Aibu to feel sad that welsh is not compulsory in schools in Wales .

[Dowser]

Says it all really.

It's part of the heritage and it's a worry it will die out.

Don't understand it myself.

Is it that they just want a child to reach GCSe with it.

I wanted to do French A level but it clashed with biology that I really wanted to do so I didn't get to do it.

Might have ended up fluent if I had.

Well, as a result of this thread I have just been on Amazon Marketplace and bought a Teach Yourself Welsh book, despite the fact that I live in North East England. I've always wanted to learn a language and thanks to freeview I'll at least have a chance to watch the news and other things in the lingo so I'd been thinking about giving Welsh a go anyway.

Not sure when I'll find the time to learn, but hey, you never know. :)

I haven't read the whole thread yet but with regard to self reporting surveys of adults' Welsh language proficiency I would be a bit cautious about taking results at face value.

I am sure there is plenty of room for improvement but lots of fairly proficient Welsh speakers are reluctant to describe themselves as such. I can hear my uncle now saying, "Well, see, no, I wouldn't describe myself as a Welsh speaker. I get by, but I'm not fluent.". His Welsh isn't as good as my aunt's but they did manage to raise two DCs exclusively in Welsh until they went to school.

I am not sure why so many people who are actually pretty good are reluctant to describe themselves as Welsh speakers and whether this is particular to the part of Wales my family is from, but it seems sad to me that people lack confidence like that.

I agree with alteredimage regarding self-assessment of fluency etc. I would guess that the vast majority of people educated in Wales during the last 30-40 years understand (and can speak) more than basic Welsh. Whether they will speak it (or admit to it) is another thing. I suspect if push came to shove and they needed to make themselves understood for any reason they could. I know of a number of families where grandparent have recently discovered long lost Welsh language skills to communicate with their grandchildren! Certainly when I was in school in the 90s it would be unusual for children to leave primary school in west wales (assuming they had been educated there from infancy) without pretty much fluency. Sadly the language skills were often not pursued at secondary level (at least not at the correct level - basically it was far too easy!) leading to loss of confidence and skill.

altered my mother was like that. She had great Welsh but lost confidence speaking it. I think there are many people like this, particularly in areas where English has taken over due to heavy industrialization.

I also believe that, in an age of political correctness gone crazy, that Welsh is an easy target and that, amongst certain people, there is a sense of unease with the fact that there is an indigenous language that is official and thriving that isn't English being spoken widely in mainland Britain.

I think school policy varies from school to school with number of GCSEs. Moomin was saying she did 13.
I did 10 and that includes Welsh literature and Welsh language, those who were in lower sets for Welsh only studied Welsh language So presumably did 9.

my DD does English Maths Welsh Science as her core subjects.
Plus Art, Engineering.....and she dropped History.
So that is 6. Mind you she is not considered to be 'bright' unlike every other child on MN. lol.

oh English might be 2 so that would make it 7

Yes Sunny English is probably language and literature and science could be a double or triple award.

i was brought up in n wales. had to do welsh to o level (long time ago) we could then choose welsh as second language or welsh as foreign language. the latter was "easier". age 11 i was doing really well and my team came second in national second language book quiz...after o level i lost most of it...teacher was young and inexperienced and could not control the class... however when i go back now to visit parents i notice a lot more Welsh is spoken in shops, on buses etc. welsh language channel 4 S4C has a lot to do with accessibility of the language today. mine is limited to bore da sadly

I'm quite interested in how Welsh is viewed by teenagers. In my experience they tend to drop Welsh outside of school as it's not considered "cool" (at least in these parts), even though they are perfectly competent.

my DS16 is obsessed by it and talks to me in Welsh non stop.

I did the separate sciences, so three GCSEs one each in Chem, Physics and Biology. Did Maths a year early so got to do Psychology GCSE. One option was a double award. Welsh language and literature, plus English Language and literature, and then two other options (one other language, and music). 13 GCSEs (plus Welsh Bacc Intermediate)

I am not sure why so many people who are actually pretty good are reluctant to describe themselves as Welsh speakers and whether this is particular to the part of Wales my family is from, but it seems sad to me that people lack confidence like that.

General second/third/nth language thing. Which may be actually a subset of the Dunning-Kruger Effect, although I always think of it as a Language Thing.

My Dh is from South Wales, no welsh spoken in the family nor the local community. Coming from North Wales it does seem very different.

My welsh speaking sisters both tell my DH that he is not proper welsh as he does not speak welsh. It is half teasing and half serious, an argument that happens whenever he sees them. He sees no reason to speak welsh and his family has never been welsh speaking. They do not even have welsh names.

I used to speak welsh at primary school, but moved to England and lost it, though I could still understand my father when he spoke welsh to me. Wish I had kept up my welsh.

Just to pick up on a point raised eons ago about it being 'unfair' to children with SEN to have Welsh medium education. my son has SEN, severe dyslexia and a specific language impairment among those issues and the fact he is bilingual is a great help. Welsh is far easier for dyslexic kids as its very phonetic in its spelling. So it's a not always or even likely to be a disadvantage to kids with SEN.

I agree that welsh spelling and pronounciation is much easier than English. And I love my dds first attempts at English spelling, as they are all phonetic in the welsh way.
dd2's Christmas list a year ago had
"A abslwtlu spaclu dres" (u in welsh makes an ee sound)

I think I would be OK with WM at primary level, IF I was going to stay in Wales permanently, but would probably want my child in EM by secondary.

Then again, education in Wales is supposed to be kind of weak in general, so maybe we'd do private education or HE if we lived in Wales.

Sirvix. I chuckled at your daughters spelling.

Esperanto is phonetic based also.

I love their Welsh spelling of English words. Now she is reading in English as well as welsh it doesn't happen, and she has excellent spelling skills in both languages so it clearly hasn't been a hindrance.
Dowser my Dad used to laugh about the Esperanto words for different sorts of kisses. He thought that was wonderful. I think he started learning it in the late 50s or very early 60s. I do think that for him, growing up bilingual gave him an interest and pleasure in words. As you do, he found other languages fascinating. He did latin at school, but learned some German as an adult and then the Russian, as well as Esperanto.