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AIBU?

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Original poster

Benefits: Too Fat To Work. Fucking really???

250 replies

Mountainygirl · 03/01/2015 17:58

I just spotted this in the TV guide. Channel 5 have obviously hit on the perfect formula- bring everyone's two favourite folk devils ('fat people' and 'benefit scroungers') together, for a brand new series, which I am sure will be a balanced and fair portrayal of these people's lives....

TV seems over run with this shit atm. Everyone goes on about how sexist/racist telly was in the 70s, but honestly, in years to come, people will be totally gobsmacked about how in 2015, it was almost universally OK to rip the absolute shit out of poor people.

OP posts:
Cherriesandapples · 05/01/2015 22:21

If you are 28 stone with type 2 diabetes, joint pain and cannot climb the stairs or wash yourself then you can be seen by social services for support with care, additional stair rails etc...

I am leaving this thread now to go to bed!

Night night mumsnet bullies!

morethanpotatoprints · 06/01/2015 00:57

GlitterBelle

My apologies, i didn't mean to offend.
I hate programmes like this and won't watch because I think they are so wrong. I wasn't suggesting people bury their head in the sand, but would certainly be interested if i thought it would be a balanced programme.

crumblebumblebee · 06/01/2015 09:45

Cherries No because social care workers should have empathy and care not judge facts based on mindless assumptions. You wouldn't be very popular in our office with those kind of views.

NanaNina · 06/01/2015 23:41

No one is bullying you cherries - we are just stating our point of view and being critical of your judgemental attitudes and your assertion that you work for social services - you may well do but you're not a social worker that's for sure and it's interesting you haven't sought to defend your position. As crumble points out social care workers have to have respect for people, empathy, and be non judgemental. Doesn't sound like you does it?

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 01:52

Oh how ironic.

Coyoacan · 07/01/2015 02:48

Oh what a wonderful thread, I don't have to say anything because it has all been said before by so many people. My heart leaps!

I also live in a country with no benefits. As for democracy, what is democracy when there are no alternatives and the media totally follows the government line. I totally agree with the comparison with Nazi Germany in the 30s. As has already been said in this thread by more eloquent people than myself, it was a gradual thing, practiced on civilised, educated people.

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 05:44

Who? Who are these 'people' trying to brainwash the nation National Socialist style? And what are they going to gain by exterminating the 'poor' and 'vulnerable'? That's what I want to know.

Dawndonnaagain · 07/01/2015 08:26

The government.

Kudos.
Power.
Votes.
Power.
Money.
Power.
Once you've lived in a state controlled in such a way for a long enough period you see it as a norm, not as something to complain about, object to, rebel against.

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 08:42

They're not, they haven't got the resources, the money is all going on the welfare state and MOD. It must be some other dark force.

Dawndonnaagain · 07/01/2015 08:48

Good grief, Plarail do you live in Disneyland? The money is not going on the welfare state. But hey, at least we know where you're coming from now. Hmm

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 09:02

Er, right. Did you know Dawn, that from 1946, the Government had an agency full of people who had the skills and resources to create the kind of 'propaganda' that makes you think the way you do. Guess what? It was totally closed down in 2013 due to Government cuts and all it's files were destroyed. The building it was in is now being turned into a luxury hotel. Mind blowing stuff eh?

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 09:05

Oh and I said the welfare state and the MOD, believe me, no one feels threatened by the genuinely disabled, or by the lazy and feckless. There are far more serious threats facing Britain than welfare dependency.

Dawndonnaagain · 07/01/2015 09:45

The biggest threat is often from within. Upsetting the status quo has always been frowned upon, rebellion quashed as quickly as possible, hence the ludicrous sentences handed out after the last riots. Which of course worked, no further riots, keep the masses in their places, turn them against one another rather than against those who have the control.
You won't see it, I don't know if it's because you're unable to see it, or don't want to, but the propaganda machine is running at full efficiency.

MorrisZapp · 07/01/2015 10:10

When I was a teacher in a deprived area we all knew the issues our pupils were up against. Fourth generation unemployment. Nobody in the household getting up in the morning. Poor provision of necessities while fags/ sky channels prioritized in the home. Parents unwilling to come into the school etc etc.

This isn't being judgemental or unprofessional, it's being aware of who your service users are, and knowing how best to educate kids in these communities.

'we're all just people' doesn't work in education. You need to know what your pupils are going home to in order to provide for their needs in any meaningful way.

FlouncyMcFlouncer · 07/01/2015 10:28

After all I had said, I thought I would watch the programme to see if my suspicions were correct. I paused the TV every time the narrator said anything that was unnecessarily snide. In the course of an hour programme, I paused it over 50 times (i lost count at one point after being interuppted by DS). I wish I'd written the comments down, but one or two that I have managed to recall:

"'Brian' (can't recall real name, sorry) won't be able to walk through the shopping centre, so he's got a mobility scooter - paid for by benefits". Two seconds later, 'Brian' explained that it costs £4 for him to hire the scooter for the shopping trip. Strange that the narrator had made it sound like the State had bought it for him.

"Amy and her mum say it's hard to manage on just £1200 state handouts each month"

Handouts, mind. Like a gift. Despite the fact that Amy's mum had worked all her life until very recently.

"Brians's been married before - but this time the state's picking up the bill". Brian and his fiancee had scrimped and saved for a couple of years for their very basic wedding, but since the money they were scrimping and saving was from their benefits, how very dare they?

It absolutely proved to be everything I expected it to be.

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 10:41

Do you know what they do to people who dissent where I live Dawn? I can't tell you because I might get a knock at my door. I just feel very sad that you think that the UK government is trying to harm its own people. It's so far from reality. Historically, dissent, free thought and rebellion has made the UK the great country that it is today, and allowed the spread ideas of freedom from oppression around the globe.

crumblebumblebee · 07/01/2015 10:45

Morris a study from the JR foundation found that there were very, very few families where multiple generations did not work.

Dawndonnaagain · 07/01/2015 10:51

Flouncy so glad I didn't watch. The benefit scrounging scum in this house can't cope, I've had to stop taking a paper and we no longer watch the news together, these programmes make him more ill.

Plarail I strongly suggest you do your research properly, and grow up a little. As I said, I was a history lecturer, I'm well aware of what the Empire did, how it forced it's version of freedoms on so many. We are a piddling little island with very little political clout left. Other countries within the EU laugh at us and our posturing. I strongly suggest you do some proper research and stop banging out logical fallacies, it's boring.

BackOnlyBriefly · 07/01/2015 10:52

And what are they going to gain by exterminating the 'poor' and 'vulnerable'? That's what I want to know

That's not how it works. No one wants to exterminate all the poor people. Who would be left to clean their toilets?

It's a process which has been used many times and has several advantages. You can pick any group women, claimants, black people, gay, muslim whatever and take away resources or rights from them. Stop them using up housing space, money, medical services etc. This frees up resources you can use elsewhere.

But everyone else would be outraged, so first you tell everyone that these 'xxxx' people are mean and nasty and undeserving of sympathy.

This also diverts any anger directed at you for not improving the lives of the majority. You can say "we had plans to double wages, drop taxes, make the sun shine brighter and so on, but those mean and nasty 'xxxx' people stopped us. It's not our fault"

And it hardly qualifies as a secret plan. Anyone who takes the trouble to look and think about it can see it happening. Luckily most people don't or it wouldn't work.

BackOnlyBriefly · 07/01/2015 11:01

FlouncyMcFlouncer, those examples are interesting aren't they. They are counting the same money twice in effect. So saying we gave 'Brian' £xx benefits and then we paid for the scooter because it came out of the benefits. Same for the wedding one.

I've seen people say similar things on here in previous threads.

A common one goes something like this:

Poster: 'Fred' gets £300 a week and a free house'
Me: "but he has to pay rent out of that benefit - it's not free"
Poster: "ah but we paid him the benefits so it's not his money so he's getting £300 a week and a free house"

ArsenicFaceCream · 07/01/2015 11:25

Yes Back and that is exactly what makes the comparisons to 30s Germany legitimate. What interests me is the media companies climbing on the bandwagon. I suppose it is pure supply and demand. There is an audience for the bile. So depressing.

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 11:28

Oh Dawn, I was talking about the Commonwealth (and not the one that happened post Colonialism either) and the Enlightenment but don't worry, I won't challenge your very stringent view of the world any further. I respect your right to have views and beliefs that are different from mine. Smile

Dawndonnaagain · 07/01/2015 11:33

loving that you think I'm so dim.

Plarail123 · 07/01/2015 11:37

Loving that you think I am!

NanaNina · 07/01/2015 17:46

I reckon that's 1 - 0 to you Dawn as Plarail has backed off - she knows when she's beaten!

Plarail I think you might live in Cloud Cuckoo land - you say the govt doesn't have the resources to try to exterminate the poor and vulnerable. It doesn't need resources (unless you count paying the private companies to carry out the WCT and the targets that they are set to declare people fit for work) and I think demonise is a more appropriate word than exterminate - BonlyB has given a very reasoned explanation of the advantage to the govt of demonising the poor and vulnerable of our society. Ably assisted by the DM and the red tops (not the Mirror) it means that people believe that it is actually benefit claimants who are ruining the country, and so turn their anger on them, which means that it is deflected away from the real enemy - capitalist society, especially the present govt. Game set and match!

The fact that you playrail actually believe "all the money is going on the welfare state and the MOD" suggests to me that you read the DM or the Sun, or believe all these shite programmes on Channel 4 and 5. That is exactly what the govt want you to believe - I think around 2% of the entire welfare budget is paid to unemployed people. The biggest spend is on State Pensions and on topping up the low wages of people who are employed on zero hours contract on the minimum wage, or who can't get enough hours to make ends meet. The Housing Benefit bill for people who are employed but don't earn enough to pay their rent is massive, and there are 2 reasons for this. One is because LAs don't have enough housing stock (council houses or HA accommodation) and so have to house people in private rented accommodation, and the other is because landlords (especially in London) but nationwide, are increasing their rents, even for very substandard accommodation. The govt could legislate against these massive rent increases by introducing a Fair Rent Act but they don't - they're quite happy for landlords to make vast profits, as it's all private enterprise, so all good as far as they're concerned.