moment whilst waiting, because she was late And daughter was tired ( this was, apparently, our fault) This is after an 8 hr flight, plus several hours on a coach.

Never ceases to amaze me, just the entitled behaviour, however it's begun to become completely normal..

*When Worra et al wake up (sorry I'm picking on you Worra but your posts stand out) I'd like to know how I'm being unreasonable in:

1. Informing parents who didn't know that teachers and TA don't get paid extra for taking kids on residential trips that we don't
2. Thinking that it would be nice to get a 'thank you' (not extra pay, not eternal gratitude over and above others) for VOLUNTEERING our time.(Please give me a valid argument as to why we aren't volunteering our time when we'd still get the same pay if we couldn't attend or didn't agree to attend the trip.)*

Neither your 1) nor your 2) are unreasonable at all but posting it here, for a load of people who a) mostly know and b) have probably never had their children cared for on a trip by you personally is unreasonable, patronising and sounds like you are complaining/being a martyr.

If your thread was started with a genuine desire to simply point out 1) and 2) then fine. But it seems to me that you must have known the responses you'd get, knew you'd start a bunfight and have, once again, made teachers look whingy and entitled on here. Which most of us aren't!

Part of the lack of thank yous could be down to practicalities. The Yr6 residential seems to time the return bus to coincide with school pick up on Friday - which is great for parents picking up other children.
I don't see how easy it would be for a parent to make their way through the throng to get to the teachers standing by the bus. That would just make the collecting of bags etc even more chaotic. No excuse for not finding another time to thank them though.
I help out at a school activity and am getting more and more pissed off with the lack of thank yous from the kids - about one in 15 will offer thanks.

bolding fail. Sorry.

To be fair to you though, you do seem to have a lot more responsibility than most. I've been both lead teacher and support teacher on trips but I have never been considered, or considered another colleague, to be in sole charge/responsibility. We all do it together.

And rarely have I had a parent not thank me. Maybe I'm lucky.

My dd is going on her residential on Monday, the 2 teachers that are staying the whole week are her class very old teacher and a fairly new teacher who has never been on a residential before but is keen to go, I think it will break the class teacher she is already close to the edge, I doubt I will personally be thanking her but will speak to the other teacher and thank her.

Returned from residential with 91 children recently.

3 thank yous from parents, 1 extra by e-mail, 2 from children. Just for the whispered 'thank you for helping me' from a child who was terrified of staying away but managed it, the whole experience was absolutely worthwhile and I am very, very happy.

I know, as a parent, that the whole focus on the return of my children is gladness for their safety, and a wish to find out all about what they have experienced. In that focus, it may be that a 'thank you' to the teacher might be forgotten - and that is as it should be. It doesn't mean that the parents or children are ungrateful - just that their focus on reunion is on each other, not on me