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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To find it odd caffcass want to speak with 3yr old alone?

75 replies

AJNH · 14/02/2015 00:53

Mainly posting here for traffic, but feel free to tell me I'm being unreasonable (hides!!!)

Ok, so going through courts with 3yr old dd (4 in April) because her absent father has now decided he'd like to be involved. To cut a long story short mine and ExPs relationship was awful and DV took place on his part, as did heavy alcohol consumption and drug use. He was later sectioned after a case of battery (not to me) took place under the mental health act. I couldn't cope and he made my life HELL! So new DP, DD and I moved away.

First hearing has taken place, all went in my favour, spoke to my caffcass reporter today who made an appointment for me to take dd into their office, upon that she told me that she would be taking dd off separately to speak to her and that she would be bringing biological father up with her then. Now Dd has no memory of bio dad, no real understanding(tender age of 3!) and calls my dp daddy (he has brought her up with me from 8months old so understandable). We also have a DC together btw and the 4 of us super close.

So at her age and the fact she simply will not understand I don't really understand myself the reasoning for this 'secret' disscussion. dd is also shy with strangers so I doubt she'll say much anyone.

Ahhhhh, sorry it's so late, I can't sleep, my minds just going over a million things and worrying about poor dd

OP posts:

Original poster

AJNH · 14/02/2015 00:56

Sorry for the couple of typo's, I'm on my phone!

OP posts:

TendonQueen · 14/02/2015 00:57

Can't really help but totally understand why you are worried. So much disruption for your DD. What sort of access is he asking for?

FarelyKnuts · 14/02/2015 01:00

What are you concerned will happen?
Your caffcass reporter has said she will be speaking to your DD about her bio dad yes? Have you never mentioned him to her yourself before?

Original poster

AJNH · 14/02/2015 01:09

ExP has unrealistic goals, he asked to have her every other weekend back where he lives over 200miles away. and thought I was wrong for not agreeing this. He doesn't understand that he can't just pick her up nearly 4 yrs down the line now that he thinks he wants to be a part in her life.

No I haven't ever mentioned him to dd, he had lots of chances to be 'daddy' when she was a baby and he wasn't interested and subsequently rarely turned up for his visits.

My concerns are that caffcass tell her about him, then again he will let her down just like he used too. She's happy and settled and I can see her being dragged through the mill then thrown back out by him.

I just don't feel like anyone is actually looking at dd and thinking how this is going to impact on her.

OP posts:

BottleBeach · 14/02/2015 01:10

YANBU. That sounds very unusual. Have the risk issues relating to DV, substance misuse and mental health been assessed?

Has she visited you at home, or would this be the first time your DD would have met her?

Has she shared her case plan with you?

Original poster

AJNH · 14/02/2015 01:17

All his..let's call them 'issues' are undergoing assessment in time for the next hearing, this would be to include :- drugs testing through hair analysis, liver function testing, a letter from his current mental health nurse, his full medical history, a CRB check and an extensive police report.

This will be the first time dd meets with caffcass, I've only spoken to them over the phone myself.

Have not heard of any care plan as of yet.

Sorry for the way I'm typing, trying to answer all questions and my heart feels like it's gunna jump out my chest!

OP posts:

Original poster

AJNH · 14/02/2015 01:18

RE the DV, he is denying this ever took place and there are only a few accounts of me calling the police. So that's pretty much his word against mine.

OP posts:

BottleBeach · 14/02/2015 01:25

Not care plan, case plan. She should be able to talk to you about her plan for the work she's doing. How long is it until the next hearing? Could you argue that any work with you DD should wait until you have the results of the drug testing etc?

BottleBeach · 14/02/2015 01:28

It also sounds unusual for her to be meeting with your DD without having had a face to face meeting with you.

Original poster

AJNH · 14/02/2015 01:29

Oh I see, we haven't spoken about anything really, the caffcass woman just asked how dd was and wanted to make a date for us to meet. The caffcass meeting in a couple of weeks before the next hearing so hopefully most of the results for ExP's testing will be back by then?!

OP posts:

Original poster

AJNH · 14/02/2015 01:31

I'm just finding the whole thing weird tbh bottle. I'd assume she will speak with me before she takes dd off?! But no mention of that as of yet.

OP posts:

BottleBeach · 14/02/2015 01:43

From what you've said about the history it sounds as though you would want the opportunity to talk with her out of your daughter's hearing though?

I'm sorry, I really need to go to bed. Please try not to worry. Don't be afraid to keep asking questions until you're happy you understand what she's doing and why she's doing it.

skylark2 · 14/02/2015 08:46

"she told me that she would be taking dd off separately to speak to her"

So an adult who you don't know and your DD doesn't know will be taking a 3 year old off separately? Just her and the child?

That can't be right, surely. There must be another person present for child protection reasons. (Unless it's something like a situation where they have glass fronted offices and people outside?)

TBH I don't think you need to worry about what your DD is and isn't capable of saying about your ex. She doesn't remember him so isn't going to be distressed by memories. They'll have a quick chat about daddy and it's be instantly obvious she means your DP. I'd suspect that what they're wondering is whether she's been told your ex exists.

Not sure why she would be "poor DD" for spending five minutes probably playing with some fun toys with a couple of nice ladies. They're not going to grill her about something which happened before she was 1, or make her go with them if she's distressed.

StarOnTheTree · 14/02/2015 09:35

If I was you OP I wouldn't let the Cafcass officer speak to your DD at all. I don't think there's anything she can do about you refusing. In fact I would make sure that she's not even in the house. But I would let your DD know that your DP isn't her biological father though at this age she's likely just to accept it as fact without it having any bearing on her existing life.

I wouldn't agree to any sort of contact happening until your DD is old enough to ask for herself, though the courts could over rule that. It doesn't sound like your ex being part of your DD's life will benefit her in any way. I know people will say that your ex has a right to see her and your DD has a right to have a relationship with him (which doesn't sound like it would be safe or positive anyway) but all I can see is a happy little girl who is secure and safe in her lovely little family who might have her life disrupted and be potentially be at risk.

BonzoDooDah · 14/02/2015 09:59

I wouldn't let the cafcas person talk to your dd. She's too little to make any judgement and can't remember him. Nothing of benefit to her could come out of the meeting.
I would tell then you are going to wait for the drug and MH results, then fight bloody everything due to the violence issues. They /he have to prove your dd would be safe with him not any other way around.
Good luck, sounds stressful.

StarOnTheTree · 14/02/2015 10:04

I agree with Bonzo that there is no benefit to her talking to your DD. To be fair it's probably a standard thing that they do and the officer needs to tick that box on her form. I don't think she'll be at all bothered about not talking to your DD once you've explained why.

maddening · 14/02/2015 10:08

Can you ask your solicitor about your parental right to be at the cafcass meeting with your dd given her age - older I would understand but a 3 year old's understanding of the world and conversations is totally different to a 6 year olds.

My 4 year old makes up stories about things we have done to my face - his understanding of imaginary / real seems quite fluid imo

thecatfromjapan · 14/02/2015 10:08

I'm also a bit at the 'cafcass officer will take dd off alone'. I'm really not sure they're allowed to do that.
Can you get clarification on that, for a start?

PeruvianFoodLover · 14/02/2015 10:09

So an adult who you don't know and your DD doesn't know will be taking a 3 year old off separately? Just her and the child?

That can't be right, surely. There must be another person present for child protection reasons. (Unless it's something like a situation where they have glass fronted offices and people outside?)

CAFCASS officers are qualified social workers. They don't have to be chaperoned with DCs. Neither do teachers, nursery workers etc.

TeenAndTween · 14/02/2015 10:15

No experience of this, but some experience of SWs via adoption.

I would imagine they might ask her thing along the lines of

is she aware she has a birth father as well as Daddy
can she remember anything about him
does she want to spend any time with him

At nearly 4 she should know that Daddy is not her birth father, even if she says she can't remember him and is happy as she is. It is about taking the wants and needs of the child into account, without her feeling obliged to say what Mummy wants her to say.

The SWs talked to my under 3 year old when placed to check she was OK.

GatoradeMeBitch · 14/02/2015 11:59

OP, ask the CAFCASS officer before the meeting if they will ask your dd about her biological father. If they are intent on doing that, you should really explain it to her yourself. I wouldn't have wanted that info to come from a stranger.

I don't agree that she should already know. Why unnecessarily upset her when she has a Dad at home? I didn't know I had a biological father until I was nine. And I didn't want to know it when I was told, I had a bond with my 'step'dad. It's such a shame that her absent DF can just come along with all his worrying issues and decide he has a right to play happy families with a child who doesn't know him. What about what's right for her?

danceponydance · 14/02/2015 12:07

Yabu You really need to post this in legal if you want advice on what the process is. Cafcass officers are social workers and speak to children on their own so that they are not influenced by the resident parent when answering questions about the non resident parent. Your dd will be asked age appropriate questions about the situation.

It is not advisable to refuse to let the Cafcass officer speak to your dd, they are Court appointed officers and you will be viewed very badly by the judge if you refuse to comply with the court ordered cafcass process.

KnittedJimmyChoos · 14/02/2015 12:22

Can you refuse?

Leading questions not being able to interpret 3 year old...

HOW CAN they ask a 3 year old questions about a man she does not know?

what would they ask ?

Do you want to see this man - show a picture she says Yes...thinking thats what she is supposed to say? The picture could be of anyone, hannibal lector?

FarelyKnuts · 14/02/2015 12:23

Caffcass officers are interested in what is in the best interests of your child. They aren't going to try to interrogate a 3yo, not do they need to be "supervised", as someone suggested up thread, to speak to your child on their own.
Possibly the rain for speaking to her on her own is to make sure she hasn't been coached to say anything or not to speak etc.
If your ex is looking to have access with your DD then she needs to know he exists and presumably the caffcass officer is trying to ascertain her level of understanding and development to see what would be most beneficial to her.
They are not the enemy.

KnittedJimmyChoos · 14/02/2015 12:23

YY GatoradeMeBitch Sat 14-Feb-15 11:59:02

so selfish

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