To wonder why being bright seems to be frowned upon?

[OhFlippityBolax]

Back in the dark ages of my time at primary school, you had to hide the fact you were bright and often had to 'play dumb' to fit in with other kids.

I'm noticing this with my own dc. They're very academic, arty children but again they almost have to 'hide' it and one has even asked the teacher outright to stop calling on them in class to answer questions because the other kids rib them so much in the playground about their general knowledge.

Also watching this programme on channel 5 about the huge primary school, the poor girl being picked on for being studious

Is it universal? Is it something you've seen at school? Why is it we are so anti academic kids?

I work in the public sector and there is an underlying anti-intellectualism and reverse snobbery from a significant minority. It's tiresome.

I refuse to alter who I am to make someone else feel better, however.

Yes I have noticed this weird trend for women to act thick. I have two relatives who do this and they are not young. Its their default setting-"oh you know me I'm a bit thick (giggle)/oh I don't understand anything me (said in a stupid voice)". God I hate it-it's so not how I was raised!

I don't think it's frowned upon. It's more about jealousy. Talking from experience, I was had to stay strong and learn to ignore what other people thought of me. It helps a lot when people fire jokes and nasty comments because your the only one who finished homework for example.
People always tried to bully me but they never got their way.
I would talk to every one but kept my distance with a lot of them for my own security.
I knew how to fight back with words and when someone pissed me off they would all keep their distance.
I would say that I came out of school without being bullied .

I had a friend who was bullied because she was from poor war torn African country but she was very clever. The girls in year 9 where horrible. No one would sit next to her. They would say things like you should be nice to us because we donate £5 your country.
The teachers loved her. It was great when she was the only one to go to Cambridge from the school in over five years.

It depends which school you are at.

The schools I went to, you were ridiculed if you opened a book. Very low aspirations.

Dd goes to a school that is the exact opposite. (Prime motivator in choosing to move here.)

Not my experience at all - from my schooling (way back in the dark ages), from my dcs' schooling (this century ) , or from my teaching experience over a lot of years.

It's not universal, you should come to Asia, being academic is the ONLY thing that matters. You and your kids would love it OP.

Exactly the same experience as QT. I was bullied for being bright, DC1 is in a private international school and brightness is actually respected.

It's British anti-intellectualism at its finest. Apparently, there is no equivalent to the saying "too clever by half" (or "too clever for his own good") in any other language.

Oh yeah, the old "too clever by half" putdown. I was mocked by own family as a child because I was a voracious reader and was accused of reading books I couldn't understand just to show off. I grew up in a very working class environment where reading was considered indulgent and pretentious.
I seem to remember it being more from home than school, though.
My dc have had a very different experience, the bright kids were the cool ones.

I went to a huge primary school where the vast majority of kids weren't interested in academic achievement. I was always one of the small handful who wanted to do well, who wanted to get high marks. And frankly, my social skills probably weren't great, and nor was my confidence. But I have no recollection of ever being teased or bullied about it. Maybe it's because they weren't jealous because they didn't think it was a big deal?

Then at the secondary school I went to, academic achievement was everything. You were a worthless nobody if you weren't a high achiever.

So it was a huge shock to me when I grew up and entered the world of employment and discovered that people sneer at you for having gone to university, sneer at you for being bright, or ambitious. It's just a relentless assault of 'ooh, so you think you're better than everyone else?'

But surely 'too clever by half' is a reference to arrogance and over-confidence rather than actual intelligence?

I am thinking of someone I know, and that phrase suits him perfectly - he's a smug git who acts superior and thinks he's always right.

IME genuine, quiet ability and aptitude is rarely mocked.

School bullies will seek out any difference and use it - too clever, too stupid, overweight, glasses - particularly once they see results.

People angst endlessly about their bright child being bullied. In my experience you are a bloody sight more likely to be bullied for being "thick" than being clever. And be much less able to deal with it. And, sadly, often less likely to have parents with the confidence and knowledge to go into bat for them effectively.

I absolutely agree with Hakluyt.

Children with SEN are twice as likely to be bullied than their peers according to research. There's been lots of info about that issue in the media lately.

Of course it happens that those with SEN get bullied, that's not in question, but it's not an either/or type situation. I dont think it necessarily follows that bring academically able means you are any better equipped to deal with bullying either. My son has SEN and his peers have been nothing other than wonderful towards him, that may be because he's less socially awkward than I was possibly. The bullying I suffered destroyed my self esteem, I was 'clever' but also extremely sensitive.

At my DS's old primary (demographic of low-income inner-city kids, 70% free school meals, etc), there wasn't any discrimination against bright kids at all. There were a couple of really extraordinarily stratospherically clever kids, too (not mine, though he did well enough), and their abilities were admired and wondered at by the other kids.

I think that any child who is not at the same level as their peers for any reason is at danger of being bullied in a school where the ethos is askew.

My 4 kids have never come across this at all

Completely agree with Hak

One secondary school I went to was like this. I only attended for a year - but it was a nightmare - anyone that did well in exams or tests was called a swot. A swot was the worst thing you could be.

We moved after that, and I went to a grammar school, which was completely different- people were competitive about doing well academically.

Gosh, for a few yrs in primary school I was bullied mercilessly for everything but being clever.

I think it depends a lot on the teachers and school in general.

When I was in Year 1 in school, we used to have a weekly spelling test. There was one list for the class, and a copy of the weekly Year 6 spelling test for me. So it use to go - 'class, your word is HOUSE. Annie, yours is 'ENVIRONMENTAL'. It definitely wasn't something for me to be proud of, and I spent much of my time creeping around feeling mortified and being ignored by my classmates. BUT that was down to the teacher and handled in a different way would have gotten me less beatings resulted in a better outcome.

I had figured out by the time I was part way through 1st year Infants (now it'd be "reception class") that knowing the answers and being good at my work lead to a hellish playtime.

My mother had complaints from the teacher "I KNOW she knows the answers, but won't put her hand up for anything!"

By the equivalent of Year 1 I was pretending to find my work harder so I was moved down out of the "group" I was in (only me) to the next one down (with 6 others) so I didn't get so much picking on.

it's nothing new. My son is following my pattern - his reception teacher commented a few days ago at parents' evening that "he won't put his hand up or offer suggestions unless I ask him directly"

This is why I strongly considered homeschooling him.

I got that, even at a grammar school. Going to a high ranking university was such an amazing shock - suddenly library time made you cool, and the students who went out too much instead of working were viewed as sad and immature. I used to love telling the sixth formers that at open day, the look of 'wow, I've suddenly found where I want to be. No one's ever going to yell boffine after me in the corridor again' on their faces was wonderful

I think it's really important, too, not to project your own experiences onto your kids. I posted upthread about how at my DS's old inner-city, poor primary, being bright is something to admire. Back in the day at my suburban secondary, being in the top stream was social death, and I hated it. I am so glad my DS has never had to listen to "brainy" chanted as an insult.