Should we just give ISIS their own country and let them get on with it..?

[AWholeLottaNosy]

Just saw a headline, ISIS behead 4 children for not converting for Islam. I was just wondering if they want an Islamic state so much with Sharia law,should the powers that be just give them their own country ( like Israel has) and let them get on with it? So everyone who wants to live in that way can do so and leave the rest of us alone..?

I realise this is probably an unrealistic solution but God knows, bombing the hell out of them, young men from the UK wanting to go join them, be heading men on the internet and raping young women and girls certainly isn't either...

You see this is what I don't understand, what is it that ISIS actually WANT..?

Well, it's not all that difficult to tackle; you just shoot the people who do it in the wrong place.

It's pretty clear that ISIS are funded by the Americans and Israelis to continue to ramp up global Islamophobia and the whole "Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East

Utter nonsense

And why are young men and women wiling to give up their freedom and their lives to fight for it? Why is it so compelling..?

Lets give them France.

Hi Marmite - a planet inhabited by lots of clever, knowledgeable diplomats and academics with decades of experience in this area. It's hardly going to be hitting the mainstream news, and it's not like Obama writes a cheque to ISIS every month, but it's very convenient for the US and Israel to make us all extra scared of Islam.

And before you ask - no, the US was not responsible for 9/11.

Personally I'd be happy if all those people in the UK who are demanding Sharia law in the UK would fuck off and go live in a country where they could do that and leave the rest of us alone. Including all the decent moderate Muslims in the UK who I am assuming are the majority.

Why is it so compelling..?

Two most popular reasons given (a) the jihadis have low level lives that they're willing to give up. (b) Islam states a duty to wage Jihad.

But some of those young men that have gone to be Jijadis were well educated and could have had a good life here. Are young Muslims so disillusioned with life in the UK that they feel almost certain death in a far off land is preferable? In that case we have definitely failed them.

Bluestocking - so, if it wasn't the Americans, did Israel cause 9/11?

Qatar are also big funders of Hamas. Does that mean the US is also funding Hamas? Or that Israel is funding Hamas? The Qatar Holdings own Harrods. Is there some American or Israeli shenanigans going on there too?

I thought it was generally agreed that their funding came from organised crime.

A lot of their funding comes from oil I think.

A lot of their funding comes from the ransoming of hostages that are threatened with beheading.

Both France and Italy will pay, and it's big bucks.

I understand why its compelling. Many are educated and yet still in a country where you can work exceptionally hard and still remain in poverty (uk) this engenders feelings of anger, powerlessness alienation and rage, particularly at 'the way things are' The offer is training , weapons and a life where that rage alienation and aggression is useful rather than further alienating.. and further disadvantaging.

ISIS will be replaced by another equally frightening group soon

who is it that keeps funding them

its a losing batter unless we address what is really going on. desperate people will often act in a desperate way and when given money and power their strength builds how sad that the poor, desperate and often uneducated are really fighting a battle that they too will never win

Just in the way Christianity has many "interpretations" (CofE, Baptist, Cathocism, Methodist) so does Islam.

ISIS supports a very fundamentalist and literal interpretation of the Islamic faith including Sharia law and Jihad. They want to form an Islamic super state that follows this ideology.

Many devout Muslims in Islamic countries do not support this "versioning"of their faith.

However, people in desperate circumstances or those in contact with a gifted orator can easily believe that this radical approach represents a God given call to arms.

Skeptical? How many ordinary Germans voted for Hitler...how many joined the SS? How many were not just complicit but actively involved in the ghettoisation and subsequent incarceration and murder of 6 million Jews?

Humanity is capable of terrible things given the right context and "justification".

I have to say, there are endless British children on sink estates, condemned to a life of poverty, gang violence, drug addiction and squalor who are far more deserving of my sympathy than idiots who take a Kalashnikov to Syria. I hope every single one of them ends up on the wrong side of an F17, I really do.

Go on, bluestocking, name these many serious academics and diplomats who believe this exciting view of the world you espouse

It's well established that Israel funded Hamas in the 70s and 80s cardamomginger

Sorry, precursors of Hamas in the 70s and Hamas itself in the 80s

"It's pretty clear that ISIS are funded by the Americans and Israelis to continue to ramp up global Islamophobia"......I don't believe that.

I was more curious as to whether Bluestocking could tell me, based on the Qatar connection she earlier raised, whether Israel and/or the US currently fund Hamas.

Interesting chap on Radio 4 today, saying that ISIS is spending 2 million a day, which means although they're rich for a terrorist group, they don't have nearly enough money to fund a state. He thinks they will collapse within the next year or so. Yes it is oil money.