To feel we are all a little bit too obsessed with education and school?

[TheOddity]

I've seen threads recently about people remortgaging their house for private education, teachers publicly shamed in front of their peers for results beyond their control, people moving house to be nearer a good nursery, and on and on.
I recently moved to another country in Europe. I asked my new neighbour what the local nursery was like as that's where we intended to send our son. They said "it's very close and convenient". My spidey senses were tingling, did this mean it was a failing nursery? Next I go to the first parents' meeting. Not a word was spoken about targets, the curriculum etc. it was all about food and naps. In the end section for questions, the questions parents asked were about.....food and naps! He is there now for half a year, it's fine, And hopefully sometimes he is learning. There is one secondary school nearby so everyone goes there and again, it's fine. I am not overly worried my son will fail, because he is bright and I will help him.
I just think, are we all insane in the UK? Is it worth the stress? At the end of the day, if you are worried enough about them to remortgage your house, surely you could just do a bit of homework with them each night and it will all turn out ok? AIBU to think that school is all a bit out of proportion and life is pretty unpredictable unless your parents already own a fortune?

[TheWordFactory]

Well here's the thing OP.

In the 70s and 80s many (most?) parents didn't sweat about where their DC went to school, or get involved in educational policy etc...

And schools were generally shit.

The majority of DC left school at 16 with barely a qualification, without any knowledge of the arts, or languages or anything much.

There are still countries where the majority of parents don't sweat about their DC's schools and education. I don't want to live there.

[Madagascanparadise]

I understand the feeling of not having a choice being easier in a way but it would worry me that no-one else at your local school seems concerned either. Competition does generally improve standards in pretty much everything.

I agree that in the UK we are obsessed though to an unhealthy degree. I went to an all girls grammar school and don't even remember taking the 11+ let alone being tutored, it just wasn't a huge issue back then (1980's).

[Bonsoir]

I am a child of the 60s and 70s and there was an awful lot of ambient sweating about where DC went to school: 4+, 7+, 11+, CE, anxiety about comprehensives, positioning for grammar schools, house buying in catchment. More people are up to it these days but it wasn't a nascent preoccupation in my generation.

[KnittedJimmyChoos]

It looks really battered! But honestly there is no outrage, no hand wringing about it

I was addressing op, and op ^ isnt bothered by it and neither are the schools parents.

[TheWordFactory]

A very small minority bonsoir

Most schools had become comprehensive. Most parents just sent their DC where they were told.

And many of those schools were rubbish

[meddie]

I beggared myself to give my children a good education, not through any overt competitiveness but because my own schooling was appalling.
I was bright, IQ tested at 140+ reading age of 16+ at 9, excelling at maths at primary.

Moved to local comprehensive by parents who really didn't care what school we went to just as long as it was close and didn't cause them any inconvenience.they weren't interested in whether we had homework or how we were doing, school was full of bullying, bad behaviour and a general attitude that learning sucked and anyone who did well in exams was a swot and was bullied and ostracised for it.

My secondary education was horrible, as a bright child I struggled to get anything remotely meaningful out of it. Spent years deliberately answering questions wrong in term exams just so I wouldn't stand out and be a target. fortunately not stupid enough to do that at O level as I knew I was out of there following those exam results and my life wouldn't be made a misery.

To this day I still feel robbed of a decent education and went back to study as a mature student, I was determined that I would give my children the best I could afford for them, even if it meant I wore charity clothes for years and drove a banger, I have never regretted that decision and they are doing well for it. I just wanted my children to value education and to be in a school that also had these values, not a school where their education would be disrupted by lack of funds, disinterested staff and other childrens poor behaviour.

[Bonsoir]

There were still lots of direct grant (state scholarships) places to private schools and all sorts of boarding school angst that have subsided (far fewer boarders now). Gabbitas Thring was a thriving business.

[Bonsoir]

I was at private preps in the 60s and 70s and they were frequented by the children of people in the army, the children of farmers, of country solicitors as well as of City lawyers/bankers and publishers.

Different population in part to now but private education was less fancy, more accessible and a real choice - lots of switching between private and state.

[Goldmandra]

My DD1 went to our catchment rural high school which is, apparently, outstanding according to Ofsted. Estate agents highlight houses which are in its catchment and people from nearby towns drive their children out to it because they think it's so brilliant.

DD1's experience was awful. A significant number of the teachers either couldn't give a toss or couldn't handle the pupils. DD1 found it really hard to access even 50% of the curriculum because her SEN support (outlined in her statement) was constantly withdrawn and she ended up teaching herself the majority of her GCSEs with predictable results.

For sixth form we moved her to a high school in a nearby town which is good but greatly overshadowed by the very popular grammar round the corner which has an enormous sixth form and is where everyone local wants to send their children.

DD1 has had marvellous support from motivated, skilled and well supported teaching staff and has blossomed socially and academically. She now has five university offers, two of which are unconditional and is the happiest I have seen her since she started school.

It seems to me that everyone who moved house to get into that first high school's catchment area was conned.

[Bonsoir]

For sure, it pays to look very hard when choosing a school and not listen to hearsay/marketing but to make up your own mind based on the information you gather and analyse personally. Which is hard work and time consuming!

[Goldmandra]

not listen to hearsay/marketing but to make up your own mind based on the information you gather

If you don't listen to the schools' marketing or the opinions of other parents, exactly what information should you gather and analyse?

It only leaves Ofsted reports and exam results, neither of which are particularly good ways to judge a school.

The "Ofsted outstanding" school DD1 attended had good GCSE results simply because there is a strong culture amongst parents of employing tutors to boost grades. The parents are paying to boost the school's results.

[KnittedJimmyChoos]

You get as much info as you can Gold, visit school, get feel for it, ofsted reports, other parents, see children coming out the school, we had nursery attached so got great feel for it. All info is relevant to me, all builds up a picture.

Our school is not best by far in our area. But its got excellent reputation none the less and its a very warm and caring place which at this age, primary was a key factor for me along with aiming for excellence in all things. Thus far my ground work has paid off and I am more than happy.

[Goldmandra]

Anything you see and hear in a school visit is marketing and anything you hear from other parents is hearsay.

A gut feeling from the atmosphere and looking at the pupils is all that's left. There's not a lot of information gathering and analysis to do with that.

[Bonsoir]

I like meeting and talking to staff, management and admin people. I judge the presentation skills of senior management and their ability to field questions.

I want modern facilities, a few teachers who are super highly qualified and quick thinkers.

[notquiteruralbliss]

I hate all the obsessing over schools. DCs ( bright but quirky) have gone to a haphazard mix of private schools, inner city comps and country grammars and have done OK.

They choose where to go to school (or indeed whether to go to school - one dropped out at 15) and what to study as they are the ones being educated. They generally work out what style of learning suits them and what they need to achieve to get where they want to go.

We have been lucky enough to be able to pay for private schools / individual tuition as / when required but most of DCs education has been at state schools and there is no way I would have wanted to put any of them under the sort of pressure they would feel if they knew we had remortgaged to pay their school fees.

[Bonsoir]

Not everything is marketing - not by far! You can gather loads of information by walking around and observing.

[MrsItsNoworNotatAll]

Bad schools do indeed suck.

My dc's love school. It's a revelation to me as even whilst in Primary school I would've been happy to leave and gone out to work.

High School...I won't even go there!

As a pp has said things have changed for the better. It never ceases to surprise me that my kids want to go to school every day. They are happy there in a way I never was. So I think if a kid is happy at school they'll do well there. I also think Teaching assistants have made a big difference as well.

[KnittedJimmyChoos]

Anything you see and hear in a school visit is marketing and anything you hear from other parents is hearsay.
I am not sure which poster said this was not valuable.

Its not marketing at all how dc are every day sure on school visit, the most polite dc are chosen to show parents round and so on, told to look smart, thats marketing but day to day NO, yes other parents may be herseay butbut still builds up picture

[PtolemysNeedle]

The point made a couple of times earlier in the thread about children doing well wherever they go as long as they are motivated would be great if we could guarantee that all children would be well motivated by every teacher and for every subject. But children come with their own personalities that we can't pre programme, and not every child is naturally motivated to achieve highly academically, even when they are bright.

Some children don't enjoy things they could be good at, some children are easily led to negative behaviour by others, some see more fun in chatting to their friends during lesson time than doing their work.

That is why lots of good parents will do everything they possibly can to get their child a good education and more importantly, a motivated and well supported group of classmates.

[canny1234]

I think parents on Mumsnet are highly interested in their children's education.I 'm not sure the vast majority of the British Population are.But I've lived in China and this is nothing compared to the Chinese education system.
I found interesting going to dd2's prospective open day recently for her independent secondary school.It was like a meeting of the United Nations.Certain sectors of the British population really value a good education and are prepared to pay by hook or crook.The local reputation of the school ( traditionally thought to be for landed 'princesses') is really changing.

[Taz1212]

I think it's a tiny minority who are "obsessed" and Mumsnet is in no way a reflection of the general UK population. I am very focussed on DC's education and would probably be viewed as obsessed by people here. My parents had extremely high expectations of me and while I am toned down in comparison, I do have a DS who is very driven and focussed. He is currently aiming for an Ivy and then to live in NYC. Bearing in mind that he is 12, this will probably change, and I am also trying to persuade him that uni here and then grad school in the US would be a better option. I don't see much point in undergrad in the US unless he is absolutely positive he will live there longer term. However, he is potentially Ivy material and if that's what he wants to aim for, he needs to be guided through the next few years. What is normal to me would probably horrify others!

I don't know anyone else where we live who is all that bothered about what school their DC go to (Scotland so not much choice though we have gone private).

[TooManyExams]

The average wage in the UK is £26,500 a year. The average house price in the UK is £178,000. Globalisation has made life much harder and much more insecure for workers in the first world. Middle earners no longer feel secure and worry greatly about their children being able to lead reasonably secure and dignified lives. Everyone is always told that the path of righteousness is a good education.. This will "save" their children. It's a "meritocracy" after all, so no whining if you fail, must be your own fault. In this febrile, ultra competitive atmosphere parents feel pressure and guilt to give their children the best education possible.

[JillyR2015]

I'm not sure it's any different from how it was.
In about 1918 my uncle was sent to boarding school aged 4 (because he was jealous of the new baby! and for a good education). He and his siblings were keen the children got to good state grammars in the next generation. My parents waited 13 years to have us after marriage to be able to afford school fees. My mother helped my brother get a year young into a very competitive academic leading private day prep school at 6+. All 9 cousins in our next generation go to good academic day private schools and have from 5 years old. No change at all there since about 1900s in this family - from once they got off the farms and into the cities my ancestors on all sides of the families knew a good education was the only thing people cannot take from you. You can lose your money but not your education. you have it for life. There is little better a mother can do for her children than pick a career which enables her to pay school fees.

[TheOriginalSteamingNit]

I agree with Word, except I don't think it's that parents didn't used to sweat much and then they did: I think society and government didn't give much of a toss about most kids until, oh, about 1997, and then they did.

I think it's inevitable that parents care and have an opinion, given that education is tugged and tweaked at and used as a weapon by political parties. It's a debate, and people become involved in it.