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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder if Labour really will scrap the bedroom tax?

285 replies

GaryShitpeas · 05/12/2014 16:34

Not going to go into why i am against it but I am. Doesn't affect me ATM as not on Hb but I probably will need to be in the future.

But I personally will be voting labour for this reason alone ....this is the first time I've ever voted Blush (to my shame) because I want it gone. But I wonder if they'll actually keep their promise.....

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writtenguarantee · 07/12/2014 21:10

I think disabled people should have been exempt. And on the subject of pensioners yes I think they should come under the tax within reason. Say an age limit of 75 or thereabouts. Because there would only be an outcry like 90 year old forced to move from house they have lived in all their life.

sure, that all makes sense in principle. while I am not sure about the 75 cutoff )could be too low or high), in principle having some limit makes sense.

writtenguarantee · 07/12/2014 21:11

Currently it's anyone age 62+ exempt.

that's rather young.

handcream · 07/12/2014 21:23

The issue I suspect is that if they don't bring pensioners into the mix with us all living longer the situation is going to get worse and worse. Also in my DM's day the retirement age was 60, mine for the state pension is 68 meaning I will have worked 50 years before I get it.

SaucyJack · 07/12/2014 21:33

I think disability should be an exemption, but only in cases where it's relevant.

i.e. someone having had expensive adaptions made to their house, siblings that cannot share due to behavioural issues, someone needing to downsize but no ground-floor flats available yadda yadda.

WooWooOwl · 07/12/2014 21:35

Over time the policy could well change, disabled people could continue to receive the full amount of their rent, we could change the pensioner exemption age gradually up to 75. But that's not something that should have ever been done as soon as the policy was first introduced, these things take time.

There is plenty of room to improve the so called 'bedroom tax' and I sincerely hope that happens, but no government will scrap it completely. It will never make political sense for a government to effectively say they are going to start paying for housing extras for one small group of people that have no real need for it.

weresquirrel · 07/12/2014 22:21

It depends who they have to form a government with. I don't think Labour will get an overall majority so I think they will use the fact that they have to form a coalition as an excuse to renege on a lot of promises. At the end of the day, Labour are no different from the Tories, that is why people are so disillusioned with politics. If you want a left-wing, socialist party, who represent and care for their voters, Labour certainly ain't it!

weresquirrel · 07/12/2014 22:33

The reason why single pensioners living in 3/4/5 bedroom council houses is because pensioners are a very powerful voting demographic so nobody wants to upset them (and most of them vote Tory). If young people actually bothered to vote, things might change.

writtenguarantee · 08/12/2014 12:38

The reason why single pensioners living in 3/4/5 bedroom council houses is because pensioners are a very powerful voting demographic so nobody wants to upset them (and most of them vote Tory). If young people actually bothered to vote, things might change.

of course. it's not a secret.

Original poster
GaryShitpeas · 08/12/2014 16:33

at the end of the day, Labour are no different from the Tories, that is why people are so disillusioned with politics. If you want a left-wing, socialist party, who represent and care for their voters, Labour certainly ain't it!

^^ who shall i vote for then? genuine question!

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OldLadyKnows · 08/12/2014 16:45

If I were in England, I'd vote Green, NHA (if available), Monster Raving Looney, or a local independent candidate.

weresquirrel · 08/12/2014 16:54

I really don't know. That is the problem, there are NO parties that seem to represent normal people.

Possibly Green but for every good policy they also have crackpot ones. They seem the best of a bad bunch imo.

WetAugust · 08/12/2014 16:59

I'm quite staggered at the figures in the Guardian stating that 46,000 people have been sanctioned 10 times or more by the DWP.
These people must be leading very chaotic lives. No wonder food banks are so used. There must be a way of helping these people to avoid multiple sanctions surely?

Original poster
GaryShitpeas · 09/12/2014 09:51

wet august

i read an article on that last night, made me cry

dwp are bastards

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Original poster
GaryShitpeas · 09/12/2014 09:53

oh yeah and IMO the biggest "benefit scroungers" are the private LL coining 1000's a year in housing benefit from the social

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dirkdiggler1 · 09/12/2014 12:54

Want a spare room? Pay for it

Couldn't agree more. The cretin Miliband hasn't got a chance anyway so I wouldn't worry about it.

maninawomansworld · 09/12/2014 17:33
  1. It is NOT a tax! It is a reduction in benefit which is applied if it is deemed that the recipient is getting paid too much from the state (or more accurately, from people who work and pay tax into the system).
  1. I hope it is not scrapped!
  1. Labour in power..... shudder!
WetAugust · 09/12/2014 17:55

My issue with this subsidy/tax is that the law is being applied retrospectively.

If a person could elect to move to a smaller property and would immediately be rehoused in that smaller and cheaper property then the withdrawl of benefit would be fair.

What is not fair is saying that their home is too large for them and failing to provide them with a home of the 'right' size.

I am not Labout by the way. I just believe in fair play.

OldLadyKnows · 09/12/2014 18:03

Plenty of people in receipt of housing benefit and subject to the bedroom tax are also "people who work and pay tax into the system."

WooWooOwl · 09/12/2014 18:06

It's not the councils job to provide someone with a home though.

Critics of this policy are often quick to point out that it ends up costing more because tenants can move into private rented accommodation with the right number of bedrooms and have their more expensive rent paid by HB. So there are options for people, moving into a smaller property can be done without the council or housing association finding you one. There are options, and people did have warning.

Saying that though, I do think that for people that have relied on HB for a long time, it would be fair to offer them somewhere else before cutting their benefit, but only one offer, and if it's refused for any reason then people should be expected to pay for their own spare rooms because they have been given an active choice not to.

Private LLs provide a service. Housing benefit is not calmed by landlords, it is claimed by people who can't afford their own rent. Landlords very rarely choose to rent to claimants, many refuse to do rent to people who can't afford their own rent either because their mortgages don't allow it or they'd have to pay higher insurance premiums.

I think it's hypocritical for you to call anyone a benefit scrounger when if it was said about anyone who actually does claim benefits then you'd probably jump on them.

Original poster
GaryShitpeas · 09/12/2014 18:43

Housing benefit is not claimed by landlords, it is claimed by people who can't afford their own rent

but the benefit money goes into their pockets though

and WORKING people cant afford their own rent because the LL are charging too much (as woo woo owl says, many people IN work can't afford the silly rents. loads of my friends in private earning OK money are having to claim top ups. its not right)

Grabby LL are benefit scroungers IMO

in fact the reason i have a council house is cos my ex landlord when i was in private tried to up my rent by £200 a month cos he knew i was claiming HB and thought the council would pay it. i shit you not, he ACTUALLY SAID THAT TO ME. i didn't think it was fair as IMO was not even worth what rent already was. plus it was damp and mouldy and fucking horrible. and when i challenged him he served me with notice. so we then got re housed in council

(meanwhile i am happy in my council house which is way better than my old house, and half the rent. and my old house is STILL sitting empty so every time i go past it i just think HAHAHAHA to my old LL how do ya like them apples )

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Original poster
GaryShitpeas · 09/12/2014 18:44

sorry i meant oldladyknowsnothing when i said woo woo owl in the bit about the working people claiming hb

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caroldecker · 09/12/2014 18:48

Gary your comment proves landlords can't charge 'too much' as no-one will pay it.

WooWooOwl · 09/12/2014 18:54

Maybe your own personal experience, which does sound horrible, is clouding your judgement then.

Benefit money may end up in the pockets of landlords, being a landlord can be profitable. I realise that, but I'm also aware that is far from always being profitable. If a landlord is doing a job then it's not unreasonable that s/he's paid for it, and if they are doing the job then a fair amount of the rent money will be spent on the property.

You say that money ends up in the pockets of LLs as if the tenant, who is actually getting a home for themselves and their family out of it, is completely irrelevant. People who claim the money use it for housing, something pretty important don't you think? If the government are going to spend money on anything, then making sure people don't go homeless because of the economy and the property market should be up their at the top of their priority list.

Original poster
GaryShitpeas · 09/12/2014 19:13

carol the social were going to stump up for my extra rent because they didn't want to house me. and told me to tell my landlord i would pay it if he revoked his notice

so people DO pay high rents and often HB will cover it

but in my case i didn't want to live there and i wanted a council house so i pushed and pushed for one, i had to jump through hoops for months. sitting in the council office every day for weeks as it was the only way they would take notice of me. loads of times they "lost" my application and fucked up so much and so many times. i think they hoped i would just go away. i ended up ill with anxiety and depression and was very near my eviction date when i was finally housed

but it was the best thing anyones ever done for me, he did me a favour as i finally feel secure and safe and happy and i have never felt like that anywhere i have lived before apart from when i lived at home

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Original poster
GaryShitpeas · 09/12/2014 19:17

You say that money ends up in the pockets of LLs as if the tenant, who is actually getting a home for themselves and their family out of it, is completely irrelevant. People who claim the money use it for housing, something pretty important don't you think?

you are absolutely right of course but i dont think its right that housing is making so many people so poor, it never used to be like this

before the housing market went nuts and before i had dcs, 9 years ago i was renting a lovely, clean, beautifully decorated 2 bed new build semi on my own, i was earning about 15k and the rent was around £350 a month, wasnt a problem at all for me to afford on my pretty crappy wage. this kind of rent as a proportion of income was the norm (midlands).

now wages have stagnated but rents have shot up. and its no longer the case you could rent a home like the one i describe above for that amount, similar homes are now around £800 a month, who could afford that on 15k? i fucking despair

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