about disability and MN?

[MarvellousMarbles]

This is a TAAT, sorry. Actually it's about many, many threads, but the one that triggered it was the current one about being annoyed at people faffing at the front of supermarket queues.

It's such a common occurrence on threads like this for people to point out that the situation the OP objects to can often be caused by disabilities. Cue lots of irritable posts from lots of posters that 'we weren't talking about people with disabilities' and 'of course I don't mean people with disabilities' etc. Sometimes they're meant kindly, sometimes they're quite unpleasant (with talk of 'the professionally offended' and the like.

Sometimes it makes me want to scream that the world is NOT a place filled with "normal non-disabled people" and a few "disabled people" on the fringes. There are millions of people with disabilities in this world, all trying to go about their daily business. In fact, everybody in this world has a range of physical and mental capabilities - we are all on a continuum.

So, when people with disabilities post on a thread, please don't cut us off with a breezy 'oh we don't mean you'. Our experiences are just as valid as anyone else's, we are part of the general public milling around that you meet every day (though you may have no idea about our disabilities). We are not 'extreme cases' or 'unlikely scenarios'. MN should be a place for everyone, not just those above a certain cut-off point on the capability continuum.

AIBU?

Yanbu. It is annoying that mentioning disability is seen as spoiling a discussion. Or because someone they know doesn't behave in a certain way then everyone else with a disability must be doing it on purpose.

I luffs you. I posted on that thread. I am one of the professionally offended because I have a dh with disabilities and three dc with disabilities.

Totally agree OP. Very well said.

I also want to add that one of the glorious things about disability, whether it's your own or that of somebody you love is that it teaches you patience and tolerance (there is always the odd exception though).
A health professional once said to me that my dc will benefit in the long term from having a dDad with a disability. That isn't always easy to accept but I think it's true and I have often been told how thoughtful and caring my DS are (even the teenager) which I attribute to their experiences with their dad.

YANBU

YANBU - I completely agree

yeah - yanbu - it's really frustrating

ditto the fucking pedantry threads about spelling - I have a learning disability and although I have a well developed fuck it attitude those threads take me right back to being a 'thicko' at school

and can we include illness - if my shoulder flairs up I find packing shopping and sorting my purse out really sore - and I go slower

YASOOOOOOOOOOOOOONBU

I agree.

My DC has had some SENs (but has progressed so the level of 'need' has gone from severe to not needing hardly any additional support.) I hate it, when talking about educational and school policies, people saying 'barring SENs/SNs', as children that have some form of SEN/SN in their school careers form a significant proportion of children. They should not be treated as exceptions, they should be included in the discussion. That is what being inclusive is about.

I agree.

I would say though that I am weary of disability being raised whenever there is a discussion about anything that constitutes poor behaviour and it's becoming a double edged sword.

Sometimes people are just being dicks and explaining dickish behaviour with 'but he/she might have an invisible disability ' is inextricably linking the dickish and the disabled.
I wish sometimes people would just say 'yep, probably being a knobber'

What winds me up is the massive hoops that disabled people have to jump through just to be treated like everyone else - see my thread about my son being denied a school place. Some people seem to act like I'm sooooo unreasonable to expect a school to make some minor changes to allow him to access an education like every other child 'oh it's really difficult to do x y z'. Tough shit, do it anyway.

Same with buses and wheelchair etc. Disabled people campaigned for special places so they are able to access public transport like everyone else and then get told they can't use it and must wait because a mum with her pfb can't be arsed to fold her pushchair/bought a huge tank that is a faff to fold.

Tbf attitudes are changing and people are becoming more aware but the golden rule is 'would you treat someone without a disability like this?' If the answer is no, don't do it.

its a double edged sword with a massive sharp side and one that might cut paper but thats about it though, tbh.

Of course the problem is way more on one side than the other.

But as my son is now an adult, seeing selfishness, aggression, rudeness, bullying, sexual harassment and various other things discussed against a background of 'but perhaps he has ASD/aspergers/SN is depressing .

oh yes totally agree with this. In fact I was arguing this same thing recently.

Both are wrong.

wonder what the solution is?

The solution? Treat people as individuals and continually readjust your expectations of people.

I dont think people with kids with ASD tend to point out the possibility in children they see described on here unless they see actual red flags other than a bit of aggression..ie a child who has huge screaming meltdowns in class at age 8, iyswim though.

which is a bit different to the thread where it was claimed that all people with poor social skills are leering perverts.

yes that would be lovely capsium.

Treat people as individuals and continually readjust your expectations of people.

What a wonderful post - capsium.

That should be everyones' motto.

I agree with pagwatch my son has asd and learning difficulties and his behaviour can be challenging because of this but sometimes bad behaviour is just that !

YANBU.

I wonder about this all the time.

Say you need 10 particular "symptoms" to be diagnosed with ASD. A person with 10 (and a subsequent diagnosis) cannot be judged for their social behaviour. A person with 9, however, is totally fair game.

Solution? I agree with capsicum. Basically, it's stop judging. Full stop.

But then AIBU would dry up in a day.

I don't know tbh.

I walk through life observing the behaviour of others and I may privately believe someone is being a dick but I always act upon the assumption that there may be a cause for their behaviour.

If I'm out with Ds and he is slowing people up I don't feel embaressed or rush him but I do have some understanding that the people behind me are waiting and that may be irksome.

The trouble is the extreme responses on here make it hard to convey anything moderately. Obviously

I'm sorry. I'm knackered and gibbering this morning.
I know what I mean. I think

Yanbu.

But at the same time, I'm equally tired of people deciding someone must have mental health problems or "be mental" because they behave badly. Some people are just twats.

I hear ya. Sometimes all I can say is aaargh

No I know Fanjo.
But I think posters with no experience of ASD etc are kind of trying to be open minded and think that saying 'oh but there may be invisible disabilities' is a positive/support thing.
Add to that those who mix up understanding a behaviour with excusing a behaviour. It is just complicated and, again, the extreme view on here make finding a way through difficult.

It might just be me though. I need coffee.

X-posted.

Aargh cover it.