So aibu?

[whatintheworldwarzz]

Ok so...

SIL who is an letting agent tells me that she doesn't give certain people tenancy because she "doesn't like the look of them"

Her words... well I showed some women round the flat the other day and when I got back to the office I said she's not having it I don't like her...

There was also another girl that was young wanting to rent a flat MY SIL had looked her up on Facebook and read her status' saw one that said OMG I'm so wasted and was like she's not having it....

We started talking about this and I said it's discrimination. Just because she got drunk and put it on Facebook doesn't mean she would be a bad tenant. Her reply was so what does it matter to you we just told her that the tenant didn't want someone young in the property (again I believe this is a terrible if not illegal thing to do?)
So here comes hour long discussion (argument ) where I'm trying to tell her you can't discriminate against someone just because you don't like them or the look of them. Like what gives you the right to make that judgement of someone else? Her replies where we'll I'm still going to do it what you going to do report me.. not understanding or accepting at all what discrimination is. This i might add got me rather piss ed off.this is followed by her sticking her fingers in her ears and saying blah blah blah. So i said im really starting to dislike you for this so she kicks of has a paddy and storms to the front door (like a child) saying well you didnt like me anywayyyy !So this all ends with me telling her to fuck off out my house.

A little background of my SIL. she is young herself has a job working for a family member and we'll gets "special" treatment for that fact.. I think she's on a power trip and thinks she runs the joint... but she has also lived a very sheltered life only ever worked for family so no real world experience in that sense only one relationship the one she is in now. And can have a childish look on things/come across as a bit of an idiot but not in a struggles with intelligence kind of way. I might also add that she is one of those girls who wasn't the cool kid in school if you know what I mean and she always seems to be putting down young girls who like to wear lots of make up or whatever and I've assumed it's because it makes her self feel better? I don't know though I'm just guessing but I've tried to explain to her that just because someone where's lots of make up it doesn't make them a bad person or a slug. Anyway hopefully you get the picture.

So basically I want to know aibu to try and get the point of discrimination across to her? Is it ok for her to do that as an agent because from a business point of view it makes sense?

Please help me get my head round this.. its nearly Christmas and I could do without a family feud!

No....you should just keep your nose out.

If she said 'I won't let to black people or gays' then you'd have a point.
But not taking on tenants that you think look a bit dodgy is NOT the same.
The tenants you have if you have rental properties can make a HUGE difference to the stress levels in your life. Perhaps, with experience of being letting agents, they're letting their instincts guide?

Again I will stress these are personal judgements not professional ones...

Ok.
I don't believe you think that you are being in the slightest bit unreasonable, so not sure why you posted.

I think YAB a bit U actually OP.

If she was refusing to show people round at all because they were dark skinned, or partially sighted, or had a foreign sounding name then that would be totally out of order.

But from what you've said, she's meeting people and then discounting them if she doesn't like them. I agree it's not exactly a nice and impartial way to behave, but it's the way everyone behaves when making selections. If you interview 2 people for a job, each with identical experience and qualifications, but one is smiley and friendly, and the other is sullen and miserable, it's human nature to choose the smiley one. If you're selling your own house, and have 2 identical offers, you're more likely to sell to the lovely person who complemented your decor than the grumpy one who said your carpet was hideous.

When I looked around houses to rent I used to feel it was as much to assess my personality as for me to look at the property. The agent needs to feel that the tenant is someone they can reasonably do business with.

No.i don't think I'm In ureasonable to.dislike discrimination. But rather whether or not I was unreasonable to tell her she was or think that it's ok just because it's good for business

Mmmm! So I have a house / car / horse / child and I want to rent it out.

A string of people come to have a look and I am NOT ALLOWED to decide against them because I don't get the right feeling about them when I meet them.

NOR am I allowed to discount them because, when I pop into fb to have a quick snoop, their account is wide open, no thought of security, and has messages about being truly wrecked.

OK. So what reasons CAN I use to decide against someone? I know about the protected characteristics, wouldn't dream of discriminating but you seem to be saying that being discerning is also not allowed.

If you take your thinking to its fullest then first come is always first served.

Black Friday renting agreements anyone?

Tbh I can't see any discrimination either. She's taking decisions based on her instincts. Sometimes the instincts are right, sometimes wrong. If two people want a flat and they both have the deposit and references, what else would you base your decision on?

I think everyone judges people like that, in interviews and in real life. I would butt out, nothing to do with you.

"She is turning away young girls"

And ai expect she'll be turning away boys too. Unless either the boys or the girls had over-18 guarantors, that it. For both girls and boys it can be really difficult to finding somewhere to live independently. But ai cannot fault an agent who will not recommend someone for a contract who is not yet 18 and therefore unable in law to enter a binding one.

I am a tenant myself (6 years). I've been a homeowner too (15 years). So i can see this from both sides, so to speak.

I think a letting agent is entitled to make a personal judgement about prospective tenants on behalf of their clients.

The fact that your SIL seems to think more unfavorably about young women is perhaps due to her past, but to come to that conclusion is making quite a big assumption.

It's making as big an assumption as you are accusing her of doing, ironically.

So her employer advocates it, but you don't and she's supposed to put your views before those of the person who actually pays her wages?! The fact it's her aunt's company is irrelevant to your point.

If you apply for a job you expect a facebook check, put on decent clothes and brush your hair for an interview etc. it's not that different. It is her job to ensure the landlords have decent tenants, first impressions count.

I would far rather be over cautious if letting out my property and would expect the letting agent to choose the best suited tenant, not just the first one that comes along and looks a bit dodgy or is known for having parties and getting wasted or whatever the case may be.

Of course they are personal judgements, thats partly how you vet tenants! And how you interview people for jobs, and how you make friends.......you sound incredibly naive about how life actually works.

I'm a landlord and I always meet prospective tenants (rather than use a letting agent) because I want to get a 'feel' for them myself. I've turned several down because I didn't like the way they came across, or because their family arrangements made me sceptical about how the rent would be paid - the family that wanted to move six adults into a small 3 bedroom hous and have the deposit between the son and the father because neither of them could afford it all - made me question how they would also afford the rent, and having several people liable is a nightmare. So far my approach of checking people out has worked very well. My property is very valuable to me and if someone doesn't feel right, for whatever reason, I won't let them rent it.

Surely we can't all go around judging books by their covers?

We all do that - it's how we survive.

Anyone who is required to make a judgement about someone's integrity (and renting a house does largely depend upon a tennant's integrity) is probably going to look at facebook.

Anyone that leaves information about themselves wide open for public consumption online is handing over that information on a plate.

Ok that's fine I was being unreasonable. I will apologise.

I'm. Not naive about the world I'd just like to think I try hard to be equal in my life.
Thanks everyone for you opinions.

How else do they decide who to let a very expensive commodity to for 6mths plus ? You really area bit of a twit op if you think that they should not use personal judgement.

Right so uf you were renting out your house youd give it to anyone without a criminal record, no matter what they looked like, said, did, or what vibe you got from them? Youd give it a 17 year old with facial tattoos, a smell of weed and a ukip tshirt?

BULLSHIT you would!

I think it's very commendable to be trying to live your life 'being equal'. Most of the time i like to 'live and let live', and 'give the benefit of the doubt', so i'm with you there OP. I can see that.

There are circumstances however when i WILL listen to my inner voice saying 'hmm, this person maybe a bit dodgy'. Sometimes purely on looks or gut instinct. These are times when it concerns my children's safety, or when it would cost me a lot of money or time and trouble if i ignored that feeling. Such as lending out property.

if she was discrimating because of colour or gender or sexual orientation or religion then yes she would be wrong but her clients will be entering in to a business relationship with the tennant as will the agency as they manage the relationship - so they have the right to use their judgement - she may annoy her clients if she is turning potential tenants off on a whim and losing business

Age is a protected characteristic under the 2010 Equality Act so if SIL is discriminating against people purely because of their age (they looked too young) then it is illegal because that potential tenant has "suffered a detriment."

However, it doesn't sound like you would get very far in trying to take this further. If she isn't responding to your attempts to educate her have you tried turning it on it's head? Ask her how she would feel if someone had turned her down for a job because she is female/young/black/bisexual etc etc.

She sounds like a bit of a berk and I would probably just distance myself from her to be honest.

Yes yes I agree with personal feelings in that they don't look right on a professional stand point... but she isn't saying I'm not giving it to her because they didn't look suitable for the property she's saying I don't like her... there's a huge difference. Anyway. I've said I'd apologise.

Agents always use their personal judgement regarding tenants. tbh you sound a bit naive (not your SIL) if you think the only reason a tenancy should be declined is because of a history of bad tenancies or buying drugs on the premises.

Like it or not, a property is expensive and it makes sense for owners to do everything they can (legally) to ensure the person entrusted with the tenancy is going to respect it and look after it. We meet with all our tenants and ask for references. If any of those points fall down then we don't let them the property. It's not discrimination. It's common sense.

I'm glad you realise that you owe your SIL an apology for not understanding the business that she is in, for being patronising and rude, and for trying to relate any of this back to how she felt at school.

Yabvu, I would actually prefer someone like your SIL who would go the extra length to find out more about an applicant rather than get just anyone just to close a deal. Many employers use social media to find out about potential employees as well. You are very, very naive if you think people don't do this.

Oh my god.... she is not going the extra length... she is being bitch. . You weren't here I know how and what she said. She was rude and demeaning. She also then acted like a 4 year old in front of my partner and my child. I think I know my SIL. I know I was right in what I said. I just wanted to know wet her I should have said it to her or is this something that is an accepted practice in letting. Don't you dare tell me I'm naive slagging her of or a horrible person. I gave you enough information to answer my specific question I didn't ask any of you wet her you thought I was right. You call.me judge look at the you reading a post on the Internet and being horrible about someone without even knowing them.

My whole original point.

You seem too involved in your SIL life. Take a step back. Many people have confirmed here that making personal judgements are normal. And yes I still think you are naive if you think people don't.