I really don't know whether IABU regarding maintenance from ex

[justfoundout2014]

H and I separated in the summer due to his infidelity. I work f/t, he was sahp. He has insisted that he wants nothing at all from me and has so far kept to this and is now working and in a studio flat on his own. Dc are with me.

His flat is 6 miles from us, in the city where his friends are. He comes to the family home every morning at 6.30, allowing me to go to work early. I am a teacher, and would struggle if he didn't do this - no c/ms start that early and I struggle juggling everything as it is. He drops the dc off at 7.30, then goes to work - near where he lives. To date, he has been able to leave work at 3pm to pick dc up and he then looks after them in the family home until I return - usually about 5pm, sometimes much later due to meetings, parents' evenings etc. He usually stays until they are in bed. Once a week I am home before 4.

He also comes round on Sundays after lunch and takes the dc out for a few hours. They eat all meals at home, though he usually buys them an ice-cream or something on the Sunday. They have never been to his flat.

He pays me nothing and I have been insisting he brings his own coffee (naice machine = expensive coffee) and fruit for breakfast in the mornings (too early for him to eat at home). Obviously he is welcome to have a meal if I work late, and I occasionally give him something on Sunday if I have made a big meal.

He is generally happy with the arrangement, but has made a few comments that suggest he feels he is being taken advantage of. Not that he objects to the childcare, but that he is being 'good' by doing it, and that I am doing all the taking. I don't know. Given that he has walked away with nothing, should I be asking for money from him now he works, or, conversely, should I be paying him for childcare?

We have taken no legal advice, apart from free 30 minutes when I first found out (me, not him) so I just don't know. I do know that the current arrangement suits me very well, and I really don't know how I would cope without the childcare he provides.

Any advice would be great - would love to know how unfair or not this looks from the outside.

Justfound sadly it probably is because you are a woman that they are with you. Very few men will allow their children to live with them

I think it's a bit off of you to imply that he doesn't want to be with them when he's getting up at what? 5.30 am to drive to your house and look after them at your convenience.

I think you're doing pretty well out of it full stop tbh. Very, very, very few NRPs are willing and able to run their lives around the RP's working hours.

He's a dick for cheating tho, and if you're looking for a any old reason to take a pop at him then I can't at I blame you.

So, you pay for everything for the children- all their meals, put a roof over their head etc? And he sees them for an hour in the morning, a few hours in the evening and pays the CM?

I can't imagine the before school childminder can cost anywhere near the amount of maintenance he would be paying as a non resident parent- have you checked the CSA website to see what he should be paying? He is not 'doing you a favour' by spending time with his own children!

I just think it must be really stressful for you to have to spend time with him in the evenings- surely once you have got back from work he should leave? When my exH left he seemed to think he could just pop back and play happy families whenever he wanted and I found it stressful and disruptive for the kids. We changed it so he came over one evening a week to put them to bed, and I went out. Then he ended up moving away and now only sees them every other weekend and life is actually a lot easier!

I think he is manipulating you- he is having his cake and eating it, his bachelor pad and then happy families when he wants it. If it works for you then fine, but if not them I would make some more formal access arrangements, pay the CM yourself, and get him to pay you maintenance.

Also, why does he never have them overnight? Surely they could sleep on an airbed or something in his flat? It sounds like you never get a break and, having been through this recently, I'm pretty shocked by some of the attitudes on this thread that suggest you are getting a good deal!

"So, you pay for everything for the children- all their meals, put a roof over their head etc? And he sees them for an hour in the morning, a few hours in the evening and pays the CM?"

Could you not equally say that the OP's ex sacrificed his career to hers, continues to work flexibly around school hours to enable her to continue earning, and in return is getting nothing in financial support from the OP? Basically, the OP is still getting the benefits of having a SAHP in many ways without having to support another adult financially.

I'm not sure if it's relevant, but if you own your house, has he given up any claim to it? Is that why he thinks he shouldn't pay any maintenance? It's an unusual situation, so it's difficult to say what's fair or unfair.

He's certainly not doing you a favour though - just pulling his weight, which I would expect any parent to do. However, I do agree with other posters who say that this particular arrangement isn't sustainable in the long run, but I guess you'll cross that bridge when you come to it.

Thank you avaado. I feel so confused and really don't know what I should or shouldn't be doing. He is working online atm, as well as his day job, and when I got home he had fed the dc, but they had chucked coats and shoes on sitting room floor, not done any reading spellings and he disappeared up to what is now my room to do his online stuff. Think he didn't go home because it was rush hour.

Tbf, he usually reads etc with the kids, but he wanted to prioritise his work today - and he will keep all the money from that to himself. I, otoh, have an observation on Weds - not properly planned yet (in my head, but no slides or resources done). That is not important apparently, and I must fit it around the dc.

Doesn't seem fair to me - my career has provided everything the four of us have had over the last 10 years, so surely I should not have to sit and watch it decline now?

But maybe I am just bitter and twisted...really galls me to here people being aghast that he has left the home and I am not in a bedsit somewhere though - as if that would be the fair action and I have somehow diddled him...

He has never had a career - musician, bit of tefl - type teaching, frustrated writer... Sorry, but he has sacrificed nothing at all for me. Nothing. Now he just wants to turn back the clock 10 years.

FFs, hear . Though I can't even hear it...

notinagreatplace but the OP is not getting the 'benefits' of a SAHP is she? She is a single working parent, he never has them overnight. As far as I can see, the time he is seeing them just adds up to what a reasonable amount of contact hours should be.

I sacrificed my career for exH and to bring up the children. Now we are separated and I am working again he doesn't actually give me any money to support myself- he gives me maintenance for the DC. As her ex is not the resident parent I don't see that she should give him money for himself. I don't know anyone who actually gets alimony or whatever it's called.

OP, I think you need to decide what works for you. If the mornings/after school care helps you out and he is happy to do it, then keep doing it. But I would expect him to leave when you get home from work. And I would expect him to have them overnight at least every other weekend.

But if he's being a pain about it I would start thinking about alternatives. Is there any way you could change your working hours so you can drop them off at the CM? Or as others have said get a nanny or au pair?

The reason why people are saying it won't last is not because people don't think men want to be good parents, but because ex-spouses don't like accommodating their exes. If he sees what he is doing as benefiting the children then great; if he sees what he does as benefiting you, then it will change. he will stop doing things, or start getting nasty about doing them, or punishing you for it.

Oh look he is doing it already. He is prioritizing his work over the children and using your space to do so, at your expense. It begins.

Separated parents usually do not attempt to work together like this, pooling resources for professional childcare instead, despite that this is more expensive due to loss of efficiency relative to doing it oneself. If you couldn't get on and trust each other within a marriage, then why do you expect to share resources and labour in good faith once the marriage has ended?

that is not a dig at you btw. I am just saying he let you down before so why should you put your home etc at his disposal again? I wouldn't have an ex in my house, messing things up for me to tidy up, treating me like a maid, leaving things switched on, helping himself to the fridge, etc. He disrespected you enough to be unfaithful so he will disrespect you again in ways that are disruptive to your daily life, in ways that are hard to ignore and brush off in your own home.

If this is the only arrangement possible for now, then start work behind the scenes to make the necessary changes to be able to manage without him in your life day to day. What could change? Could you get an au pair, someone to live in? Could you sort out some kind of reciprocal arrangement with a friend, another parent at the school? You need to have found an alternative within weeks or months.

The dropping hints about how "good" he is has me fuming. As you do not have time to sneeze, how does he imagine you have the resource to relieve him of any of his mighty workload? twat. he never respected you, he doesn't now, find a way to get out of this arrangement.

I find it so sad the number of posts on here saying that I can't expect this to last. Why not?

Because life changes and people move on. He is unlikely to stay the faithful dedicated ex you currently enjoy, and he is unlikely to ignore the opinions of a new partner when he/she appears on the scene and they become serious.

he wants me to maintain everything here so that he doesn't have to feel guilty about disrupting the kids.

Who left who? Did he leave or was he pushed?

Then he can come back every day and still feel he is the perfect parent. At the same time, if I ever mention finances, he can lay it on about being here at the crack of dawn every morning for my 'benefit'.

Given the circumstances, you're doing a pretty good job of painting him out to be the perfect parent.

Actually, it is so I can keep the job that keeps a roof over his kids' heads, but, hey...

Not, "our kids' heads," or, "my kids' heads," but, "his kids' heads"?

There is no chance of my ever meeting anyone else

You'd be surprised how easily it happens, even for the busiest, most hectic of people. Random events happen, you're sat next to a stranger on a plane, or you stand next to someone on a platform when you find out the train is delayed, whatever. It happens, because it's meant to happen. We are social animals. We pair bond. It is the most primal of human instincts to seek others. That doesn't have to be you seeking them, it just needs to be someone else looking for something, seeing it in you, and having the guts to say they likes you.

I don't think he's being taken advantage of by you whatsoever. I think you both are in the early stage of separation and he starting to find the arrangement not to his liking. He's starting to moan.
You are paying to house and feed the children and yourself. He's very forunate you are doing so, I'd say.
You never get a day off.

I think the current arrangement will evolve somewhat over time. You will tire of him hanging around at your house, for a start.

But no, in answer to your wondering...yanbu!

The current arrangement is not ideal. You seem to be bearing the brunt of the costs for your dc plus the majority of the caring responsibility.

He is currently fitting in his access at times that work for you. You have him living in your pocket a bit.

It sounds like you need to move towards a more separated family life that might be less convenient for you and more expensive for him. How's about you park that for a while and continue with the current arrangement that seems to be working well for the dc?

Please do take legal advice because just by letting this situation continue you might be doing yourself out of future maintenance or the chance to share caring responsibility more equally.

It is sad that everyone is saying you've got it good. Shows how shitty a separation usually can be for the family.

Start to pull him up if he wants to imply he's doing you a favour. Agree that it can't stay this way forever and he's going to need to start paying more towards the dc upkeep. Ask why he thinks that time with his dc is a favour to you?

Ultimately it sounds amicable and it's best kept that way. You can get more out of him if you keep communicating. Don't let some false sense of resentment and over-entitlement build up. It will only take a new gf turning his head on how he "does everything for those kids" to have him drop his caring responsibilities like a hot potato.

Doesn't seem fair to me - my career has provided everything the four of us have had over the last 10 years, so surely I should not have to sit and watch it decline now?

That's why a lot of men who were the primary wage earner end up as NRP with EOW contact - because the reality of shared parenting is that both careers take a hit.

My DD has been fortunate in that her dad and I were prepared to change our work commitments to accomodate a shared care arrangement we believed was best for her - it meant that the marital home was sold and we both downsized, but that was preferable to an inequality in parenting, in our opinion.

I could imagine it lasting, my ex was also an "alternative" career person, not quite sahp but didn't want to work. My work has changed now but he was very good at doing the 6.30 am slot that you describe.

But can you maintain it? You have your kids, effectively, 24/7, albeit with Dad doing childcare/kids food. But I'm guessing you're still doing household admin, in almost every night etc etc

He gets to go back to his flat, flush with having done "the right thing" by his kids, nights out, Saturdays off etc.

Yes you like your job by the sound of it (and what's wring with that?) but ultimately you are feeding and clothing and housing your children while he does (about?) half the childcare ...

Tbh I'd be furious.

If I remember rightly he has been very fair to you. Yes ok I know he cheated on you but he was the main carer of the children and he could have easily stayed put and took you to court and asked the judge for full residency.

You know his income, is it much? After bills etc........

And he doesn't need to be at your house at 6.30 because you said yourself you could go to work much later and look after the dc yourself, the downside being a few mins late for work which no boss would refuse under the circumstances.

I believe he is afraid he won't get to see his kids unless he does what you say and want.

Doesn't seem fair to me - my career has provided everything the four of us have had over the last 10 years, so surely I should not have to sit and watch it decline now?

A broken relationship always results in decline on both sides. It is inevitable. You can't stop it. You may be the 'wronged' party, but you seem to be losing nothing except the time and effort you put into building a life together. You're not losing your children, your home, your career or your financial security. Your losing the picture postcard successful middle class family unit paradigm. That is all.

It's fresh, from what you say, and you sound like you're still very much in love with him. Bitter that he felt it was okay to be selfish and play away from home. Resentful that he needed something he couldn't find in you, and angry that he didn't have the strength to do without, out of respect for everything you had built together.

He seems to be acknowledging that he was selfish on some level, and doing what he can to ease the discomfort. Things will be raw for a long time. You seem to have worked through the worst of it (I threw myself into my work), and there is nothing anyone can really say about fish and sea, that doesn't sound trite. It's something that'll just work itself out in the end. Hopefully ex-hubby will still be involved with DCs and his new gf won't be a total bitch, and maybe you'll let someone talk to you on a train, or in a supermarket. Who knows. Just don't write anything off.

Sorry, Quitelikely, but most of what you say is totally untrue. As I have said, he didn't try and get full residency because he doesn't want it. I know people only have my word for it, but it is true. Why else would he walk away with nothing when, as has been pointed out, he could have so much more? Because he doesn't want to live in a 'boring area' full of 'geriatrics', being responsible for two children, mainly alone.

I have never said I could go to work much later . I could go about an hour later, but that would give me no planning/marking time in the mornings. It would cause me a huge amount of stress to waltz into school 5 mins before the bell rings every day. As a tlr holder, I have an unspoken but non-negotiable responsibility to be 'around' for more than the bare minimum of hours. My h/t, though extremely supportive in the summer when all this came to light, wold absolutely not allow me to start work late every day - that is simply not possible for teachers.

Absolutely bollocks to say he fears he won't see the children . I would never, ever do that to them, or him, and he knows that. Tbf, I suppose he is doing what he sees as the right thing because he knows he has been a total and utter shit to me. He may fear, if anything, that I will completely go under if he doesn't pull his weight.

I think you would do well to separate your 100% justified feelings about him being a total and utter shit to you from how you would like to progress with your co-parenting relationship.

Also, as a PP said- could they not stay at his bedsit every now and then on a blow up bed? If they're primary age there's nothing wrong with them all sleeping in one room.

It would give you a break.

OP he has raised the dc while you maintained your career prospects. He has looked after them really well going by your other posts. Your complaining about him leaving coats on the floor! Fgs stop harassing him and be greatful he gets up at the crack of dawn every day so that you can go into work extra early just because your post demands it. You could easily mark work at home.

Perhaps he should have kept the house, dc, got a job and then asked you to come each day at the crack of dawn and after school, then you read to the kids, give tea, do homework, oh and don't forget to bring your own food. Oh and don't forget to pay him aswell for the privilege.........

OP you will only push this man so far.

It's called taking the eyes and coming back for the sockets.......

I would be glad the mornings work out and that he pays for Childcare. Is probably get him to have them at some point on the weekend so you have done work free/ child free time. And I would say no way to him leaving kids downstairs should he goes into your space to work. That's too invasive. I wouldn't have him for evening meals either. The coffee thing is a bit petty though.

So, if you feel this isn't fair or working well, what are your alternatives?

1. Go to a "traditional" NRP with contact arrangement. He would take the kids at weekends or EOW, maybe one evening a week, and pay CSA. You would be responsible for any childcare, paying and arranging CM etc. Financially does that balance out? Would CSA cover childcare and bills? Are you better getting some alone time...Would an au pair work?

1. Can you afford to downsize and both by smaller homes to accommodate one adult and the DC. Then he could take them to his in the day, have them overnight.

1. Ask he pays towards bills, see what he does. On that note-

Lastly I'd see a solicitor re. divorce sooner rather than later. If you have a joint mortgage you should both still be contributing, as you will both benefit as and when the house is sold.

So regards him contributing financially, if you're happy with the arrangements re. the DC, maybe you should come at it from the POV that he is still financially invested in the house, so he needs to at least pay his mortgage share. BTW, sometimes mortgage companies will freeze payments until the financial settlement, so one party doesn't end up losing out.