Teachers lying

[Fmarf]

Is it ok for teachers to tell a lie which upsets children for the sake of a creative writing exercise and not reveal the lie until the following day?

This again??

I agree, BarbarianMum. someone simply cannot create a little bubble of a world for children where nobody ever tells a lie ever under any circumstances and they'd be doing a child a massive disservice if they did!

People lie. People lie for lots of different reasons. Children do better to learn that and to understand when it's ok to lie (yes grandma thank you I love my present) and when it's not ok to lie (no I did not take that £20 from your purse...) than to grow up with this belief that people don't lie.

That makes them vulnerable, apart from anything else. You need to understand this very basic human behaviour. To know what is a lie and what isn't, even if it isn't the truth.

God, can you imagine if we all only ever told the truth to everyone at all times

I'm shocked that so many don't have a problem with this.
My issue is not that the teachers lied, but that the lie was specifically told to upset the children. Deeply, deeply, unethical.
Totally different to Santa, fairy stories etc. because those lies are not intended to upset children.

Imagine if, before the next inspection, ofsted told the teachers that anyone not delivering an outstanding lesson would be fired on the spot. Teachers would be beside themselves with stress and put everything they had into giving an amazing lesson for the inspection.
After the inspection, the teachers would be told that it was made up just to get the best out of them.
Would that be ok?
I don't think so.

The nursery I volunteer in has a class bear. The bear falls asleep where he shouldn't and the children have to listen for his snores to find him. He's been photographed holidaying all over the world on the weeks the children can't take him home (school holidays, funnily enough). He eats the teacher's biscuits and the children have to think about how that makes the teacher feel. He chooses the children who have impressed him most that week and they get a chance to take him home. He likes to peep out of his bag to see which children are being kind to their friends.

Damn lies, the lot of it. I should write to the governors.

I doubt that many children were upset - most will be indignant and eager to stop the development (which is the point). Not like they bring a bulldozer in and start razing the climbing frame.

I think the problem is that no matter what your view is on the actual lie, the school have apologised and agreed to change procedures, WHY is that not enough for you? I'd be pretty impressed if a school handled a complaint that seriously, what more do you actually want?

For what it's worth, my head did this when I was in Primary, came in and told us very sternly that because we'd complained so much about homework, the governors had decided to abolish it, but make the school day 3 hours longer to make up for it, we wrote letters and has clad discussions and I remember it fondly, it was funny when they revealed the truth, nobody was traumatised or upset, just a bit embarrassed that we'd believed it, to this day I still think of the school and that head fondly.

Are you going to keep starting threads till the majority agree with you?

But the difference in what's ok and what isn't is the intended emotional response in the children.

I'm a teacher and have "lied" many times to my classes as part of engaging them with the lesson. I would never tell a lie that would cause upset. Teddy going on holiday is not likely to upset anyone and that is why it's ok.

Tychos, as I understand it, the children were told some of the school playing fields were being sold off. Hardly devastating news. I doubt any of them were particularly upset.

I too doubt the children were upset. Outraged and jolted into action, perhaps, but I can't imagine it would have been a traumatic experience.

Tychos you need to read the other thread. It was not told to upset the children, it was to give them a reason to do some creative writing!

The reason was Asda was buying half the school playground and write to them to tell them not to! What child would actually get upset about that?!

Ok sorry didn't realise it was about playing fields.

OP, you need to get real. This is a total non issue.

I feel sorry for the Head in this instance having a loony parent haranguing them over something desperately unimportant.

Move on...

Children love exercises like this. It stimulates their ability to do persuasive writing which can often be as dry as dust. Unfortunately, OP, if you are genuinely outraged and still have a grudge against the school then maybe you should change schools.

I suppose it depends on the level of drama and subject matter? The David Brent sort of personality who gets carried away and misjudges the mood would probably make a hash of it. Otherwise for engaging interest and sparking imagination it could be of use.

My primary school HT held his audience captivated with far fetched tales one assmbly at the end of every term. Nothing he judged traumatic. 40+ years' ago and still makes me smile.

Have seen the other thread. I don't think there's a limit on how many threads a MNer can start on the same topic but do yourself a favour. Time to let this go OP.

Woah just read the other thread. Seriously - Let. It. Go.

You have also ensured that for your children's remaining time at that school, in every class handover conversation when they go down the list and get to your kids it will go:

'Right yes now X. Lovely child, quite bright, but you know the batshit crazy' playing fields lady, yeah it's her^ child. Good luck.'

Italics fail!

Oh, gawd...

OP, where do you draw the line? Exercises like this really engage children and get them thinking and working in a way which "normal" exercises don't. There have been some fabulous ones I've heard about over the years, including alien kidnap, monster footprints being found in the car park, dinosaur bones, the school being sold, students having to do extra hours, loads of things.

If you don't think teachers should EVER lie, what about "Miss, isn't this drawing brilliant?" "Why, no, Timothy, your drawing of a house just looks like a red scrawl on the page - I mean, where on earth are walls or windows or anything else?! Silly boy!" Or Santa, the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy, magic, make believe - even religion?

They've highlighted they should have told the parents quicker but this would be the only (if any) criticism I think any sane person would have

We had a situation in an English class when I was in secondary - probably late 70's. The class teacher came into the room and calmly announced that a nuclear attack had been launched against the UK. She then left the room. None of us moved. We all believed her and we were terrified - remember this was the 70's when the Cold War was at it's most bitter. She came back in the room 5 minutes later and said it was an exercise and we were to write an essay about how we felt.

One parent complained.

I often wonder what the teacher would have done if we'd all run screaming.....

So, to be honest, I don't think the scenario you describe is particularly bad and the 'lying' thing - meh. But they probably should have told the class after the lesson to stop parents taking umbrage.

Actually apin I think Iwould go batshit crazy about that. Although my children of the new Millennium are more scared of a zombie apocalypse than of nuclear war

Whether they should or shouldn't the one thing clear was that it was 14 months ago and you should move on and forget.

Why do they need to lie? When I was at school we were told to imagine a similar scenario and write letters about it, why not just do that?!

This is a wind up?
I cannot believe any parent would make themselves look so foolish and petty.

Your kids must be mortified ,OP. And a year on from the event.

Whatever about a moment of madness. I am finding it hard to believe anyone would get upset about this.

For what it's worth I think it was a good way to evoke a heartfelt response from the kids. But of course these days little darlings cannot be even the tiniest bit upset about anything.

OP, genuinely, I would consider speaking to someone professionally. If this has been bothering you for over a year, I think you have a problem. In life, people will disagree or over rule your decisons. Your reaction to this is not logical or rational. If you are worried about the example being set to your DC by lying, you should also be concerned by your own obsessive behaviour and refusal to accept other people's decisions.

Oh my God. You are being ridiculous.

Omg you are overreacting.
Why another thread? Is it because you didn't get a lot of people agreeing with you on the other?
It's a good way of encouraging creative writing.
Asking kids to just imagine doesn't work for all kids!
Let it go, seriously.